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  1. Omega Supreme is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/21/2007 1:07pm

    staff
     Style: Chinese Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by El-Wood
    Well D'uH! It's even easier to BS people when you are charging them lots of money so they think what they are paying for is some valuable eastern secret.

    Now please provide exact quotes and examples of where he is making claims and not fulfilling them and I will be more then happy to say he is full of Bullshido - until then he is running a very expensive McDojo - not Bullshidoing anyone... Now that I think of it we have not even substantiated that he is charging $300 a month (or for that matter what he is charging a month).

    ....Well, ****, I took a second to re read the first post. Yeah Courage Bullshido and Mcdojo are two totally different things. I got pre occupied on the dislike I have for Oliver. I can't stand his demeanor or attitude, reminds me of a used car sales man.

    On that note, listen guys if you don't believe what Oliver charges and you want proof, call his fucking ass. He'll tell you point blank. "Get a copy of a bill" indeed, no fucking need, he charges more and is proud of it. I have no problem if a guy charges more and people want to pay it what pisses me off is the blatant disregard of his students, he sees them only as means to an end. How rich can they get me, and he views other instructors this way too, how do you think he makes all that money. He uses the old scape goat "hey I only teach them to run a business not what they teach". Can you imagine a College, or a Trade School thinking the exact same way? What do we think of these schools? Laughable and that all this is. Is he doing anything wrong, technically no, morally yes. Compromise your scruples (how the heck do you spell that anyway?). This guys is the "I made money on realestate you can too..."....

    Now I've got to go punch somebody....
  2. Omega Supreme is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/21/2007 1:10pm

    staff
     Style: Chinese Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Courage
    They are a big fan of long term contracts. I went with the shortest one available which was 12 months. I can't provide any bill scans. With the exception of claiming self-defense training, they are selling exactly what they say. If you are interested in how a class runs, I could take a sample from the curiculum on the website and break down how it would work out.
    Don't bother Courage, any member here can get this information. I'm telling you just call them. They're more than happy to share. Quick fix America I swear.
  3. Sir Ocelot is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/21/2007 2:09pm


     Style: WMA (various)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by botunga
    It appears Oliver is running a home-based business from a P.O. Box, with several schools licensing his "system" under the name Mile High Karate. It does not appear he even has a school anymore.
    That would be consistent with the article Courage originally posted about. Reading it makes clear that Oliver doesn't want to be a teacher of martial arts; he says, for instance, that "for most it's vitally important to mentally and physically move away from being the doer of the activity of your business as rapidly as possible" (p. 217) and that "it's the person who can implement systems that can be taught to many and inspire them to high accomplishment whose income has an unlimited ceiling" (p. 219). He doesn't want to teach martial arts; he doesn't even want to teach martial arts teachers, really. That's too low in the hierarchy. He'd rather be running a franchise and teaching the location owners how they themselves can churn out instructors in six weeks.

    Material from the end of p. 219 onward makes it clear what the real intention of the article is, as he starts talking about his own franchise system and throws out the question, "Who am I looking for to grow my organization?" His real purpose here isn't giving advice to budding entrepreneurs; he does that, but it's only a means to an end, to make it look like he knows his market and can make you rich if you run a franchise location for him. The whole essay is ultimately a recruiting tool aimed at gathering more McDojo operators for his organization.
  4. botunga is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/21/2007 2:12pm


     Style: MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Courage
    Have I seen $300 a month bills? Yeah, I used to pay them and for that you get . . . 2-4 group classes weekly plus a 1 leadership session where they get a chance to brainwash you into the fold.
    Just to clarify, is this $300 for just you alone, or is that for you and your family?
  5. Courage is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/21/2007 5:23pm


     Style: Tactical, Kempo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    $300 just for me.
    Last edited by Courage; 1/21/2007 5:55pm at .
  6. botunga is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/21/2007 5:50pm


     Style: MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Courage
    Uno mi amigo.
    Sorry, I only speak English.
  7. El-Wood is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/21/2007 7:20pm


     Style: Kyokushin

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Sir Ocelot
    That would be consistent with the article Courage originally posted about. Reading it makes clear that Oliver doesn't want to be a teacher of martial arts; he says, for instance, that "for most it's vitally important to mentally and physically move away from being the doer of the activity of your business as rapidly as possible" (p. 217) and that "it's the person who can implement systems that can be taught to many and inspire them to high accomplishment whose income has an unlimited ceiling" (p. 219). He doesn't want to teach martial arts; he doesn't even want to teach martial arts teachers, really. That's too low in the hierarchy. He'd rather be running a franchise and teaching the location owners how they themselves can churn out instructors in six weeks.

    Material from the end of p. 219 onward makes it clear what the real intention of the article is, as he starts talking about his own franchise system and throws out the question, "Who am I looking for to grow my organization?" His real purpose here isn't giving advice to budding entrepreneurs; he does that, but it's only a means to an end, to make it look like he knows his market and can make you rich if you run a franchise location for him. The whole essay is ultimately a recruiting tool aimed at gathering more McDojo operators for his organization.
    Is this something new or is this a continuing trend?

    The reason I ask is, I was sitting in front of a group of TKD dojang owners who were going to Korea (flight stopped at Narita where me and the family made our departure) from I think Dallas. They were discussing their franchise system and how much some of the guys who had multiple franchises under them were making - apparently there was one guy who had a particularly good area who was pulling in $30k a month gross from one of his schools...

    Besides, like most teaching businesses, it's not the teachers who make the money it's the school owner...
  8. colonelpong2 is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/21/2007 9:02pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Kickboxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Thatr website..... shudder.... the very personification of McDojoism itself...
  9. botunga is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/22/2007 8:30am


     Style: MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Courage
    $300 just for me.
    Wow. That is some serious coin for intruction from 6 week wonder instructor. Did you learn anything there, besides that it was a rip off? I can see where you would feel taken advantage of.
  10. Sam Browning is online now

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    Posted On:
    1/22/2007 12:50pm

    hall of famestaff
     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Is this a six week instructor program after you have received a certain rank in the art. (brown belt or black belt) or six weeks for people who don't have this background.
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