223771 Bullies, 3796 online  
  • Register
Our Sponsors:

Results 11 to 20 of 78
Page 2 of 8 FirstFirst 12 3456 ... LastLast
Sponsored Links Spacer Image
  1. datdamnmachine is offline
    datdamnmachine's Avatar

    Jiu Jitsu - Sometimes passing just isn't an option.

    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Washington State
    Posts
    1,721

    Posted On:
    1/18/2007 10:39pm

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ, Unauthorized Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I concede your point, very valid. I feel that as long as you understand what is useful for a given situation and what may be...not so useful you will be ok. But I'll tell you one thing, I wouldn't want to be in upside-down guard under Pride's rules. Then again, I'm sure Ryan could probably make the most of that situation since it seems to be his "thing". Hell, I wouldn't want to be in guard with MMA rules in the states, elbows and all. Well, maybe after perfecting my rubber guard a little bit more.
  2. Cassius is offline
    Cassius's Avatar

    Moderator

    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    6,978

    Posted On:
    1/18/2007 11:00pm

    supporting memberforum leader
     Style: Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I understand your feelings, but it irks me when people assume that Hall would play his upside down guard in a real fight, or that Eduardo Telles really plans on fighting in the UFC using only his Turtle Guard, or that Shinya Aoki plans on using gogoplatas in Pride (HINT: I AM MAKING TWO OR THREE SEPARATE YET EQUALLY VALID POINTS BY INCLUDING AOKI).
    "No. Listen to me because I know what I'm talking about here." -- Hannibal
  3. jnp is offline
    jnp's Avatar

    Titanium laced beauty

    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Austin, TX
    Posts
    8,226

    Posted On:
    1/18/2007 11:19pm

    supporting memberforum leaderstaff
     Style: BJJ, wrestling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    When training in BJJ only with the gi, I tend to favor some rather sportive techniques. When training in no-gi or MMA, I don't.

    If you mix jits with hits the vulnerabilities of the more sport oriented techniques become quickly apparent.
    Shut the hell up and train.
  4. Cassius is offline
    Cassius's Avatar

    Moderator

    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    6,978

    Posted On:
    1/18/2007 11:23pm

    supporting memberforum leader
     Style: Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    No way, you're a purple belt that doesn't compete professionally in MMA, you're supposed to have completely lost touch with reality.
    "No. Listen to me because I know what I'm talking about here." -- Hannibal
  5. MONGO is offline

    Middleweight

    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    1,187

    Posted On:
    1/19/2007 12:13am

    supporting member
     Style: na

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Basically the simple techniques don't get used because well trained opponents see them coming a mile away.

    To continue on this argument, everytime a Ninjer or Larper says "my stuff won't win tourneys but I can fight on the streetz" I wanna add, "I hope you aren't fighting me on the streetz cause you gonna get raped".

    Wouldn't it behoove everyone to be well rounded in all areas, sportive and basic techniques. Gearing stuff to the lowest common denominator inhibits development of noteworthy skill. Plus, its fucking boring.

    And yes, after Aoki Shinya (Paraestra by the way, bitches) gogoplataed someone in MMA, we can all see the sportive moves can be money in a fight. That is, if you are a badass competitor like Aoki.

    I have never heard anywhere in Japan (outside of the Larptastic BJK) talk about Self Defense. I think that it is a given that if you can **** up a trained person, you can win even easier against a untrained dickhead.

    And Ryan Hall's upside down guard may be funky but his wrist control is good and his triangle is deadly. He could easily use that in a fight with someone that is relying on pounding his way out of the grapple. It happens in MMA, guys try to pound and slam out of triangles all the time but they end up taking a nap or tapping out.
    Last edited by MONGO; 1/19/2007 12:21am at .
  6. Pandinha is offline

    Administrator

    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    San Diego
    Posts
    8,751

    Posted On:
    1/19/2007 12:25am

    supporting memberhall of famestaff
     Style: Muay Thai & BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    My BJJ Coach is one of the last 2 given his black belt by Carlson Gracie.

