efectiveness of style

**Miguksaram** · Posted On: 9/05/2002 4:15pm

TKD when taught correctly and with the right intent is just as good as anything else on the market. Trouble is that the majority of the schools teach strictly tournament style TKD. That is only a small part of what TKD is about. Unfortunately other aspects of TKD are being lost.

Jeremy M. Talbott
http://www.homestead.com/koreanma/index.html
http://www.geocities.com/jns1994/MSA.html

**DCM Fighter** · Posted On: 9/05/2002 4:33pm

I must have not been learning ITF TKD (so many initials! aaaahhhhh) because half of that stuff I didn't learn, however I did only train for a year and get to green belt. There is one thing that I wonder about that the head instructor said. He said that most schools hand out black belts after 2 years. He gave 'em out after 4. That's either to keep you in the program longer and get more money, or he truly cared about your skills and felt 2 years was too fast to earn a black belt. He did have yearly contracts. I did feel that the self defense applications sucked and was totally unrealistic. One time I even 'tested' TKD against a boxer. In high school this guy I was constantly arguing with, it finally came to getting physical. I blocked his first uppercut to the stomach, but with all the repetitous training, I put my hand back on my hip, and took a croos to the cheek. Due to the fact I hadn't really been hit before that one punch pretty much caused a TKO. I believe TKD can be used in a fight but only if it's taught right. Most schools do teach the sporting acpect. Also, people have to pick the right martial arts to suit their body type. I have a prosthetic leg and being a one legged kicker isn't all that great.

**DCM Fighter** · Posted On: 9/05/2002 4:33pm

woops typo! *cross*

**Mr_Clean** · Posted On: 9/05/2002 5:23pm

Text snipped.......In high school this guy I was constantly arguing with, it finally came to getting physical. I blocked his first uppercut to the stomach, but with all the repetitous training, I put my hand back on my hip, and took a croos to the cheek. Due to the fact I hadn't really been hit before that one punch pretty much caused a TKO. I believe TKD can be used in a fight but only if it's taught right. Most schools do teach the sporting acpect. Also, people have to pick the right martial arts to suit their body type. I have a prosthetic leg and being a one legged kicker isn't all that great.

Kudos to you for having the courage/guts/cajones to try a sport that requires two good legs when you have one!

Beware the master of To-fu!

**Berserk411** · Posted On: 9/05/2002 6:15pm

the Reason many BJJ school teach you to drag primarily ont he ground is because they are Probably primarily Sport BJJ schools. They teach you to grapple because that is what you will be doing in tournaments.

I've been to more traditional JJ schools that teach stinking and takedowns as well.

**bhudhijeevi** · Posted On: 9/05/2002 10:00pm

"One time I even 'tested' TKD against a boxer. In high school this guy I was constantly arguing with, it finally came to getting physical"

hey dcm, kudos man. it's great u took up a brawl..lol... i m practicing TKD from 3 n 1/2 yrs and i m just a yellow belt... but still i can kick serious ass, it's because of my teacher's style,
sometime when we practice we put some rules like our oppn't use kicks and punches and we r restricted to punches only, so accordin to practice session we change rules for fighting..
i'll still say i hav seen enough TKD mcdojo's around my place,
the kind of sparring in WTF(olympic) is entirely diff from ours we only hav 1/2 inch paddin and supported to groin when we fight, no head gears, no protective equipments on chest. so in normally tournaments we ended up breakin someone's jaw, hand or getting ourselves ripped off...it's pretty much real and hurts...

and last line of ur para, people should check their body type too...i believe u should do ur research and talk to diff teachers and i bet they help u find out the art ment for u...

as u said the person didn't gave belts before 4 yrs... well my teacher don't give untill he thinks the person is not ready...it can take 3 yrs or 10 yrs... that didn't matter to him...
and yea my teacher charge dirt cheap, no contracts
(only one, if u got ripped off during class or sparring it wouldnn't be my responsibility ;) )
-Bhudhijeevi-

**LUI KANG** · Posted On: 9/05/2002 10:32pm

I dont know what the **** all this new age "Get your blackbelt in two years" bullshit fucking is! What is the MA world coming to? Back when I took TKD with my 2 good friends when we were younger (they started like 3 years before me) it took them about 7 years to get their blackbelts! Our TKD dojo was one of the few non mcdojos I guess... I mean when I started it took my like 6 months just to get my yellow stripe! (BTW we were WTF). I took it for about 3 years and got to blue belt, thats only about half done and at a mcdojo I would of already had my blackbelt longgg ago, its pathetic! TKD is getting way to capatilist, just as many other things...

