Posted On:9/08/2002 3:46pm
So here I am at an anti grappling program for the Wing Tzun system. Now I'm a nhb, shootfighter, sambo, judo and shan shou person (TKD and Kung fu too but I figured that was besides the point). I've always wondered how effective and modern there approach was and to tell you the truth I'm impressed. Now I'm not going to go out and start taking Wing Tzun but if your thinking of doing it go for it. Normally I throw out a few questions, being the skeptic I am, but he already answered all the questions. He being Michael Casey who, I'm told, is Emin Boetzepe's #1 or #2 student.
Posted On:9/08/2002 4:36pm
Posted On:9/08/2002 5:39pm
Well let me see, he takes a grapplers approach to warm ups using a few wrestling exercises telling everybody that they need to know how this is done. Showing defenses for all the common grappling maneuvers plus standard ankle locks, choke holds, arm bars etc. I'd love to go into details but I don't want to bore everybody. I was just putting my stamp of approval on the WT system even though I don't take the art. This as opposed to the somewhat commercial advertisement history that I saw about a month ago which didn't impress me. This is stuff you've got to see live to appreciate the movements and effectiveness.
Posted On:9/09/2002 3:07am
None of the anti-grappling I have seen from WT has looked like it worked... nto even techniques shown by Emin himself...
Posted On:9/09/2002 5:14am
Hmmm, Micheal, I had the same impression about WT: the ads were somehow stupid and bullish, but when I started to practice I found out a completely different environment from what I expected (at least in Italy).
I found respect for the other arts, they encourage cross training and analysis of other styles, the training is very practical, aggressive and essential (I come from JJ/BJJ,Kickboxing,Chute Boxe).
I wasn't able to figure out why there this difference between the image they promote through ads and what the environment really is.
Posted On:9/09/2002 7:38am
Whwre did ya train Chute box?
NHB or nothing!
Posted On:9/09/2002 8:03am
Hi darkface, my former school is based in Livorno (Italy), and it's a school where the teachers do BJJ/JJ, kickboxing and chute boxe: the head of the school is a responsible of fiam (italian federation of martial arts), and his "boys" compete wherever they can (from semi-contact to valetudo).
I trained ther for aprox. 6/7 years, mostly as a hobbist (only 2 matches in the ring).
Last year I wanted to try something different so I started WT (with some Escrima sometimes).
Posted On:9/09/2002 12:08pm
Like I said a lot of the techniques you can't appreciate unless you're there. Trust me when I say I had not been too impressed until I saw it live.
Posted On:9/09/2002 12:16pm
Style: Judo and BJJ
Well, that is kind of specious. I mean, what is going to be different live than on a video? I saw they crap they were trying to pull off. It wouldn't work. Did they just pull out the most ineffective techs for the video or what?
And that's when I figured out that tears couldn't make somebody who was dead alive again. There's another thing to learn about tears, they can't make somebody who doesn't love you any more love you again. It's the same with prayers. I wonder how much of their lives people waste crying and praying to God. If you ask me, the devil makes more sense than God does. I can at least see why people would want him around. It's good to have somebody to blame for the bad stuff they do. Maybe God's there because people get scared of all the bad stuff they do. They figure that God and the Devil are always playing this game of tug-of-war game with them. And they never know which side they're gonna wind up on. I guess that tug-of-war idea explains how sometimes, even when people try to do something good, it still turns out bad.
Posted On:9/09/2002 12:33pm
Well, don't know about the antigrappling as I haven't tried yet, but for the rest with WT there a whole deal of difference betwen seeing it and trying it.
I will try to explain: WT is based 90% on pressure management (pressure given, taken, redirected), weight distribution, corporeal structure and stance, sensitivness, with roots in extremely simple body mechanic and physic.
Kicks are 99% to groin or legs (no high kicks as far as I know), objective is close the distance and hit with short punches, knees, elbows and when appropriate lock and throw (but in a different manner for examlpe than JJ).
This why what you see is no way representative of what you feel in WT, and to understand it you should try it with an instructor in a class.
I know it sounds weird but it's true: it's like seeing two judo masters in an olympic confrontation, there a lot more happening between them (pressures, pulling, resisting, giving way) than the eye can see, but in WT it's even worse.
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