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  1. Plasma is offline
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    Heel Hook Hunter

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    Posted On:
    1/14/2007 6:24pm

    supporting memberforum leaderstaff
     Style: Jiu Jitsu | Knife

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Shamash
    I just find it odd that his website specificially lists Iaido on several locations with no mention of Shinkage ryu. This may just be my vast ignorance speaking, but I was under the assumption that Iaido and kenjutsu were to totally different martial arts. I mean isn't Iaido mainly drawing the sword from a seated position? If he is a legit shinkage ryu teacher then why put Iaido on the website?

    Considering his email failed to answer any of my questions, I don't think asking him anything else would be fruitful. I've done a little research on his kenpo lineage, and from what I've found its legit. At this point I'm gonna assume Mr. Green is a decent kenpoist who may have padded his sword resume and/or have a japanese weapon fetish.

    Kenjutsu claims aside, I wonder how this man also learned kyudo. Cookeville, as well as Tennessee, isn't exactly the epti-center of Japanese martial arts.
    Let me explain it this way. Kenjutsu is the very generic name for any japanese sword art. Iaido is reference to (primary modern) sword drawing arts. Now I agree it is fishy, however, many schools of Shinkage Ryu use the term Battojutsu to describe their sword arts. Batto and Iai basically mean the same thing (drawing the sword). However, even though I've NEVER seen a Shinkage Ryu schools use the term Iaido.

    As you said, Tennessee is not a mecca of Japanese Bujutsu. Therefore, it a probable he mashed a few words together that don't belong. These could be either because he doesn't know any better, in this case where did he learn Iaido or Shinkage Ryu?, or he is a legit Shinkage Ryu instructor that is lure students with more generic names (for example I see Dakenjutsu school marketed as Karatejutsu because of name recognation. The former just be an older name for the latter.)
  2. OnceLost is offline
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    Here's looking at you, squid.

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    Posted On:
    1/14/2007 8:18pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Ke?po, MMA ultra-newb

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Correct if I'm wrong here, but iaido involves drawing the sword, making a cut, stripping the blood, and returning the sword to the scabbard, all in slightly ritualized fashion, doesn't it?
    "Reason is a choice. Wishes and whims are not facts, nor are they a means to discovering them. Reason is our only way to grasping reality -- it's our basic tool of survival. We are free to evade the effort of thinking, to reject reason, but we are not free to avoid the penalty of the abyss we refuse to see."
    - Terry Goodkind, "Faith of the Fallen"
  3. Plasma is offline
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    Heel Hook Hunter

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    Posted On:
    1/14/2007 9:03pm

    supporting memberforum leaderstaff
     Style: Jiu Jitsu | Knife

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by OnceLost
    Correct if I'm wrong here, but iaido involves drawing the sword, making a cut, stripping the blood, and returning the sword to the scabbard, all in slightly ritualized fashion, doesn't it?

    Correct.
  4. Iscariot is offline

    I decided I'd have a pretty avatar for a while.

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    Posted On:
    1/14/2007 9:06pm


     Style: Student Jutsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Listen to teh pl4zM4.

    He should have been on the list I posted.
    "Listen to Iscariot you Vicchysoise ninja-fuckers!" - kohadril
    "Are you going to rise to godhood out of the ashes of Earth? " - frumpleswift
    "I'll pray for you Iscariot." - Mas
    "Iscariot, check your pulse and report back. We need to know if you are in fact, not alive." - Lu Tzu
    "Iscariot is victorious!" - Dai Tenshi
    "More God delusions." - DAYoung
    "Iscariot, despite our obvious doctrinal differences, I salute your exquisite bastardry, and take back half of all the bad things I ever said about you." - Zendetta
  5. Bobamelius is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/18/2007 12:51pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: None currently

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Has anyone found out more about this place yet? I'm going to college in Cookeville here in a few months and I was considering going there, but seeing this thread concerns me somewhat. Should I look for another place perhaps?
  6. ronrawhoof is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/14/2007 1:48pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: kenpo a

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    well,

    I, for one, am extremely offended. Sensei Green is one of the most humble, integrous man that I have ever had the opportunity to meet. His dojo is no BS. Sparring is full contact, and accidents happen. None of the don't touch your opponent in class because of...blah blah blah. It's all about Kenpo and Aikido.

