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  1. PoleFighter is offline

    Professional Swede

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    Posted On:
    9/10/2006 4:36pm


     Style: Sandbagged BJJ white belt

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Final Conflict Absolute discussion (spoilers, obviously)

    So who do you guys think won the the Barnett vs Nog fight? I had Nog winning. He seemed more effective with the GnP, almost had Barnett subbed, and seemed to have control more of the fight (especially in round 1). Lots of nice sweeps and takedowns. Nog definitly looked far more technical on the ground than Barnett, who seems to have a pretty lousy guard.

    In Barenett's favor, he had the knockdown, a "sweep" from half guard, and the ankle lock and the kneebar (and a bunch of stuff I don't remember). I don't know much about kneebars. It seemed close, but with guys like Nog you never know. Was Nog saved by the bell?

    I'd love to hear what people have to say about this decision.
    I pointed at him [the panhandler], bringing my rear hand up in a subtle approximation of the double Wu Sau guard that is the default hand position in Wing Chun Kung Fu.

    "Step away," I hissed.
    -Phil Elmore
  2. supercrap is offline
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    Founder/GrandSensei of Joint British / Papua New Guinean Non-contact Lawn Bowls Jiu Jitsu Committee

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    Least Cool Guy in all of Japan
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    Posted On:
    9/10/2006 5:11pm


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I thought it was nogs too but I didnt mind the decision.

    What a great night... i hope cro cop can keep this momentum and take on fedor at NYE.
    Imports from Japan, Shipping Worldwide! Art Junkie, Scramble, BJJ Spirits, Reversal...
    Scramble Stuff
  3. Draven is offline
    Draven's Avatar

    ('._.)

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    Posted On:
    9/10/2006 5:28pm


     Style: Mixed Martial Arts

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    New HW rankings:

    Fedor, Cro Cop, Barnett, Nog, Aleks.
  4. Draven is offline
    Draven's Avatar

    ('._.)

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    Posted On:
    9/10/2006 5:45pm


     Style: Mixed Martial Arts

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I thought Barnett definatly deserved that win BTW.
  5. poet is offline
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    Working my way back to health

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    Posted On:
    9/10/2006 9:29pm

    supporting member
     Style: Injury magnet

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I had Barnett, you forgot the sweep while in full mount.
  6. Samfoo is offline
    Samfoo's Avatar

    Knee + Head = Black Eye * 2

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    Posted On:
    9/10/2006 11:52pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Crocop looked better than I've ever seen him. I was thoroughly impressed with him stepping up to the plate this time.
    Quote Originally Posted by Osiris
    Imagine if track was run like the martial arts community. While the winning teams would just sprint down the field, smoking the competition, you'd have a bunch of losers running around explaining how they can skip down the track just as fast. Never mind that it doesn't fucking work. Oh no, they're too fast for track. They run on the STREET.
  7. Fighting Cephalopod is offline
    Fighting Cephalopod's Avatar

    Submitting 1d6 Investigators per round

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    Posted On:
    9/11/2006 1:30pm

    supporting member
     Style: ZHOO ZHITSU

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Just rewatched the fight.

    Round starts. Feeling out. Barnett lands some leg kicks and jabs. Nog gets a flurry that ends in a clinch; hard to say how many punches landed, but some did. Barnett knees. Break, circle. More leg kicks and jabs. Nog flurries again, gets clinched again. Barnett throws three knees and two bodyshots, Nog throws a knee, Josh drops him with a left hook at about two and a half minutes in.

    Josh immediately goes down into Nog's half guard. Nog underhooks to sweep, but Josh defends.

    Josh sits up and lands two solid punches, Nog goes to butterfly guard. Nog lands a few arm-punches from the bottom. Josh stands up and comes down with a solid punch, landing in half guard again.

    Josh sits up, Nog goes to feet on hips, Josh stands and lands a solid right to Nog's head, comes down into half again. Nog underhooks the leg for the sweep again, Josh crossfaces him down flat. Nog arm-punches the side of Josh's head from the bottom. Nog gets a butterfly hook in. Josh arm-punches the body and the head, then stands, punches, and comes down into half-guard again. Nog underhooks the leg and comes up for a single, driving Josh into the ropes. Josh underhooks to defend, but eventually gets driven down. Nog immediately passes to half guard.

