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  1. oldone is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/12/2007 10:44am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: hapkido - TKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Am I nuts?

    I think I just wasted 6 years of my life. Years ago I had some lessons in isshinryu karate so when my kids wanted to sign up I didn't hesitate. It was a TKD school that threw in some other stuff from hapkido. After the first 6 months the master instructor conviced me to take lessons. So, do the math $115/person/month. Anyway, after a year and a half I became a "balckbelt" and a part time instructor. I had a great time. The kids liked me, The master instructor called me a friend. Life was good. The problem came around when the program director purchased part of the business from the owner. Her kid was the top student and a junior instructor assisting me and what ever other "instructor" they brought along. The kid started a close relationship with my kid and some stories came out about her getting beat by her father. She started cutting herself including an incident where another student removed a knife from her hand as she was cutting herself in the school. The program director started asking me for advice. The kid started asking me for advice and got my e-mail address from either the program director or my daughter. Then got my cell phone number and started texting me. I asked the program director to talk to her but that never amounted to anything. I did reply to a few of the text messages and 2 e-mails. With that the father tried to get me arrested for harrasing his kid and the program director threw me out. Did I get too involved? I told the police the entire story and I can only hope that the kid is getting help. This experience has put me off ALL martial arts and the schools. I have this nagging feeling of guilt and depression with sprinkles of fear mixed in as I've never been questioned by police in my 40 year life. Has anyone had similar experiences? Will I ever get rid of this horrible feeling I have? Will I ever have the courage to go to another school to continue something that I thought I enjoyed. I will never instruct again.
  2. Corvus is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/12/2007 11:29am


     Style: MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Dude - that was EXTREMELY painful to read. Paragraphs are your friend.

    Did you get too involved? Yes. You shouldn't have replied to the kid's texts and emails. You should have forwarded them to either the program director or the kid's father. If I found out a 40 year old was emailing my kid or text messaging them, I would have done the same thing.

    Get over it and get on with life. This isn't the end of the world and is most likely an isolated incident.
  3. markcos262 is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/12/2007 11:31am


     Style: bujinkan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I don't think you've got anything to feel guilty about.

    My brothers step-son had asked me to read him a story when he was eight or nine while I was sitting at the kitchen table. As I was reading to him he put his foot in my crotch, I immediately told him I didn't like him doing that and told him not to do that again.

    After I finished the story I told my brother what had happened, to my astonishment he just shrugged it off as "boyish behaviour" or something I didn't agree with him but left it at that it turned out later the boys father had been taking pictures of him with his brother in the bath.

    You told the authorities what had happened and hopefully some good will come of it, I wouldn't be blaming martial arts though it could've occured through choir practice or something.
  4. Epicurus is offline

    I'm grindin' 'till I'm tired...

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    Posted On:
    2/12/2007 11:34am


     Style: Judo. Some BJJ/Kickboxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Don't worry too much about it - this sounds like a case of a bad situation coming and finding you. You'd probably feel bad if you'd completely ignored the kid too, so don't beat yourself up - focus on moving forward.

    I wouldn't let this sour me on Martial arts, if I were you; this sounds like the kind of drama that can happen anywhere there are people (especially families). If you still enjoy martial arts, find a new school and keep training and put all this behind you.

    It WAS painful to read, but not because you didn't use paragraph breaks, because it reminded me of all the times I've seen people trying to do the right thing get into a big mess, including myself.

    Best of luck!
    "[Fighting for Points] is doubtless very pretty, and invariably draws applause, but preferences should always be given to blows that do some business, to good straight hits that do something toward finishing the fight.
    A man who has carefully trained for brilliant tapping play, will find himself considerably out of it in case he is called upon to do any real work."
    -A.J. Newton, Boxing.
  5. Judomofo is offline
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    Posted On:
    2/12/2007 12:01pm


     Style: MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Man I have to be the dick and do this first for my own comedic purposes don't I? Ok, I promise afterwards to have something constructive to say... after all this is YMAS..


    I think I just wasted 6 years of my life.
    Many practitioners of TKD and Hapkido feel this way....

    It was a TKD school that threw in some other stuff from hapkido. After the first 6 months the master instructor conviced me to take lessons. So, do the math $115/person/month. Anyway, after a year and a half I became a "balckbelt" and a part time instructor
    Look up threads that have "McDojo" listed in them, yes you definately wasted a lot of time and money. It is probably far better you are not part of that school anymore... (A year and a half for black belt is ri-damn-diculous) 115 per person per month? How many kids do you have? You got conned there my friend... but I digress...

    The kid started a close relationship with my kid and some stories came out about her getting beat by her father. She started cutting herself including an incident where another student removed a knife from her hand as she was cutting herself in the school. The program director started asking me for advice. The
    This is a common behavior of a disturbed child. There are professionals that handle this sort of thing and they are the ones that it should have been directed too. If the parents are unwilling to seek that, as a instructor (if caring for the well being of your younger students) you should have sought the help of the authorities or HRS/DCF/ etc... especially if it has gotten to the point she is carrying a knife around other students (danger to herself and others).