    You people that are calling out the BS have yet to witness him, a sixty year old man with a back injury toss me across the dojo. I'm 6'2" and weigh in at 265 lbs of muscle. I'm an amature body builder as well...so go ahead and call out the BS, but if you really want to know the truth...come to class and see for yourself.
  7. Iscariot is offline

    I decided I'd have a pretty avatar for a while.

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    Posted On:
    4/14/2007 3:03pm


     Style: Student Jutsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by ronrawhoof
    well,
    Welcome to Bullshido.

    I, for one, am extremely offended.
    That's great and all, but no-one round here will really care. You should look over a few of our investigation threads. Bullshido works on proof, not psuedo-respect that is apparently owed due to grade. If you have proof to refute what we have written, please present it.

    Sensei Green is one of the most humble, integrous man that I have ever had the opportunity to meet.
    I re-read the thread, at no point was his character called into question.

    His dojo is no BS.
    That remains to be seen.

    Sparring is full contact, and accidents happen. None of the don't touch your opponent in class because of...blah blah blah.
    That's great. We at Bullshido believe that all classes should involve sparring according to Matt Thornton's 'Aliveness' principle. Google it if you are unfamiliar with it, it's always a good thing for a martial artist to look over.

    It's all about Kenpo and Aikido.
    That's great, why then does your site mention Kyudo and Iaido? If you'll notice all the questions have been about the Iai.

    You people that are calling out the BS have yet to witness him, a sixty year old man with a back injury toss me across the dojo. I'm 6'2" and weigh in at 265 lbs of muscle. I'm an amature body builder as well...so go ahead and call out the BS, but if you really want to know the truth...come to class and see for yourself.
    He can toss you? Across a dojo no less? Jokes aside I don't remember ever questioning this man's unarmed abilties, the questions have been on his sword skills.

    You say we have not seen him, but we have. The pictures on his site show him performing sword maintainance in a foolish and unsafe way, this direct evidence caused questions to be asked.

    My own post 20 pointed Shamash in the right direction questions-wise. To recap, the post was:
    Quote Originally Posted by Me
    What Mr TD and Plasma said so far about the sword.

    Drop him an email and ask for the following:
    His current grade in Iaido.
    His instructor.
    How long he's been studying.
    What koryu he studies.
    What organisation issued his Iai grade.

    If it's legit this will be a piece of piss to check. From what I can see though, it's another case of Sword Syndrome.
    Shamash sent an email, and only one question was asked, and in a very vague way. We were informed that the Koryu was Shinkage Ryu.

    Plasma (now under the username NinJew) then furthered the required questions with his own knowledge of Shinkage Ryu:
    Quote Originally Posted by Plasma
    The key question to ask here are

    "Who licensed him to teach Shinkage Ryu?"

    "What is his license?" The answer to this would be a Menkyo (licenses) not a rank like 5th dan.

    "What organization of Shinkage Ryu does he belong too"?

    "Who is the grandmaster of Shinkage Ryu (there are a few lineages)"?
    Notice that the questions have all been directed towards his sword art?

    Now that you are here, perhaps you can answer the questions directly. The ones' in need of answers are:
    What is his current grade in Iaido?
    What is the name of his instructor?
    How long has he been studying Iaido?
    Which organisation issued his Iaido grade?
    Who licensed him to teach Shinkage Ryu?
    What license does he hold?
    Which organisation/branch of Shinkage Ryu does he belong to?
    Who is the grandmaster of Shinkage Ryu?

    8 questions. It's that simple, answer 8 questions and the record will be cleared, and the evidence left up here on Bullshido forever incase anyone questions him again. Please note, these answers will be checked, the sword community is actually very small and many practitioners post on this board, myself and Plasma included.