    His BJJ is all about fighting, and not sport, though he's done well in both.
  7. Cassius is offline
    Cassius's Avatar

    Moderator

    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    6,978

    Posted On:
    1/19/2007 12:36am

    supporting memberforum leader
     Style: Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Good work Coach.
    "No. Listen to me because I know what I'm talking about here." -- Hannibal
  8. Anna Kovacs is offline
    Anna Kovacs's Avatar

    Spear Sister

    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    Las Vegas, NV
    Posts
    6,421

    Posted On:
    1/19/2007 12:44am

    supporting membersupporting member
     Style: Dancing the Spears

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by MONGO
    It happens in MMA, guys try to pound and slam out of triangles all the time but they end up taking a nap or tapping out.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dgx9p0bTqVc
  9. Spezza is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    137

    Posted On:
    1/19/2007 1:35am


     Style: Escrima

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    The point is not mine, it was Carlson's. I am just sharing it because it is indicative a certain minset that some BJJ'ers have. I suppose whether you agree with Carlson or not depends on what YOU think BJJ is.

    If people want their BJJ to be sport focused , MMA focused, Self-defense focused or anything else --more power to them. BJJ is/can be different things to different people.

    Mongo's argument that "the simple techniques don't get used because well trained opponents see them coming a mile away. " I don't agree with at all. Some people's basics are so good there is nothing you can do to stop them.

    IF "simple didn't work" then the Jab-Cross would have been extinct from boxing a long time ago.

    "Simple" not only works, it works well if you have put time into it. But "slick/sneaky" can work well too; in fact all games CAN work in BJJ. It just depends.

    So Garbanzo Bean, you have no respect for the BJJ teachings of Carlson & Caique? I guess there is nothing to say then. :rolleyes:
    Last edited by Spezza; 1/19/2007 1:43am at .
  10. Cassius is offline
    Cassius's Avatar

    Moderator

    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Posts
    6,978

    Posted On:
    1/19/2007 1:45am

    supporting memberforum leader
     Style: Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by The Villain
    The original poster has a point. The supremacy of BJJ is based on its effectivity and practicality. Some moves blur the line and we do see performances like BJ Penn vs Matt Hughes, but we also get swarms of blue belts in beginner and novive no gi divisions (see it every tourney) because they simply can't grapple without their latest gimmick. Thats not even factoring strikes in. And as far as BJJs dominance on the street goes, Royce and Rickson have had trouble with large brawlers before. That being the case, its not ridiculous to train BJJ that actually works.
    All good points, but:

    1.) BJJ can be practical AND have a sporting aspect. The PATRIARCHS seem uncomfortable with it, but it sure as **** hasn't hurt anything at high levels. As for the lower levels, see my next point.

    2.) Sandbagging is not something you can blame on gimmicky moves. It's something you can blame on people being douchebags that would rather win than be challenged. Besides, there are plenty of gimmicky no-gi moves to go with their gimmicky gi cousins.

    3.) I hope no one on this thread is implying that BJJ is the ultimate in street defense. It is, however, apparently pretty good. That is not a reason to turn it into RBSD. The Gracies' idea of a "street fight" back when they were making names for themselves was a lot more controlled than most situations tend to be.

    I say do what you want with BJJ, just don't expect grappling tournament rules to protect you when someone's punching your face in. I don't, and I'll be the first to admit that I could give a **** about using BJJ for self defense. I think anyone that actually puts thought into what they train (and that's probably not a lot of people at the blue and below level for BJJ) is aware of their particular sport's (Martial Art) limitations. If not, well, not my problem.

    Somehow, even with all that, I walk around feeling confident that I can take care of myself in a bad situation. I even sleep soundly at night. Crazy, huh?
    "No. Listen to me because I know what I'm talking about here." -- Hannibal
Page 2 of 8 FirstFirst 12 3456 ... LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Powered by vBulletin™© contact@vbulletin.com vBulletin Solutions, Inc. 2011 All rights reserved.