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  1. Matt W. is offline
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    Posted On:
    11/19/2006 6:24pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo, TKD BB

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Go to the range and do some shooting with a variety of handguns. Preferably try and shoot the guns you are interested in buying, so you can get a feel for them and see if they are as good in your hand as on paper. If you don't have buddies that will take you and let you shoot their guns, most ranges also rent guns rather cheaply, especially if you buy their ammo.

    FWIW, I've shot both an HK 9mm, full size and a Sig p226 (also 9mm full size) and far, far prefer the Sig. I also have a Taurus P89 (9mm full size) and though it wouldn't make a good carry gun (for a variety of reasons), it is a great gun for fun and learning, and is fine as an "in home" defensive handgun.

    And, IMO, forget an "assault rifle" for any kind of home defense. Pick yourself up a shortie/police/home defender pump action 12 gauge. It's all you need, for a fraction of the price.
  2. Cassius is online now
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    Posted On:
    11/19/2006 6:43pm

    supporting memberforum leader
     Style: Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Don Gwinn
    Congratulations; you called magazines "clips" three times and now somewhere in the world three adorable kittens are dead.
    I actually didn't call them that at all. I'm guessing you're talking about ar549?


    Quote Originally Posted by Don Gwinn
    Anyway, I won't make any recommendations, except that you keep in mind that you don't have to buy a black plastic rifle if you don't want to. There are all kinds of bolt, lever and semi-auto carbines out there that might be more fun for you if you try 'em. Also if size is a real concern, FN just introduced a 5.56 bullpup that looks pretty neat, and it's significantly shorter than an M4 even with the stock all the way collapsed. You can also get AR pattern rifles in 7.62 NATO from DPMS, Rock River Arms, Armalite and probably a bunch of others. Google AR10.

    Anyway, resources:
    www.thefiringline.com
    www.thehighroad.org
    www.1911.com
    www.glocktalk.com (has gone way downhill in the last few years; worse signal-to-noise than Bullshido.)
    www.ar15.com


    Your figure of $3000 max is pretty high for a production rifle, but don't forget to set some aside for the things that make that rifle useful:
    magazines--you can't have too many
    ammunition--you can't have too much
    case--needs to be a good protective case; who knows where you'll end up taking the rifle?
    sights--do you want a scope? A holographic sight, like an Eotech? I don't use them, but most "tactical" guys swear by them. My dad had one on his Ithaca Deerslayer shotgun this year and he loved it. Don't forget you need to mount the sight in a convenient and reliable way.
    Spotting scope--if you want to shoot at 100-300 yards, you want to be able to call hits without walking three football fields after every group.
    This is exactly the type of information I was looking for. I had looked at some AR-10s, but I'm trying to keep my options open. I may not even end up going with a nifty little plastic rifle, but it's kind of what I want right now. That could easily change once I have more knowledge in this area.

    So since everyone and their mother seems to own a weapon from the AR-10/15/M4rgery series, how clean do they fire compared to the M-16A2/4? Because A2s and A4s are dirty as ****. While I don't MIND taking them apart and cleaning them after firing 3+ rounds, I'd prefer something that was a little bit cleaner-firing. That was what originally attracted me to H&K, as they seem to have some new mechanisms that make for much less carbon residue. Too bad the only thing I think I'm going to be able to get my hands on (without an act of god) is the SL8 aka Nintendo Super Scope.

    Too bad the FN Scar probably won't ever come out in a civilian model.
    "No. Listen to me because I know what I'm talking about here." -- Hannibal
  3. Cassius is online now
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    Posted On:
    11/19/2006 6:48pm

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     Style: Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt W.
    And, IMO, forget an "assault rifle" for any kind of home defense. Pick yourself up a shortie/police/home defender pump action 12 gauge. It's all you need, for a fraction of the price.
    Good advice, but . . . I don't know if you got the sarcasm, but the assault rifle isn't for home defense.

    A) I live on base and can't have a personal weapon in the barracks.

    B.) I live on an Army base.