    Nog gets a few arm punches on Josh and passes to side. Two solid knees to Josh's hip. Josh defends an attempt to take mount. Nog attempts some more punches to Josh's face but is blocked. Josh tries to roll him over, doesn't quite get it, but gets half guard back.

    Josh arm-punches from the bottom, Nog arm-punches from the top. Nog sits up and lands two solid punches to Josh's head. Josh sweeps him, but Nog turns it into a scramble and comes up into a single leg. Josh grabs a guillotine. Nog completely abandons the takedown and pummels his arm in to defend. Josh moves out of the corner and lands a knee to Nog's chin as he escapes the guillotine.

    Nog punches, Josh clinches, Josh lands a knee, breaks the clinch.

    Josh throws a right that looks like it barely grazes Nog, Nog throws a one two that hits Josh's forearms, Josh clinches. Josh lands a knee, Nog lands an uppercut. Breaks clinch.

    Josh lands a one-two solidly and follows it into the clinch. Nog throws a right hook to the body and Josh misses an uppercut. Break clinch.

    Nog throws a jab, into a single, into a rear-bodylock standing, very fluid. Josh tries to break Nog's grip, fails, goes to the ground and into a granby roll, which he turns into a leglock attempt. He has Nog's foot solidly, but is still fighting for hip control to finish. Nog escapes to side control. Total time from the point Josh locked it in to Nog escaping was just about thirty seconds.

    Josh blocks a few punches, Nog takes mount. Throws three solid shots that connect to Josh's head. Throws a few more that Josh blocks with hand in the biceps. Josh pulls Nog's head down. Nog pops up and lands another solid shot. A few more get defended. Josh arm-punches from the bottom without much effect, holding Nog's wrists. Nog goes into an armbar.

    Josh has his arms folded, Nog works to break grip. Josh tries to backroll, fails, comes up and stacks Nog. Escapes to side control. Time from lock in to escape was about thirty seconds.

    Josh lands two hammerfists. Nog tries to turn into him for a single, Josh drives him back down. Round ends with Josh on top in side.

    Round 2 starts. Circling, no connecting blows. Nog ducks a punch and picks up a single leg. Barnett sprawls and drives Nog down into half guard. Nog underhooks the leg for the sweep, Barnett bases out. Josh sits up and misses a punch, stands, connects with a punch and comes back down into butterfly guard. Josh stands again and Nog sweeps him down into Josh's guard.

    Josh defends some hammerfists and short hooks. Nog passes to half and almost immediately to mount. Crossfacing Josh, not throwing punches yet. Josh reverses into Nog's guard. Total time in mount - 12 seconds.

    Ref restarts in the center.

    Josh stands in the guard, comes down with a punch, back into guard. Tries to pass to half. Nog armdrags, starts taking the back. Has the rear bodylock, gets one hook in. Josh keeps wrist control, defends the other hook, drives Nog down into guard. Total time back was threatened - 22 seconds. No punches thrown.

    Josh stands in Nog's guard, controls the ankles. Tries a stomp, misses, comes down in half guard. Nog underhooks for the sweep, Josh defends. Josh throws two elbows to the body and tries to lock up a kimura, but Nog defends quickly and it's never really a threat. Nog underhooks the leg again, and Josh swings for a kneebar.

    Nog grabs Josh's leg to block. Josh hammerfists twice to the head, then throws three elbows to Nog's forearm. Nog breaks grip, Josh turns his hips over to tighten up the kneebar. Nog has one arm in between, but the wrist is the only thing inside as Josh extends. Nog's leg is fully extended as the bell rings for the end of the round.



    Nog had a total of one takedown that landed him in a dominant position, and one that resulted in him getting put in danger with a leglock. He had one sweep that landed him in Josh's guard. His first mount had some solid GnP and a good sub attempt, but his second mount only lasted twelve seconds and did not include a single punch.

    Barnett landed more often during the standup, knocked Nog down with a punch, stayed active with GnP and landed solid shots by continually standing up in the guard and bringing his full weight down, and had three solid sub attempts to Nog's one, including the kneebar at the end of the fight which was fully extended and had Nog saved by the bell.

