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  1. wagamichi is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/13/2006 5:19pm


     Style: wagamichi shorei kempo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Is it time?

    Well here it is. We spend a lot of time rooting out the bullshido in the world, we bitch, we investigate, we uncover. But that is all we do. Can we do more?

    My instructor and a few others mostly LEO black belts had grown tired of the Bullshido in our region. i.e. if you did not point fight at the Saturday tournament you are not a fighter. What ever! Dumbasses.

    So we set out to make a federation of schools that went the other way. Contact, fighting, real techniques that work on unwilling people. Schools that train people to really fight.

    So we set up an organization that was free to join, that does not issue rank for money, an organization that does not even require schools to have rank. They just need to be able to teach real fighting.

    Now granted, being professional training facilities, there will always be elements of Mcdojoisim simply because this ain’t the Make a wish foundation. Someone has to pay for the rent, lights, mats, bags, and so on. But most of these schools use the masses to pay for the real hardcore fighters that want to train.

    So we set up the organization…and then realized there were not enough schools that are not Bullshido in Indiana to make it any sort of real Referral agency for those looking far a good school. The goal was that if it had the federation stamp, you were going to get good instruction.

    Then I find Bullshido. I have seen the conviction of the people on here and spent time myself debating with the brethren about this issue. I have seen the power of the internet brought to bear on those that want to scam the public. As an example, you can’t Google fang shen do without our threads being on the first page. Anyone in Canada will have hours of information to read on that club if they use the net to look up their “new” school.

    I guess what I am saying and asking if we should debate is the need for a “real organization with our members and our members clubs” that can act as a “better business bureau” for the martial arts. Now this would be scam free ****! No fee to join! Instead you prove the right to join.

    Our federation has the heavy hitters from Indy in it. Montero’s Bjj has joined. Integrated fighting has joined. And the rest of the schools I have seen so far are crap and have not been allowed to join. There is no rules, no dues, (I pay to for the web site out of my own pocket.) no interference with any of the clubs. We have seminars and even cross train at each others clubs because we belong to the org.

    Can this concept be taken nation or even world wide? Can this forum turn into more than just a place to vent? Could it become an International stamp of approval (not because the “Grandmaster” says so, but rather because the organization says so.)

    Given the diversity of arts represented here, there would have to be divisions like TMA, Sport arts, Weapons arts, you get the picture. It is not important what linage or method one teaches or does but rather does it work?

    Is it time for us to do this. We have the collective power to be “something” over night. The question is should we? And how do we do it without the ego and politics getting in that ruin every other org. The fact that it would be free of money would be a good start.

    The fact that to join, if not known, you would actualy have to show what you do to a rep in that region that decides yea or nay. your $200.00 entry fee means nothing. Show what you do at a throw down in your area to join.
    What think you?
    When You absolutely have to hide a body...try Alaska.
  2. wagamichi is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/13/2006 5:31pm


     Style: wagamichi shorei kempo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Oh yea, before I am accused of it, i am not trying to get people to join my org. thats why i did not post the site. I am not spaming.

    But basicly the operations of the org would be charter clubs (those in the org) A hit list (those being investigated or pending approval) and a black list (those messured and found wanting)
    When You absolutely have to hide a body...try Alaska.
  3. pauli is offline

    i keep tryin to spar, but nothin happens!

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    Posted On:
    8/13/2006 5:51pm

    supporting member
     Style: karate / bjj

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    i think your list terminology could use some work. "you want me to sign up for a hit list, at the risk of being blacklisted?"
  4. Ke?poFist is offline
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    Enforcer of Northeast Anti-Silliness Department Inc.

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    Posted On:
    8/13/2006 5:54pm

    supporting member
     Style: Kaju, BJJ, Judo, Kempo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I see the politics of this thing overcoming it after a year or so of inception. If it were to be a seal of approval for schools who train "alive" and "hard" then that's all well and good but then wouldn't it be easier to just check the records of guys from said schools competitions to judge the schools worth in that regard? For a "TMA" section, the politics would be mind-numbing. And what if a school was good, but then went McDojo? Would the org be willing to turn on one of their own for acts of blasphemy like that, and kick them out publically? I suppose since no money would be involved it would reduce the corruption in that regard, but I still feel like it's more of a headache than it's worth.
    Knowing is not enough, you must apply...
    ...Willing is not enough you must do
    ~Bruce Lee

  5. wagamichi is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/13/2006 5:55pm


     Style: wagamichi shorei kempo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by pauli
    i think your list terminology could use some work. "you want me to sign up for a hit list, at the risk of being blacklisted?"

    Well change it to pending and found and investigating. Like for coda scott.
    When You absolutely have to hide a body...try Alaska.
  6. wagamichi is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/13/2006 5:56pm


     Style: wagamichi shorei kempo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by KempoFist
    I see the politics of this thing overcoming it after a year or so of inception. If it were to be a seal of approval for schools who train "alive" and "hard" then that's all well and good but then wouldn't it be easier to just check the records of guys from said schools competitions to judge the schools worth in that regard? For a "TMA" section, the politics would be mind-numbing. And what if a school was good, but then went McDojo? Would the org be willing to turn on one of their own for acts of blasphemy like that, and kick them out publically? I suppose since no money would be involved it would reduce the corruption in that regard, but I still feel like it's more of a headache than it's worth.

    It would be a ton of work for sure. But worth it?
    When You absolutely have to hide a body...try Alaska.
  7. Soju_King is offline
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    Welterweight

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    Posted On:
    8/13/2006 5:57pm

    supporting member
     Style: Tae-Ninjitsu Mu Sool

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    so u going back to the old days of schools proving thier systems......sounds like a good direction despite the challenges by freedom of enterprise from which

    mc dojang cowards can hide under. have fun
  8. mrblackmagic is offline
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    My pleasure.

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    Posted On:
    8/13/2006 6:19pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: yang taichi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I rather like Bullshido as a grass roots movement. I don't know how I'd feel if we became "The Man."
    Sumus extra manum tuam.
  9. Lv1Sierpinski is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/13/2006 7:56pm


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I think in practice a large organization is a bad idea. Ultimately we want people to ask questions about schools, training methods, instructors, etc.; and an organization that seeks to stamp a school just absolves people of that responsibility. I think a much better way to go would be for local MA schools to interact with each other more to both raise the game and to help people find solid training (which sounds like what was initially started with wag's org so kudos!). Branching out is a logistical nightmare that I think would lead to problems (some of which have been already raised).

    I think the most beneficial thing to do would be for anyone interested to get the word of throwdowns and similar collective training events to any schools in their area and go from there. Even contacting Mcdojos in the spirit of collaboration would be good; don't call them out, but send out the invite, introduce people to the notion that full contact is not as dangerous as they think and that full resistance aids training, and slowly the entire local scene is improved.

    Anyway that's just my take on it.
  10. bodhistate is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/13/2006 10:11pm


     Style: pa-kua

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Next up the gov gets involved, and they start taxing and regulating instruction, and unless you want to learn a clean and sanitized version of MMA (lawsuits, remember, from stupid people will show up left and right), you won't be able to do any MA unless it is underground.

    Sounds like your idea, while well-intentioned, aims at all schools looking the same, acting the same, and striving for the same thing, which is hardly the case. You'd turn MA into boxing.
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