    The rifle is just because I enjoy shooting paper targets. I prefer shooting the 7.62 NATO (or .308 winchester) round over 5.56, and I guess if I ever had to shoot something with it, I'd really prefer to be hitting whatever "it" was with something a little bigger than 5.56. I'm comfortable with the M-16 and would like something like it, hence the decision to go with an assault rifle or carbine.

    Shotguns are okay, but I don't enjoy shooting them all that much.
    "No. Listen to me because I know what I'm talking about here." -- Hannibal
  4. Matt W. is offline
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    Posted On:
    11/19/2006 7:55pm

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     Style: Judo, TKD BB

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    But, hey, my handgun advice was good, right? Right???
  5. Cassius is online now
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    Posted On:
    11/19/2006 7:58pm

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     Style: Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Matt W.
    But, hey, my handgun advice was good, right? Right???
    Indeed it was. Thanks.
    "No. Listen to me because I know what I'm talking about here." -- Hannibal
  6. Don Gwinn is offline
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    BJJ wins again!

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    Posted On:
    11/19/2006 8:32pm

    supporting member
     Style: Guns

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Yeah, I was prodding at ar549. :)

    I actually don't have an AR pattern. It's interesting; Pat Rogers has had a couple of articles in the last couple of issues of SWAT discussing cleaning the AR platform and keeping it running. A great deal of it was devoted to his belief that military and LEO armorers have caused a lot of trouble by doing "white glove inspections" and demanding excessive cleaning.

    His biggest issues seemed to be with armorers demanding that carbon buildup be cleaned completely off the bolt tail, where it apparently does no damage. There was more than that, but I don't have it in front of me.
    *********************************************
  7. Cassius is online now
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    Posted On:
    11/19/2006 9:04pm

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     Style: Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Don Gwinn
    Yeah, I was prodding at ar549. :)

    I actually don't have an AR pattern. It's interesting; Pat Rogers has had a couple of articles in the last couple of issues of SWAT discussing cleaning the AR platform and keeping it running. A great deal of it was devoted to his belief that military and LEO armorers have caused a lot of trouble by doing "white glove inspections" and demanding excessive cleaning.

    His biggest issues seemed to be with armorers demanding that carbon buildup be cleaned completely off the bolt tail, where it apparently does no damage. There was more than that, but I don't have it in front of me.
    Okay, I thought so. They're actually really strict here about using the proper terminology, so I'd never say "clip" unless I meant "clip."

    That's actually an article I'd be interested in getting my hands on. Let me know if you happen to dig up a copy of it.
    "No. Listen to me because I know what I'm talking about here." -- Hannibal
  8. ar549 is offline
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    Banned for failing to live up to the standards he expected of others and wasting more time on calling out forum military members' credentials than he spent in his own military career.

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    Posted On:
    11/20/2006 1:47am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Bulldogging

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    If you want old school gear you cannot go wrong with Wilson Combat, They have been around a very long time and can get anything done that you could dream up. I still like 1911s when done correctly but I dont have access to high qaulity gunsmiths in my AO so I try and stick with the new stuff on location. My first suggestion was go for Sig products, They are the top of the line in off the shelf stuff that needs no improvements, tranlated to "you wont have to spend extra money to make it function!"


    http://www.wilsoncombat.com/


  9. Matt W. is offline
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    Posted On:
    11/20/2006 11:40am

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     Style: Judo, TKD BB

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    ar549 sure is good at copying and pasting stuff from google searches! He's a quality poster.
  10. TEA is offline
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    Now iz BBQ Timez?

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    Posted On:
    11/20/2006 12:31pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: TKD, Relson GJJ, Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    If you want reliability and 7.62 power, then you can't really beat an M14 type rifle. LRB Arms makes a hammer forged receiver and uses mostly USGI parts. If you want modularity, you can always add a SAGE Industries stock or a Knights Armaments style handguard with rails (Fulton Armory sells one). McMillan also offers a folding stock with rails.


    My match tuned M1A

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