    It was a close fight in which both fighters demonstrated great skill and tenacity, but it's one I would give to Barnett, and it's certainly not a robbery.
  8. DaChinkOfSteel is offline

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    Posted On:
    9/11/2006 1:47pm


     Style: Muay Thai, BJJ, TKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Great breakdown! I agree that it could have gone either way, but in the end; Josh had Nog in more danger, while Nog had position on Josh more...judging by Pride's #1 criteria (effort to finish a fight) Josh won...If Nog won, I'm sure just as many people who are calling BS decision would do the same for Barnett...
  9. PoleFighter is offline

    Professional Swede

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    Posted On:
    9/11/2006 2:18pm


     Style: Sandbagged BJJ white belt

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I've seen so many amazing escapes from submissions that I am always hesitate to say someone was saved by the bell. I mean, it's Nog, the guy who comes back from the dead and submits you. Although based on his physique, with long thin legs, I'd think leg locks would be his prime vulnrability.

    After rewatching, I still have Nog eeking it out by the the slimmest of margins. Ah well. This just makes the inevitable rematch a year from now all the more interesting.
    I pointed at him [the panhandler], bringing my rear hand up in a subtle approximation of the double Wu Sau guard that is the default hand position in Wing Chun Kung Fu.

    "Step away," I hissed.
    -Phil Elmore
  10. Fighting Cephalopod is offline
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    Submitting 1d6 Investigators per round

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    Posted On:
    9/11/2006 10:14pm

    supporting member
     Style: ZHOO ZHITSU

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Too late to edit my previous post, but I watched the match /again/ this time on a larger tv so I got a better view of the standup exchanges. My breakdown -

    Bell rings, they circle. Josh connects with a one two, Mino counterpunches with two hooks, one misses but the other connects. Josh circles, misses a jab, parries Mino's jab and tries a counter-right which misses, then parries Mino's one-two. They trade missed jabs. Barnett lands a leg kick, parries a jab and misses a jab.

    Mino connects with a solid one two that snaps Josh's head back. Josh shakes it off and circles, parries a jab and lands a jab. Connects with two hooks to the body, Mino counters with a left hook to the body as Josh clinches. Josh gets a knee and Mino gets a glancing left to the body, they break.

    Josh connects with an overhand right, rides it into the clinch, Mino gets a glancing uppercut as he comes in. Josh throws a knee and breaks the clinch. He slips a one two from Mino. He comes in again, slipping a jab, getting caught with the followup right, but hits Mino with an uppercut that snaps his head back and Mino clinches. Josh pushes him into the ropes as they pummel, Mino turns him around. Josh lands two knees. Mino throws a left hook on the break that misses.

    Josh lands a jab and circles, slips a jab. Blocks a one-two. Hits Mino with a one two to the head, Mino counters with a one-two to the body as Josh clinches. Josh knees the body and breaks the clinch. Josh lands a leg kick.

    Josh circles, lands a jab that snaps Mino's head a bit and lands another leg kick, as Mino misses a counter-right. Mino lands a left hook to the body that sounds like it connects well, and Josh clinches. Josh throws a good knee, followed by a weaker one. Mino throws a knee, and Josh hits him in the body with a left hook (arm punch). Josh blocks another knee and then hits again with the arm-punch left hook to the body. Josh throws two knees, breaks the clinch and throws a left hook that drops Nog, hitting him with a followup right on the way down.

    Up until this point, the two were dead even in terms of power shots landed (six from Josh, six from Mino) but Josh landed 9 clinch knees to Mino's one, and three leg kicks to Mino's none. Very slight edge to Barnett in the standup, cemented by the knockdown. 7:19 left in the round.

    Josh immediately goes down into Nog's half guard. Nog underhooks to sweep, but Josh defends with a crossface. Josh sits up and Nog arm-punches from the bottom; Josh responds with elbows to the body.

    Josh sits up and lands two solid punches, Nog goes to butterfly guard. Nog lands a few arm-punches from the bottom. Josh elbows Nog's thigh two or three times. Josh stands up and comes down with a solid punch, landing in half guard again.

    Josh sits up and lands a right, Nog goes to feet on hips, Josh stands. Nog lands a glancing upkick, Josh lands a solid right to Nog's head, comes down into half again. Nog underhooks the leg for the sweep again, Josh crossfaces him down flat. Nog arm-punches the side of Josh's head from the bottom. Nog gets a butterfly hook in. Josh arm-punches the body and the head, then stands, punches, and comes down into half-guard again. Nog underhooks the leg and comes up for a single, driving Josh into the ropes. Josh underhooks to defend, but eventually gets driven down. Nog immediately passes to half guard.

