Cuaucalli - Aztec Karate?

**eyebeams** · Posted On: 12/21/2006 5:08am

Not only is Nahuatl a living language spoken by over 1.5 million people (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nahuatl), the guy makes no claims about teaching a system from a Precolumbian lineage at all. He says he invented it.

Now the whole thing may be wacky for other reasons, but for Christ's sake, do you people actually read this stuff before you post any more?

**Judah Maccabee** · Posted On: 12/21/2006 6:18am

Eyebeams:

I founded Cuaucalli as a tribute and historical system to my Aztec heritage. Foremost, the the systemization of martial arts, pressure points and warfare drew my attention to promoting it's resurrection. I will be writing an article for BLACK BELT Magazine on Traditional Karate and Aztec Martial Arts

It may not be an outright link to a formal system cultivated thousands of years ago, but it's a clear indication that he is basing his system upon that tradition. Unless he's merely taking Karate and giving it Aztec names (ala Karl Marx with Keichu-do "Cajun Karate"), but then, there's nothing Aztec about it other than names.

**eyebeams** · Posted On: 12/21/2006 6:36am

Originally Posted by Judah Maccabee

Eyebeams:

It may not be an outright link to a formal system cultivated thousands of years ago, but it's a clear indication that he is basing his system upon that tradition. Unless he's merely taking Karate and giving it Aztec names (ala Karl Marx with Keichu-do "Cajun Karate"), but then, there's nothing Aztec about it other than names.

There are a few million around who presumably have a few fighting tricks along with other cultural traditions. Taking these, combining them with prior knowledge and then systematizing it is no worse than WMA. But at the same time, indigenous populations have a much less formal relationship with the state in Mexico, so if somebody wanted to rip off an indigenous tradition, that'd be a hard to catch way to go about it.

This guy calls himself the "founder" of whatever it is, so I think that puts him firmly in the reconstruction camp -- though how entitled he might be to reconstructing it, I have no idea. I somehow doubt he's doing anything compatible with the focus of this site in terms of training methods, though.

**Judah Maccabee** · Posted On: 12/21/2006 7:05am

He claims to have training under Leonardo Xavier (2nd deg black belt) and Royce Gracie for BJJ, and is going to be a BJJ coach at a Kuk Sool Won place. (http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=49290)

**M1K3** · Posted On: 12/21/2006 7:58am

WTF, Marine Military Academy Grand Champion?

There is the US Military Academy - West Point
the US Naval Academy, which is where Marine officers come from,
and the US Air Force Academy.

I am a former jarhead and I can say I never heard of, or met anyone who claimed to have attended the "Marine Military Academy".

**OnceLost** · Posted On: 12/21/2006 8:05am

I founded Cuaucalli as a tribute and historical system to my Aztec heritage.

Is that in the same way that author's dedicate a book to someone who doesn't actually appear in the book at all? So he's doing a mix of whatever it is he actually studied, changing the brand labeling, and remarketing the product with a mix of mistruths, misdirections, and outright falsehoods. Capitalism FTW!

**PirateJon** · Posted On: 12/21/2006 8:16am

Originally Posted by M1K3

WTF, Marine Military Academy Grand Champion?

There is the US Military Academy - West Point
the US Naval Academy, which is where Marine officers come from,
and the US Air Force Academy.

I am a former jarhead and I can say I never heard of, or met anyone who claimed to have attended the "Marine Military Academy".

Google - http://www.mma-tx.org/. Looks legit, should be easy to verify if they have that title and who's won it.

I won't though. I'm far to rich to do that.

**OnceLost** · Posted On: 12/21/2006 9:13am

Ahh, Marine Military Academy is a private college prep school. It has a cadet structure that "emulates the Marines," so it sounds like a military boarding school.

I called the school - everything except the admission's department is closed until January 5. I emailed the following:

To Whom it May Concern,

I am emailing you in an attempt to verify the claims of Joseph Cantu. Mr. Cantu claims to have earned a boxing or martial arts related award of "Marine Military Academy Grand Champion." I am emailing you this request for information because your school is the only Marine Military Academy I could identify. Unfortunately, I am unable to identify which year Mr. Cantu is claiming to have earned this award, but I believe it is before 1994. Any assistance you could offer would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you,

**total noob** · Posted On: 12/21/2006 9:44am

Though this guy does sound real hoakey if he is trying to claim his style as a resurection of an old Aztec martial art, if his BBs are real and his school produces students who can actually fight, is it bad that he is trying to make a new style?

I am curious to the views of this board on someone creating a new "style". There can obviously be alot to talk about when it comes to historical lineage of the different "traditional" styles and how they've evolved from one known style into another, but past history isn't what my question is about.

Let's say a person has a couple legitimate BBs in different arts and maybe even a few lower ranks in other styles and teaches a mix of those supposed arts in his school AND let's suppose that their school has "aliveness" and trains techniques that work etc, etc, etc. Is there any point in time that person should/could be able to call this mix a new style? Their own style and give themself whatever title they want and call the techniques any name they want?

**Tonuzaba** · Posted On: 12/21/2006 10:02am

The Aztecs, may the ground be easy for them, were especially good in fighting against metal-armored invaders, just ask Mr. Google about them and that goddamn **** Cortez...
Maybe in Cuaucalli classes one guy is going to be playing the Aztec and the opponent the Spanish and then change roles.
As to your question,

Originally Posted by total noob

Let's say a person has a couple legitimate BBs in different arts and maybe even a few lower ranks in other styles and teaches a mix of those supposed arts in his school AND let's suppose that their school has "aliveness" and trains techniques that work etc, etc, etc. Is there any point in time that person should/could be able to call this mix a new style? Their own style and give themself whatever title they want and call the techniques any name they want?

Can you list any MMA "styles"? Can you really invent any new movements? What point is there in renaming an existing and working technique?
Besides, there's just no way of expressing how much I hate people who create own styles to become the great-great-founding-everknowing grandmasters of them...

Tonuzaba