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  1. Miguksaram is offline
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    Posted On:
    9/09/2002 10:52am

    supporting member
     Style: Shorei-ryu & Kumdo & TKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Ok, here is the situation. My wife works part time as a waitress at a Japanese resteraunt. After work, some of the employees will be hang out at the bar for a drink before going home. Well last week she was there with the deliquents (the pet name I have given her group) and one of the local TKD masters was at the bar drinking with some friends as well. Well her group was a little loud and the master(we'll call McKim) told them to be quite (more to the point of shut up). One of her friends told him to calm down, that they were celebrating someone's last day and that they will try. Now we have to take in consideration a culture thing (my wife and her friends are Korean) that as a younger person you are to talk back with more respect to an older person regardless of how they talk to you. So McKim gets upset and grabs and empty bottle of beer and holds the neck of it like he was going to hit my wife's friend.

    My wife being the stereo typical passive submissive Korean woman (yeah right!), jumps up and tells McKim "Hey my husband told me real masters don't need weapons to fight. You are a master so why do you need that bottle." He, of course, lost face with this remark. He then turns his anger on to her and gets up from his stool in what she said was a threatening matter, at which time 3 of the guys stand up from their chairs. Seeing this situation he then tells her to have me come and see him at his school and he will prove to me what a real master can do and then leaves saying if he ever catches anyone of those guys (the delinquents) around his dojang, then he will kill them (also understand that Korean use of the word kill is not usually a literal meaning. It is meant to say that he will beat them up.)

    So now I am caught. My concern is not for myself because I could care less if this guy throws a chanllenge. I am too old for that type of stupid crap. However, I am more concerned that he may be dumb enough to actually go after my wife's friends or even my wife. My first inclination is to go to my GM who knows most, if not all of the masters around the area and have him talk to this guy. The other half is wanting to go to his dojang and just talk this out in hopes of calming the situation down. So advice is welcomed. Thanks.

    Jeremy M. Talbott
    http://www.homestead.com/koreanma/index.html
    http://www.geocities.com/jns1994/MSA.html
    Jeremy M. Talbott

    Quote Originally Posted by Phrost
    "Bullshido isn't just a place to hang out when you're browsing the net. We really are trying to accomplish something fucking extraordinary here that nobody's ever had the balls to do before."
    Quote Originally Posted by D.Murray
    "Which is better, to learn the truth, or to enjoy the illusion of being right when you are not?"
    Quote Originally Posted by hangooknamja88 View Post
    My definition of Ki is our energy. it's rather hard to explain it in words. It's not some mystical type of energy like white people...


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  2. bhudhijeevi is offline

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    Posted On:
    9/09/2002 11:39am


     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Real Master?? hell i hate those so called Master.
    anyways i think humility, humbleness and Master goes hand in hand...
    i never saw my teacher gettin agitated even when he's one of best around(But not master, only i prefer him callin that)
    whoever he was...i think fights r useless regardless of age/sex... so i would advocate the other half of talking him into this.
    if he doesn't understand then there is problem...
    but still i won't prefer fighting, i m pretty much young(21) i don't think i can give u any sort of advice...
    but fighting would be my Last and least choice...

    -Bhudhijeevi-
  3. Greese is offline
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    Posted On:
    9/09/2002 12:00pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo and BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    The firs question I would be asking myself, is if I could kick his ass.
    However, if someone had gott up threateningly towards my gf, there would be words and broken bones.
    But, this is your call. I hate bullies, so I would put this **** to an end.
    And that's when I figured out that tears couldn't make somebody who was dead alive again. There's another thing to learn about tears, they can't make somebody who doesn't love you any more love you again. It's the same with prayers. I wonder how much of their lives people waste crying and praying to God. If you ask me, the devil makes more sense than God does. I can at least see why people would want him around. It's good to have somebody to blame for the bad stuff they do. Maybe God's there because people get scared of all the bad stuff they do. They figure that God and the Devil are always playing this game of tug-of-war game with them. And they never know which side they're gonna wind up on. I guess that tug-of-war idea explains how sometimes, even when people try to do something good, it still turns out bad.
  4. bncwd is offline

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    Posted On:
    9/09/2002 12:07pm


     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I am 33, this happened 4 yrs ago.

    Me and wife go to same kickboxing and JJ school, and we share ground with judo class.
    While I was parking the car my wife went straight to the gym: I follow her about 30 mt behind. At a certain point two guys from judo school enter the same road to get to the gym, and start mocking wife (come and show what you can do) from a certain distance: just some speech and some jokes.
    She ignores them and I let it pass for the moment as wife was there and I did not want anything rough happening involving her.

    Two days later (I know judo class schedule) I go alone to the gym and enter the dressing room: I found them there. While they were undressing I go near them and in a quite voice I said:
    "Could you please repeat what you were saying last evening to my wife?"
    they looked puzzled at first, so I described the fact and they remembered. Both of them looked embarassed and said "Sorry we were only joking etc.".
    I concluded: "Ok, be this the last time you do something like that"

    [sorry but I am translating from my own language so the phrases might look weird]

    Was it stupid? Maybe Yes
    Did it work? Yes, they never did it again
    Was I scared? Yes
    Was I angry? At first yes, but not when I went there two days after.
    Was I ready to enter in a fight? Yes again, very ready
    Why did I do it? Well, I decided long ago that nobody touches my dears, it does not matter who, when and why. I wanted to stop from the beginning something which might have got worse.
    Would I do it again? Yes
    Would I do it in the same way? Well it depends who you have in front of you: as we were going to the same gym, a confrontation was unavoidable. Maybe if it was something which would have happened in pub we would have chosen not to go there again and that's it (after all they were only words/jokes).
    Was my wife happy? She was kinda angry and pleased at the same time.