    In case you are wondering, the reason we ask these questions about only his sword skills is because these qualifications are continually 'in vogue' for fakers and frauds to claim. They think that because most of the arts are small that people will not, or will be unable to check up on them. This is not to say that your instructor is faking, defrauding or misrepresenting his qualifications. Real qualified instructors never have a problem verifying their credentials or experience. Hopefully you'll be able to do this for your instructor and put the record straight.
    "Listen to Iscariot you Vicchysoise ninja-fuckers!" - kohadril
    "Are you going to rise to godhood out of the ashes of Earth? " - frumpleswift
    "I'll pray for you Iscariot." - Mas
    "Iscariot, check your pulse and report back. We need to know if you are in fact, not alive." - Lu Tzu
    "Iscariot is victorious!" - Dai Tenshi
    "More God delusions." - DAYoung
    "Iscariot, despite our obvious doctrinal differences, I salute your exquisite bastardry, and take back half of all the bad things I ever said about you." - Zendetta
  8. sochin101 is offline
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    Graviora Manent

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    Posted On:
    4/14/2007 3:19pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: No gym currently.

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    ronrawhoof,
    Welcome to Bullshido.
    I urge you to at least ask your instructor Iscariot's questions, even if you don't intend to post the answers.
    If you don't get satisfactory, clear answers to any of the questions, please ask yourself if you should be within 50yds of a guy who may not be A)qualified to wield a sword B)insured to teach.
    You also might like to read the essay in this post (bearing in mind the safety issue a couple of the sword guys here mentioned).
    WARNING: Graphic images of the aftermath of someone misusing a sword.
    http://www.bullshido.net/forums/show...8&postcount=80
  9. Iscariot is offline

    I decided I'd have a pretty avatar for a while.

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    Posted On:
    4/14/2007 3:25pm


     Style: Student Jutsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Oh, and I forgot to mention:

    The thread states from the beginning that Shamash is unsure as to whether the guy he refers to as Mr. PK, who breaks arms and stabs intruders with sai, is your instructor or not. He only found your site because it came up from similar search parameters.

    Later in the thread he clearly states that he has shown your site to his brother who has a better memory of the Mr. PK meeting and that your club and instructor are definitely not the people in question. If this is why you are offended then this has already been cleared up in the thread. The story of arm breaking and sai stabbing has absolutely nothing to do with your club or instructor.

    This does not invalidate the questions raised about your instructor in the thread though.
    "Listen to Iscariot you Vicchysoise ninja-fuckers!" - kohadril
    "Are you going to rise to godhood out of the ashes of Earth? " - frumpleswift
    "I'll pray for you Iscariot." - Mas
    "Iscariot, check your pulse and report back. We need to know if you are in fact, not alive." - Lu Tzu
    "Iscariot is victorious!" - Dai Tenshi
    "More God delusions." - DAYoung
    "Iscariot, despite our obvious doctrinal differences, I salute your exquisite bastardry, and take back half of all the bad things I ever said about you." - Zendetta
  10. Shamash is offline

    Registered Member

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    Posted On:
    4/14/2007 3:34pm


     Style: ex-Tae Kwon Do

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by ronrawhoof
    well,

    I, for one, am extremely offended. Sensei Green is one of the most humble, integrous man that I have ever had the opportunity to meet. His dojo is no BS. Sparring is full contact, and accidents happen. None of the don't touch your opponent in class because of...blah blah blah. It's all about Kenpo and Aikido.

    You people that are calling out the BS have yet to witness him, a sixty year old man with a back injury toss me across the dojo. I'm 6'2" and weigh in at 265 lbs of muscle. I'm an amature body builder as well...so go ahead and call out the BS, but if you really want to know the truth...come to class and see for yourself.
    So in other words, you are upset because people on this board wondered where a man living in Tennessee learned all his exotic arts. You mention kenpo and aikido yet no where in this thread did anyone acuse him of faking those arts. This thread was regarding his claims regarding Japanese sword arts as well as archery. Just tell us who your Sensei learned Shinkage Ryu and Kyudo from. I don't think an inquiry regarding qualifications is something to be "extremely offended" by.

    If you find your training satisfactory, then good for you. If your dojo is as hardcore as you say, then you should be mature enough not to become upset when someone wonders how your sensei mastered two rare arts especially in Tn.

    Also just to let you know, you weighing 265 lbs of muscle in no way addressed the questions being asked. Its just silly and demonstrates an irrational desire to come across as an internet badass.
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