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  1. sambosteve is online now
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    Stillness is death

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    Posted On:
    1/11/2007 3:16pm

    Business Class Supporting Member
     NY Combat Sambo Style: combat sambo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Another reply to my inquiry about Perry:

    He was a member of the USA team at the '98 Worlds in Kalingrad. I have the videos from that tournament, and he was in the video.
  2. Omega Supreme is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/11/2007 3:21pm

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     Style: Chinese Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Samuel Browning
    PM Omega and ask him about whether this guy's Sambo belt is legit. That would be the easiest thing to trace.
    Quote Originally Posted by datdamnmachine
    PM sent, thanks.
    Which I forwarded to:

    Quote Originally Posted by sambosteve
    His website smells of massive ego...

    I have heard his name before, but do not know him persoanlly. I put out some feelers on him but, here is my assessment based on what little info there is on his site and on the net...

    The logo on his track suit in one of his pics is the USSA logo (US Sombo Association). This means he most likely was involved with them is some fashion. Based on the bio I found, he was with them back before the USSA split, along with FIAS in 1993.

    Regarding his "Black Belt" in sambo. They don't really exist in any universally accepted fashion. And, back during the years he is talking about, the only person awarding them was the Densberger - now known a s a complete criminal (though very talented sambist)...his old association (world sambo federation) is now defunct. But, that is another long story not relevant here. In any event, based on Perry's claimed dates of participation, he may have been awarded a "black Belt" from Densberger.

    I found a more detailed bio here of Perry:
    http://www.usadojo.com/biographies/jody-perry.htm

    If this is all true, his sambo credentials are pretty good and he was active back before much of the sambo politics and splits took root in 1993. Back then most sambo players were converted wrestlers as he claims he was. Very few people had access to sambo the style, as taught by the Russian coaches because of the cold war. So, most US sambists were wrestlers or judoka who simply learned the sport sambo rules so they could compete.

    Having said that, I have not seen him at any national sambo events in the last 4 years and I have been to most of them (on both sides of the political fence).

    He may be a good coach, but his blatant self promotion would turn me off - legit or not.
    Which is pretty what I was going to say. I veered away from the politics ages ago. Anybody who ask me if I have a Blackbelt in SAMBO I say 'sure'. I was awarded a 3rd degree black a few years back which always confounded me because I found out a few years before that how belts and ranks were actually done.
  3. Omega Supreme is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/11/2007 3:42pm

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     Style: Chinese Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by sambosteve
    I am curious about this guy as well. I just heard back from my friend who has been involved in sambo for many years and he has never heard of Perry. This does not mean Perry is a fraud, but, it sure is funny because my friend [I did not ask him if I could post his name] pretty much knows or has heard of everyone. Here is a portion of his reply to me...



    Regarding ranking, historically in sambo the only title one got was from competition wins. There was no ranking or color belt system like Asian based arts have. It was more akin to wrestling, baseball, or any other sport where you just trained and competed. No moral code, bushido, anything like that. Now FIAS is trying to institute a color system but people are not responding well. Historically ratings were given based on wins - or coaching skill only as well. They were "Candidate for Master of Sport", "Master of Sport", "Honored Master of Sport", etc. These were broken down into 3rd, 2nd, 1st, international class, ect.

    In regard to combat sambo, the competative version only came about in 2000 so, anyone claiming "master of sport in combat sambo" before 2000 is BS (at least if they claim a FIAS Rating). The system existed (since before sport sambo) and people fought, but FIAS only sanctioned it as an international sport in 2000. Back in the early 90's there were some "Combat Sambo" events run by the WSF here in the US, but that was not really combat sambo, just submission wrestling with the jacket on. They just billed it as Combat Sambo. This is how Lloyd Irvin got the "Combat Sambo" title he lists in his bio. There was no striking involved and it is very misleading.

    Some coaches and clubs do give in-house ranks for the measurement of their own students, but that is all they are - in house, not universal ranks. For example, My coach gave me an in house "Master" rank and a black belt, but it does not mean anything outside of our circle. I am still judged by the community based on what I do (though my liniage helps if my coach is respected). I don't really advertise my in-house rank. I just call myself "Head Coach" of my club. You won't find too many Americans with Master of Sport ranks from the last 10 - 15 years or so because after 1993, there was declining opportunity to compete on the international stage or even here in the US. Since I started sambo there was very little opportunity to compete in any significant way. Now there is more over the past 2 years or so. So, the in house ranks have become more important in the US to some degree. Also, other countries, like France for example, have national standards for martial arts and do set a curriculum for black belt. So, if a French guy says he has one, it is different than here.

    Regarding the old WSF started by Densberger (and Pordash too I think - another criminal), they did set a curriculum and give ranks/color belts, but that was very new. That group is now defunct and many people won't even admit to having this ranking because they don't want to link to Densberger.

    A few other groups do offer ranks.

    I have an in-house system in my club.

    Vlad Koulikov has a ranking system in his club which he has offered to other clubs who wish to use it. Obviously Vlad is very legit. Again though, his ranking system is his ond really only carries weight as much as people respect him.

    There is some distance learning guy - Rich Rowland - out there who sells ranks and I had done lots of checking up on him...total fraud. Nobody knows this guy. I even contacted them and got his "partner" who gave me some names of coached Rowland trained under - nobody ever heard of them either. Complete BS. http://renzokujiujitsu.tripod.com/blackbelt/id41.html

    Lance Campbell offers ranks through USA Storm - But, again, his ranks don't mean much outside of USA Storm. They are not universal ranks. Lance himself is legit sport sambo.
    Have I ever told you how much I like having you on this site?:thefinger
  4. datdamnmachine is offline
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    Jiu Jitsu - Sometimes passing just isn't an option.

