233145 Bullies, 3521 online  
  • Register
Our Sponsors:

Results 111 to 120 of 140
Page 12 of 14 FirstFirst ... 289101112 1314 LastLast
Sponsored Links Spacer Image
  1. rw4th is offline
    rw4th's Avatar

    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    1,022

    Posted On:
    10/10/2006 2:48pm


     Style: BJJ,MT,RBSD (on hiatus)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I am aware of various "flinch responses" in RBSD. The idea is this - Firstly, traditional blocks won't work. Secondly, all of us have an inbuilt ability to flinch when attacked. In fact it is hard not to. The idea is to try and capitolise on that flinch, developing the movement into something useful if a strike is thrown at you. The better guys, in my view, do acknowledge that it is far far best to hit first if there is a chance you'll be attacked anyway.

    The style of these flinch responses are varied indeed and, in my view, absolutely none of them can give a guarantee of success. Some of these so called flinches look contrary to any natural movements whatsoever!

    I have pressure tested a couple of positions that can work well but, again, with no guarantee of success - you still get a punch in the bonce every now and again. It truly is better to hit first.

    In short, some can work, some rarely work, but they are in no way related to the big blocking movements of many traditional arts. And if you train them? Get ready to take some shots sometimes.
    Protect your head and move. I like Rodney Kingís Crazy Monkey defense but there are other good ones. As for flinch responses: you need to anchor the reflex of protecting your head to your flinch.

    I don't have massive disagreement with your view of the Shredder. I think it can be a useful tool. I have surprised people with the partial shredder, and it has let me improve my position even more. But it is based on inducing, and then bypassing, a flinch. If some guy is hyped up, rock hard and totally committed? Well, you can't bypass a flinch that isn't there.
    The reason the Shredder fails against a trained fighter is that it requires control over the head and nobody who is trained will easily give up that control. Iíve seen people make it work but itís usually largely due to the fact that they had superior skill and attributes to begin with which allowed them to gain control of the clinch and take the personís back. Just because you see Dimitri make it work doesnít mean youíll be able to: heís in great shape and a good fighter.

    I'm not sure that I agree that MMA training alone is the physical side. It is great and blows just about every other competitive fighting style away. After all, it got to take the best from everyone and pressure test it all in competition! So how can it be bettered?

    Well, with great difficulty. But taking notice of the differences between a MMA fight and a street confrontation provide us clues. Heres a few:-

    No gloves renders punching to the head pretty dangerous to your own hand, so open handed blows can be researched.
    MMA gloves are pretty thin and not wearing them renders punching more dangerous to the head then the hand. The palm strike can be useful, but only once youíre developed the ability to deliver proper strikes and that is done by learning some form of boxing, kickboxing or Muay Thai. Itís about developing the footwork, techniques, and attributes for effective striking.

    Crowded areas - what groundwork is going to be easy when theres hardly room to swing a cat? And what is there that could be picked up to hit the guy with? Or, worse still, he pick it up and hit you? Trying to stay on your feet and learning how to identify and use improvised weapons might be a good idea.
    Controlling the clinch and getting good position on the ground are REQUIRED skills to staying on your feet, and getting back up if grounded. Hard training in a grappling system like BJJ is the only way to develop these skills, not magic ďanti-grappleĒ techniques.

    Multiple opponents - Hard to beat. But the use of your surroundings, and doing drills incorporating multiples, is going to set you in greater stead than merely preparing for one guy all the time.
    Etc.
    Your physical delivery system as well as properly developed attributes are still required. Thereís no getting away from it. The rest is strategy and the ability to run fast.
  2. bujutsuboy is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    66

    Posted On:
    10/10/2006 3:29pm


     Style: Self Protection

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    You quote me agreeing with you,a nd then go on to disagree with me when I'm agreeing with you.... go figure.

    Shurma, or whatever your name is. You're just being fucking ignorant. So what, you beat a guy who said he was a Senshido student with your grappling skills? Big deal? I've beaten boxers, kickboxers and grapplers..... and do you know what? Some have beaten me? That doesn't mean I have to behave like a prick, with glib put downs and inane bullshit. I'm also a guy saying it isn't the be all and end all, you dim wit.

    As for your lack of appreciation of the more tactical side of self protection, that's just you being an idiot. I can't tell a blind man what the colour red looks like.
  3. Shuma-Gorath is offline
    Shuma-Gorath's Avatar

    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Posts
    6,608

    Posted On:
    10/10/2006 5:54pm

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ - Homeland Security

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by bujutsuboy
    As for your lack of appreciation of the more tactical side of self protection, that's just you being an idiot. I can't tell a blind man what the colour red looks like.
    You could, however, tell me why verbal drilling isn't a poor form of acting.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Wastrel
    I think the forum's traditionally light-handed approach to moderation has become untenable.
  4. bujutsuboy is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    66

    Posted On:
    10/11/2006 8:19am


     Style: Self Protection

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    It is a form of acting, though there is no script. And, of course, the quality of it will depend on the skill and experience of the people using it. The term "role play" may be more appropriate in some ways.