    Your mistake was not letting the right people get involved. Unless you are a trained psychiatric professional and licensed for such, your advice should have been to seek the help of a professional.

    I asked the program director to talk to her but that never amounted to anything. I did reply to a few of the text messages and 2 e-mails. With that the father tried to get me arrested for harrasing his kid and the program director threw me out. Did I get too involved?
    Yes you got too involved. I understand wanting to be a good guy and help out, but this **** was over your head. (Btw, many children from well off parents go to great lengths for attention/drama the theory is that they get many other things handed to them, sometimes they want chaos)

    So the same father that supposedly abused her? (may or may not be true, I have dealt with these type of kids before).

    This experience has put me off ALL martial arts and the schools.
    Understandable, but this isn't indicative of martial arts. Summer camp counselors and the like fall victim to this sort of thing, so it should not discourage you, it was a bad rap it happens.


    I have this nagging feeling of guilt and depression with sprinkles of fear mixed in as I've never been questioned by police in my 40 year life.
    Get over this, I know it is easier said then done. But first off cops have a good B.S. detector, if they felt you did something wrong you would already have been arrested. Second off, getting questioned by the police isn't anything to be ashamed about, in fact it may actually help this girl out.

    Guild and depression? Seriously what did you do wrong? You tried to do the right thing, chances are you were the unwilling victim of a teenage girl's attempt at drama and chaos. It happens, you may have been manipulated in some form.

    Unless you went around emailing her pics of your cock, or telling her you love her or something inappropriate you really don't have anything to "feel guilty" about. (Except for getting the authorities involved earlier) But she's not dead, and now that the cops are involved it will get sorted out for her betterment anyway.

    Has anyone had similar experiences? Will I ever get rid of this horrible feeling I have? Will I ever have the courage to go to another school to continue something that I thought I enjoyed. I will never instruct again.
    I am a Big Brother, I have come across this type of behavior before, I also work for a government agency that deals with this (though of course do not speak for them) and have coached for 8 years or so. Getting rid of this horrible feeling is up to you, you don't have a damn thing to feel horrible about. Perhaps seek the help of a professional if it has rattled you this much.

    If it is something you enjoy then why should you stay away? Again, you didn't do anything inapropriate (from your version of the story).

    For getting a black belt in a year and a half, and only practicing for 6 years, I don't think you should be an instructor period lol. But that is my bias.

    This was just a fucked up little girl, as long as you were appropriate and tried to help, why should you feel so guilty? She didn't die, it's not like you saw this behavior and sat idly by and she ended up dead.

    You tried to help (this was a mistake but understandable, you were not qualified to help), part of being a man is being able to accept mistakes and also understanding when things are outside of your control or abilities.

    If a man lay on the ground with a gaping ass chest wound, wouldn't you call an ambulance or would you attempt to fix the problem yourself?

    (probably some of both)

    But the point is, it was a mistake it has happened to a lot of people who innocently try to help where they are unqualified to do so.

    Let it go, find a new school and learn from your mistake.
  6. PirateJon is offline
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    and good morning to you too

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    Posted On:
    2/12/2007 12:12pm

    supporting member
     Style: MT/BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by oldone
    I have this nagging feeling of guilt and depression with sprinkles of fear mixed in as I've never been questioned by police in my 40 year life.
    Sounds like someone tried to play "hide the bokken" with sensi's daughter.
    You can't make people smarter. You can expose them to information, but your responsibility stops there.
  7. Lucky Seven is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/12/2007 12:41pm


     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I can't see what that has to do with MA practice, you bumped into a troubled child and it just hapened it was in a MA context, its sad for her but life goes on.

    As to you wasting 6 years of your life, well it looks to me you had a good time and probably made some friends, of course that can mean nothing depending on your goals while practicing martial arts, if you want to be a decent fighter its not too late.
  8. oldone is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/12/2007 1:11pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: hapkido - TKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Thanks.
    I apologise for the rant and poor paragraphing. I guess I'm just angry. Angry at myself for getting too involved. Angry at myself for not getting qualified persons involved. My mistake - learn from it.

    As for the jokes; keep 'em coming. I should have known better to associate with a TKD McDojo called "Karate America" Their tag phrase is "Where every familiy is special."

    The more I read here, the more I realize that I became part of the BS in martial arts. I should find out what I want from martial arts and start over. Know any good schools in central New Jersey?

    Thanks again.
  9. meggaman7 is offline
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    Posted On:
    2/12/2007 8:36pm


     Style: Boxing, MMA/MT/BJJ n00b

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Well that'll teach you to try and help anyone ever again. Seriously though you shouldn't let something like that put you off MA forever. It's not exactly like the situation that you got in is extreamly common anyway.
  10. FUNKtastic is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/12/2007 11:29pm


     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Your heart was in the right place man, you wanted to help the kid out and you complied with authorities in the end. Given your relationship with the kid (or lack thereof) maybe you shouldnt have gotten as involved and just reported it to child services or the police but hey, you're only human.

    If it was someone closer to you beating on their kid for no reason I suggest my old man's pedogogical approach; kick the tough guy in the teeth for good measure. =)
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