    My advice in your case is: let it go, as there were no direct threat to your wife; in case you choose to confront the guy be calm, neutral (not challenging or you are putting fuel on a fire), but ready to fight if it's needed.

    Good luck
  5. Greese is offline
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    Posted On:
    9/09/2002 12:14pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo and BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    bncwd,
    I would have probably gone to the instructor in that instance. If I were teaching someone and they were behaving that way, I would want to know. Then ask permission to go speak with them about it. Good way to avoid a fight and get the problem rectified.
    Just curious, I could not tell from your post the type of thing that was said...was it making fun of tech or just being asses to her in general?
    And that's when I figured out that tears couldn't make somebody who was dead alive again. There's another thing to learn about tears, they can't make somebody who doesn't love you any more love you again. It's the same with prayers. I wonder how much of their lives people waste crying and praying to God. If you ask me, the devil makes more sense than God does. I can at least see why people would want him around. It's good to have somebody to blame for the bad stuff they do. Maybe God's there because people get scared of all the bad stuff they do. They figure that God and the Devil are always playing this game of tug-of-war game with them. And they never know which side they're gonna wind up on. I guess that tug-of-war idea explains how sometimes, even when people try to do something good, it still turns out bad.
  6. bncwd is offline

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    Posted On:
    9/09/2002 12:41pm


     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Well they were both adult persons (about my age I guess) so I directly went to them. I would do it the same as I think the "incident" was something personal and I would not have liked to involve the instructor, school etc.

    As for what they said, it was just a mocking on what she could do to them being just a woman and this sort of things, not particularly focussed on the fact that we were doing a different art.

    My thought was that once a behaviour like that starts, it can get worse, so I wanted to stop it form the start (and I did not like the attitude, too, they can mess with someone's elses wife, not with mine)
  7. Greese is offline
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    Posted On:
    9/09/2002 12:48pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo and BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Thats logical.
    And that's when I figured out that tears couldn't make somebody who was dead alive again. There's another thing to learn about tears, they can't make somebody who doesn't love you any more love you again. It's the same with prayers. I wonder how much of their lives people waste crying and praying to God. If you ask me, the devil makes more sense than God does. I can at least see why people would want him around. It's good to have somebody to blame for the bad stuff they do. Maybe God's there because people get scared of all the bad stuff they do. They figure that God and the Devil are always playing this game of tug-of-war game with them. And they never know which side they're gonna wind up on. I guess that tug-of-war idea explains how sometimes, even when people try to do something good, it still turns out bad.
  8. Miguksaram is offline
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    Posted On:
    9/09/2002 12:53pm

    supporting member
     Style: Shorei-ryu & Kumdo & TKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Well from what I do know of McKim, he is a "legitimate" 8th dan in WTF. (This is shameful since I am such a crusader for TKD and this guy just really puts my cause back 10 fold). Can I beat him? I don't know. I have never seen him on the mat.

    As for defending my wife's honor in this situation, well, being that she has been doing this job since I knew her. I have defended her many times. It took me a while to understand that it is the nature of the beast in her job that she has to deal with assholes.

    What I think I will do is go through my instructor and tell him about it and have him help me in the situation. Kind of a Korean protocol if you will. If I go there my self, I am thinking that it will just lead to more problems and I don't want my instructor to lose face if I screw this up.


    Jeremy M. Talbott
    http://www.homestead.com/koreanma/index.html
    http://www.geocities.com/jns1994/MSA.html
    Jeremy M. Talbott

    Quote Originally Posted by Phrost
    "Bullshido isn't just a place to hang out when you're browsing the net. We really are trying to accomplish something fucking extraordinary here that nobody's ever had the balls to do before."
    Quote Originally Posted by D.Murray
    "Which is better, to learn the truth, or to enjoy the illusion of being right when you are not?"
    Quote Originally Posted by hangooknamja88 View Post
    My definition of Ki is our energy. it's rather hard to explain it in words. It's not some mystical type of energy like white people...


    SUPPORT BULLSHIDO!
  9. Greese is offline
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    Posted On:
    9/09/2002 1:03pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo and BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Well, I expect the asshole thing from non-MA or new students, but when it is an instructor, someone needs to stop it.
    Just imagine what he is teaching in his classes?
    Drink, threaten to use a bottle as a weapon, then, when threatented, make threating moves toward a woman.
    That is sheer bullshit.
    And that's when I figured out that tears couldn't make somebody who was dead alive again. There's another thing to learn about tears, they can't make somebody who doesn't love you any more love you again. It's the same with prayers. I wonder how much of their lives people waste crying and praying to God. If you ask me, the devil makes more sense than God does. I can at least see why people would want him around. It's good to have somebody to blame for the bad stuff they do. Maybe God's there because people get scared of all the bad stuff they do. They figure that God and the Devil are always playing this game of tug-of-war game with them. And they never know which side they're gonna wind up on. I guess that tug-of-war idea explains how sometimes, even when people try to do something good, it still turns out bad.
  10. Boffo is offline

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    Posted On:
    9/09/2002 1:08pm


     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Why bother with this yourself? Especially when the authorities are happy enough to get involved. The police tend to get involved rather quickly when a person claiming to be an 8th Dan threatens anyone with physical violence. Tell the police this happened and have your wife press charges.

    More importantly, this guy perhaps should be put away. He is threatening people with a potentially deadly beating (yeah, he may be a nit, but people will perceive him as being deadly anyway). What happens (as you fear) he hurts someone when you or your wife can't intervene.

    This guy needs to be put away.

    If that isn't manly enough for you, then go fight him. Remember, duels are illegal. Go to his school and beat him up and you could go to jail for 'teaching him a lesson'.
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