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    Posted On:
    1/11/2007 4:04pm

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     Style: BJJ, Unauthorized Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Thanks Sambosteve (all the info), Judomofo (for that link, didn't even know about it when looking at his site), and "He Who Cannot Be Knocked Out" (for general un-knocked-outness). I appreciate the input. I had heard there was a lot of political B.S. in Sambo but never really had an inside track on what was really going on.

    From the information provided by all parties involved it seems that the wrestling creds are probably legit, and even some of the Sambo information. So far the Judo info is a little on the "obscure" side and there seems to be a lot of "self-hype" to the extreme. One really big note on the link that Judomofo gave us:

    http://www.perrysfullcircle.com/jody-perry-awards.htm


    2001 - World Martial Arts Hall of Fame - awarded a Ph.D. / M.A. and promotion to 12th Dan
    This one I didn't see. The old "Awarded a Ph.D. in Martial Arts so now I can refer to myself as a Doctor. I glad we have this site. The fact is, even if all the Sambo, Judo, and wrestling stuff checks out, all that other mess really brings all those accomplishments down. Hopefully, the future generations of martial arts instructors will realize that nothing beats legit training, competition, and if you have rank, rank you earned through blood, sweat, and tears instead of purchasing it from hall of fame and certificate mills.
  5. Omega Supreme is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/11/2007 4:40pm

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     Style: Chinese Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    You may want to go on lockflow and let him know. Not that it changes much and even if the credentials are a bit inflated it doesn't mean he isn't a good coach, as it was said before.
  6. datdamnmachine is offline
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    Jiu Jitsu - Sometimes passing just isn't an option.

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    Posted On:
    1/11/2007 5:01pm

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     Style: BJJ, Unauthorized Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Omega the Merciless
    You may want to go on lockflow and let him know. Not that it changes much and even if the credentials are a bit inflated it doesn't mean he isn't a good coach, as it was said before.
    That was what my next thought was going to be...how does this sounds (hasn't been sent yet):

    I would like to invite the thread starter to the following thread on Bullshido.net:

    http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=49955

    I initially started the thread out of curiosity when researching the style of martial art that you have just received your black belt in. Some questions were risen and therefore I feel your input would be an asset in answering some of these questions.

    There are some stereotypes about Bullshido.net and if you have any questions, concerns, comments about the mission statement of Bullshido, please come to our website and make your voice heard.
  7. sambosteve is online now
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    Posted On:
    1/11/2007 6:07pm

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     NY Combat Sambo Style: combat sambo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Omega,

    I like posting here when I feel I can add something :) I lurk mostly, but I am generally around somewhere...too many forums, too little time.

    dat,

    Sure, I think contacting that guy on lockflow would be a good idea...let's hope he can come here and be non-confrontaional about it. I am over there too from time to time and will point him in this direction if you want.
  8. datdamnmachine is offline
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    Posted On:
    1/11/2007 6:12pm

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     Style: BJJ, Unauthorized Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by sambosteve
    Omega,

    I like posting here when I feel I can add something :) I lurk mostly, but I am generally around somewhere...too many forums, too little time.

    dat,

    Sure, I think contacting that guy on lockflow would be a good idea...let's hope he can come here and be non-confrontaional about it. I am over there too from time to time and will point him in this direction if you want.
    I'll go ahead and post what I have above in the thread. If you can go on the thread and reinforce some things as well then that may hopefully keep him from being non-confrontational about it. Here is the link to the thread again:

    http://www.lockflow.com/viewtopic.ph...e5c8c03c865622
  9. sambosteve is online now
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    Posted On:
    1/11/2007 6:28pm

    Business Class Supporting Member
     NY Combat Sambo Style: combat sambo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I posted on the lockflow thread...
    Here is what I wrote:

    First, congrats on your black belt! I would love to hear more about the process. I am sure it was no easy task. Do you guys compete in sambo? I have never seen Perry at tournaments for the past several years. We would love to have you guys at our events.
    www.ussambo.com

    I also was directed to this thread from the Bullshido discussion that arose. Since people are always suspect or curious about folks who attempt to create their own style as Perry has, I am sure there are many people that would genuinely like to know about training under Perry and what it entails...an opportunity to ask you questions, etc. I know I would be interested, particularly since he has a sambo background.

    I hope you will come over to the other thread on Bullshido and share your experiences with Perry for us.

    Congrats again.
  10. jamesb959 is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/11/2007 7:33pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Perrys Full Circle

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Gentlemen, I have read through this post and agree, in part, with a lot of your comments and criticisms.
    Jody is a great teacher with a lot of knowledge. Personally, all I know about his creditials is what he has told me and what I have found out through the internet and other sources.
    In competitions that we have been to, both Jody and his son Jayson (my "Sensei") are well known and appear to be very well respected. I know that both Jody and Jayson were heavily involved when pankration started becoming big and they were involved with Keith Hackney, Sheldon Marr, Ken Shamrock, amongst others in the beginning.
    SamboSteve's comment that a lot of schools have more of an internal belt ranking system is fair, and you could view this as such. However, I am proud of my schievements in our school and art. I understand that people do embelish on their achievements and that is the source of this post, however, I still take nothing away from Jody and Jayson, they are both great trainers and people.
    Last edited by jamesb959; 1/11/2007 7:44pm at .
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