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  1. War Wizard is offline
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    Senior Member

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    Posted On:
    2/12/2007 12:30am


     Style: Judo - Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by nezha
    Trying there lifts without training sounds like a bad idea to me, though if you're daring you might try learning this stuff from books.
    Or you can find a high school or college conditioning coach and have them work with you. The guy I found thought it was cool that some random guy wanted to learn the lifts so he taught me for free (although in lieu of direct payment, a case of beer can go a long way).
    "Keep a sharp knife, shiny boots and be on time."
  2. wackamole is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/12/2007 2:22am


     Style: etc

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    If you grapple it's awesome. Even (or perhaps especially) for a skinny guy like me , it's the only way to go. You get time efficient with your workouts b/c you are only doing a couple of exercises (squat/hang clean/ab work or high pull/bench/rows). For those of us that aren't professional athletes it lets us get stronger without cutting into technique/sparring time.
  3. LI GUY 1 is offline
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    GIJoe6186 like boys, mainly his brother

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    Posted On:
    2/12/2007 2:52am

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    A clean (full olympic style) is where you lift the weight from the floor and drop under it to catch it. However you catch the bar in the bottom of a front squat, and then squat it up.

    A "power" clean is the same as a full clean except the catch position is higher. Instead of catching in a full squat you catch in a quarter squat. At most you go down no more than paralell.
  4. PirateJon is offline
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    and good morning to you too

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    Posted On:
    2/12/2007 10:34am

    supporting member
     Style: MT/BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by LI GUY 1
    Olympic ifting is snatch and the clean and jerk. So training cleans, jerks, snatch are all part of Olympic lifting.

    Most people use the "power" version of these like "powercleans" and even "power snatches" as they give the same benefit but are a little easier to learn. This type of lifting is about speedstrength, explosive and fast.

    The mis-named power lifting is about absolute or limit strength(not power), you lift as much as you can in the squat, deadlift, and bench.

    In answer to your question I use the power lifting mentality (compound exercises and heavy lifting mostly, but there is a bit more to it). I made my goals in the big 3 a 495 dead, 405 squat, and 315 bench. Thats a1215 total which is pretty decent ayt 170lbs.

    Now that I am nearing those goals for my limit strength I am rotating in olympic work like powercleans and jerks. My goals are now to get a 275 and eventually a 315 powerclean and jerk. Again not bad stats in my weight class.

    I limit my goals in these to what I think are very good(but not excellent) numbers as my ultimate goal is not powerlifting or weightlifting, but I can use them to develop my MA ability. After these goals are met I can focus on mantaining these lifts and concentrate more on cardio, bodyweight exercises, and grip strength. Reason being after you hit a certain strength level the law of diminshing returns kicks in.

    A 1215 total will help a lot I believe in MA. Once I get that I could aim for a 1500 total, but that extra limit strength won't help me as much as working on my cardio or plyometrics can.
    Could this be the perfect answer? I say YES!
    You can't make people smarter. You can expose them to information, but your responsibility stops there.
  5. A.D.D is offline
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    Welterweight

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    Posted On:
    2/12/2007 2:44pm

    supporting member
     Style: Fish Oil

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Emevas
    Could someone verse me on the difference between a clean and a powerclean/other power olympic movements? If it's possible to execute them without serious olympic training, I'd be very intersted.
    http://www.uwlax.edu/strengthcenter/...ideo_index.htm

    This site has quite a few videos of olympic lifts and other types of lifts.
  6. Emevas is offline
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    Dysfunctionally Strong

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    Posted On:
    2/12/2007 4:33pm

    supporting member
     Style: Boxing/Wrestling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Much love.
    "Emevas,
    You're a scrapper, I like that."-Ronin69
  7. nezha is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/13/2007 12:25am


     Style: Boxing, Wushu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Hitman
    Or you can find a high school or college conditioning coach and have them work with you. The guy I found thought it was cool that some random guy wanted to learn the lifts so he taught me for free (although in lieu of direct payment, a case of beer can go a long way).
    I had assumed he had asked about training without a coach; obviously that would be the best solution.
  8. wackamole is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/13/2007 12:29am


     Style: etc

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    two books that are worth checking out:
    Strength and conditioning for the combative athlete: http://www.hoplology.com/shop.htm

    I've used this. It's based on Bulgarian weight lifting stuff, it also has a big chapter on plyometrics. The author is Hunter Armstrong , who trained with Donn Draeger. Draeger has
    It has everything you need (in terms of programs) to take yourself from no weight lifting all the way to advanced year round training programs. Armstrong has also worked as a consultant on the USMC Martial Arts program.

    Explosive Lifting for Sports , I haven't used, but it has some cool drills for working the O lifts.
    I've looked at it at the bookstore. It also has programs (I think) for wrestling.

    But I really, really recomend the IHS book. And the whole IHS website actually.
  9. Flash Jackson is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/13/2007 2:20am


     Style: Throwing, and Matwork

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    If you ask me, I'd learn how to clean and press with a keg or sandbag first, then kettlebell, then dumbells, then barbell, I think if you have no instructor and just videos and books, it'll be better that way, so you can slowly build up the wrist flexibility and technique. With sandbags, people don't usually get hurt all that often, since they have no preconceived notion of how much it weighs, and it's an object, not a bar, so they tend to lift based on their body type, instead of fucking it up bending over too much or whatever.

    These are dangerous lifts. You train bench press too much and you'll hurt your shoulders not balancing them out. You do a clean wrong and you'll pull something. If you want to stay safe, you can get great results with just high pulls, front squats, jerk style push presses, and overhead squats. No one said you couldn't get the best results from doing power curls either. Just flip that grip and curl from ground to chest, it's much easier to learn that way. If you insist on learning these lifts, look up Tommy Kono on youtube, he's got an O lift lecture on there, and look up I think episode 6 on fitcast, Dan John has a 50 minute lecture on teaching the olympic lifts(you can do it without a doctorate!). Also, look on www.danjohn.org and read his free books. He's got quite a lot to say on the subject. Happy lifting!
  10. LI GUY 1 is offline
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    GIJoe6186 like boys, mainly his brother

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    Posted On:
    2/13/2007 2:35am

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I have "Explosive Lifting for Sports" and it is a great book, if not to just give a good understanding of Olympic lifting and its technique/benefits. He also talks about the different kinds of strength and how to best achieve in each strength area.

    I started powercleaning a few days ago and am working on the form. I just got the hip pop today and can tell a drastic difference. Also, work front squats using the clean grip until you are flexible enough to use the clean grip easily. That way you don't mess up your wrist when you catch in a powerclean. There is much mre to it than just deadlifting it really fast and getting under. But a great movement so far.
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