Migos heteroasexually challaged (everyone all the time)

**DCM Fighter** · Posted On: 9/09/2002 12:10am

Thanks Mr. Clean and Bhudhijeevi, I really appreciate it. I'd been taking crap from that guy for months and I finally confronted him. Even to this day I so wish I had the training I have now. I would've kicked his butt : )

**Gezere** · Posted On: 9/09/2002 5:33am

&gt;BJJ has everything that old school JJ has also.

Not quite. If you are talking about Koryu JJ then BJJ deffinately does NOT have everything. Danzan Ryu JJ is a GENDAI (modern school) that developed along the same lines as judo.

&gt; It addresses standing close quarters in the same way that JJJ does but without the fake movements that will never work like odd wrist locks and fancy throws and such. Try doing a wrist lock on a guy and have him REALLY resist. Tell a big friend to grab you and dont tell him what your going to do. Just have him react when you start to move.

PD I don't still don't get where you are coming from. What FANCY moves in JJJ. Again are we talking Modern schools or OLD schools. The moves of old schools are very straight foward. Someone grabs you punch them in the face, throat, etc then slam them into the ground and break their wrist or kill them. Plus you have to pick and choose your targets. I still haven't had anyone get out a wrist lock I've put on. If the guy has wrists the size of my biceps I wouldn't try it on him, common sense.

&gt;Let's face it you are not going to get a sweet Seoi-Goshi on a guy wearing a Fruit of the Loom T-shirt or wifebeater.

You don't need any clothing to perfom any of the seoi nage waza (seoi gosh, ippon seoi nage, etc.) The key focus is the arm. In soei goshi you place the elbow under the armpit while holding the lapel. If they don't have a lapel then you don't need it or you can substitue. One method is the grap the back fo the neck, like a wrestlers clinch, and got thru the same motion. Your elbow will not go under is armpit, obviously, but you are still keeping the same principles of force and the throw will work fine. We do this tanktops and sleeveless shirts on. Besides the ring how often do you fight topless guys?

As far as modifing techniques for real use. You should be learning the PRINCIPLES in practice. Once the principles are down you work at different applications. It will be very rare that you will perform a textbook technique on the street. It will be modified.

&gt;I blocked his first uppercut to the stomach, but with all the repetitous training, I put my hand back on my hip, and took a croos to the cheek.

You had to have been a novice or you school REALLY SUCKED. If you were a NOVICE then I understand why this happened. I posted on a thread about this so I will just give a quick break down.

Punching from the hip is a tool to teach beginners how to generate power and to it is kept up to make sure the principle is kept in mind. BUT if you watch some of the old school fighters and compotent teachers they do not do this chamber when fighting. They will throw punches and blocks from their en guard posistion. If the chamber at all it will be a high chamber, usualy around the rib cage.

Xiao Ao Jiang Hu Zhi Dong Fang Bu Bai (Laughing Proud Warrior Invinsible Asia) Emporer of Baji!!! THE FIRST LINE OF DEFENSE AGAINST THE UNITED AUSSIE FRONT!!

Edited by - Asia on September 09 2002 05:40:42

**Miguksaram** · Posted On: 9/09/2002 11:30am

Asia,

It sounds like PD has a problem of transitioning the techniques outside their drills. Too many people think that the techniques taught in JJ or HKD are cut and dry. Many of the techniques are just reference points to start from. Similar to punching from a chambered position. It is possible that his school did not teach how to adapt a technique to different situations. It is a flaw that some schools have.

I am not very knowledgable in BJJ, but it looks like it implements a lot more ground locking and fighting that JJJ does. I know HKD doesn't implement a lot of ground locking techniques such as that. (I use HKD as a focal point, since HKD gets its origins from Aiki-jujitsu).

Jeremy M. Talbott
http://www.homestead.com/koreanma/index.html
http://www.geocities.com/jns1994/MSA.html