    Nog gets a few arm punches on Josh and passes to side. Two solid knees to Josh's hip. Josh defends an attempt to take mount. Nog attempts some more punches to Josh's face but is blocked. Josh tries to roll him over, doesn't quite get it, but gets half guard back. Elbows Nog's hip.

    Josh arm-punches from the bottom, Nog arm-punches from the top. Nog sits up and lands one solid punch and one glancing punch to Josh's head, followed by a good punch to the body and punch to the head. Josh sweeps him, but Nog turns it into a scramble and comes up into a single leg. Josh grabs a guillotine. Nog completely abandons the takedown and pummels his arm in to defend. Josh moves out of the corner and lands a knee to Nog's chin as he escapes the guillotine.

    Nog punches, Josh slips it and clinches, Josh lands a knee, breaks the clinch.

    Josh throws a right that looks like it barely grazes Nog, Nog throws a one two that hits Josh's forearms, Josh clinches. Josh lands a knee, Nog lands a glancing uppercut. Breaks clinch.

    Josh lands a one-two solidly and follows it into the clinch. Nog throws a right hook to the body and Josh misses an uppercut. Break clinch.

    Nog throws a jab, into a single, into a rear-bodylock standing, very fluid. Josh tries to break Nog's grip, fails, goes to the ground and into a granby roll, which he turns into a leglock attempt. He has Nog's foot solidly, but is still fighting for hip control to finish. Nog escapes to side control. Total time from the point Josh locked it in to Nog escaping was just about twenty seconds.

    Josh blocks a few punches and a knee, Nog takes mount. Throws five solid shots that connect to Josh's head. Throws a few more that Josh blocks with hand in the biceps. Josh pulls Nog's head down. Nog pops up and lands another solid shot. A few more get defended. Josh arm-punches from the bottom without much effect, holding Nog's wrists. Nog locks in a keylock grip and goes into an armbar.

    Josh has his arms folded, Nog works to break grip. Josh tries to backroll, fails, comes up and stacks Nog. Escapes to side control. Time from lock in to escape was about twenty seconds.

    Josh lands two hammerfists. Nog blocks some more, then Josh lands about five. Nog tries to turn into him for a single, Josh drives him back down. Round ends with Josh on top in side.

    Round 2 starts. Circling, no connecting blows. Nog ducks a punch and picks up a single leg. Barnett lands two uppercuts (arm-punches), sprawls and drives Nog down into half guard. Nog underhooks the leg for the sweep, Barnett drives him flat with a crossface. Josh sits up and misses a punch, stands, connects with a punch and comes back down into butterfly guard. Josh stands again and Nog sweeps him, landing in Josh's guard.

    Josh defends some hammerfists and short hooks. Nog passes to half and almost immediately to mount. Throws two punches, then crossfaces Josh. Josh reverses into Nog's guard. Total time in mount - 12 seconds.

    Ref restarts in the center.

    Josh stands in the guard, comes down with a one-two that connects, back into guard. Tries to pass to half. Nog armdrags, starts taking the back. Has the rear bodylock, lands one punch, gets one hook in. Josh keeps wrist control, defends the other hook, drives Nog down into guard. Total time back was threatened - 22 seconds.

    Josh stands in Nog's guard, controls the ankles. Tries a stomp, misses, comes down in half guard. Nog underhooks for the sweep, Josh defends. Josh throws two elbows to the body and tries to lock up a kimura, but Nog defends quickly and it's never really a threat. Nog underhooks the leg again, and Josh swings for a kneebar.

    Nog grabs Josh's leg to block. Josh hammerfists twice to the head, then throws three elbows to Nog's forearm. Nog breaks grip, Josh turns his hips over to tighten up the kneebar. Nog has one arm in between, but the wrist is the only thing inside as Josh extends. Nog's leg is fully extended as the bell rings for the end of the round.

    Nog had a total of one takedown that landed him in a dominant position, and one that resulted in him getting put in danger with a leglock. He had one sweep that landed him in Josh's guard. His first mount had some solid GnP and a good sub attempt, but his second mount only lasted twelve seconds.

    Barnett landed more during the standup, knocked Nog down with a punch, stayed active with GnP and landed solid shots by continually standing up in the guard and bringing his full weight down, and had three solid sub attempts to Nog's one, including the kneebar at the end of the fight which was fully extended and had Nog saved by the bell.

    I've watched it repeatedly now and I believe it's a close but clear victory for Barnett.
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