    The very best and most successful business organisations use role play in their own staffs' training, development and promotion. So it can be just a tad more than poor acting.

    The ideas to use it effectively include:-

    * Consciously trying to use an approiate conflict resolution strategy as you go. It's easy to sit behind a keyboard and say "All you need is a personality", but see how you feel when you're doing it in front of a live audience and begin to dry up, as many do at first.

    * The "bad guy" responding as they see fit, within peramters of trying to keep it real.

    * Varying the apporach by the bad guy, from a long term "winding himself up" process, to a shot term explosive manner, and everything in between. No pre determined scripts. Keep them guessing and thinking.

    * Keeping going to a conclusion no matter what so, if the person being trained fooks up? Keep going anyway, no "can I stop and try again."

    * Keeping contact levels appropriate to the skills and expereince of the person being trained. So when training the top guys? Go for 'em, but obviously be more progressive over time with the lesser able.

    * Not always attacking. Hey, if the student does a great job of talking the role player down, that's great. Sometimes let 'em go. Sometimes appear to let 'em go, and then go for them anyway.

    * Freating different scenarios based on real life. From the mugger starting off with "Can you lend me 5 pounds?", to the basic thug's "You've been staring at me!" etc. etc. Familiarity breeds skill, and these kinds of things happen for real.

    * Perform under the eyes of the rest of the class. This helps in both the feedback you will get after the event (what went well, what could be improved etc.) as well as the butterflies felt during the scenario itself. Filing it, as well as debriefing it later, has a simlar effect.

    * Throwing different things into the equation without warning like, for example, half through a scenario let another guy come wading in to threaten the student, and the drawing of a weapon etc. Keep them in their toes.

    It does go on and on. I don't claim to be an expert, neither.

    One of the main problems with RBSD is that any old arse-hole can set himself up as an "expert", and the naive can follow blindly. Its a bit like McDojo arts in this regard. Luckily, this can't happen too much in MMA, because the first sparring session sorts out the wheat from the chaf.

    But there is still plenty of wheat in the RBSD world. Don't reject it as crap because of dumb idiots like Phil Elmore and Dan Webre. I remember a clip somewhere of so called "scenario training" that was truly awful. Some young lady stood in the middle of the room, and then the "bad guy" comes up and walks around her for a while. He says something like "Will you be my chick-a-dee?" and she starts to hit him.... poorly. But don't tar us all with the same brush. Good scenario training is a lot better than that shite.

    You will either appreciate the value of adapting MMA techniques into the wide world of self protection, or you will not. The racing driver can, indeed, do brilliantly well as a Diplomatic Protection driver. Unless he keeps pointing at the poor DP drivers and saying "See! It must all be a load of ****."

    Theres a lot more than what you call "verbal drilling." If you even get to that stage it is because lots of the other stuff has already failed for whatever reason. Stuff which keeps good people far far safer than any top MMA fighter who does not pay heed to it.

    Good luck, wherever your head takes ya.
  5. Shuma-Gorath is offline
    Shuma-Gorath's Avatar

    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Posts
    6,608

    Posted On:
    10/11/2006 8:28am

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ - Homeland Security

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by bujutsuboy
    You will either appreciate the value of adapting MMA techniques into the wide world of self protection, or you will not. The racing driver can, indeed, do brilliantly well as a Diplomatic Protection driver. Unless he keeps pointing at the poor DP drivers and saying "See! It must all be a load of ****."
    Is your training a series of strained analogies?
    Quote Originally Posted by The Wastrel
    I think the forum's traditionally light-handed approach to moderation has become untenable.
  6. bujutsuboy is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    66

    Posted On:
    10/11/2006 9:04am


     Style: Self Protection

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Is yours a series of shite put downs?

    Look at your Avator. You know that guy who lives in there? How do you think he is protected?

    Do they just hire the best shots in the world to fire back when the President is under attack.... or do they have guys with brains who constantly plan for different scenarios, spending their time avoiding, escaping and dissuading attacks, as well as learning how to deal with the few attacks that will get through these other layers.

    Your no doubt enterteining yourself with your glib point scoring. But your showing me that you have no idea what self protection is all about. And we started so well.

    Anyway, congratulations are in order. You win this weeks "Wanker of the Week!" award! You pipped Kung Fools to the post!

    Well done Wanker! My heartiest conragtualtions! Enjoy sitting in your throne, but try not to stain the seat.

    I'll only be back to answer good questions. But for you? Bye now!
    Last edited by bujutsuboy; 10/11/2006 9:09am at .
  7. Shuma-Gorath is offline
    Shuma-Gorath's Avatar

    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Posts
    6,608

    Posted On:
    10/11/2006 9:36am

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ - Homeland Security

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by bujutsuboy
    Is yours a series of shite put downs?

    Look at your Avator. You know that guy who lives in there? How do you think he is protected?
    My photo would indicate that he's protected by Rorion Gracie.

    Do they just hire the best shots in the world to fire back when the President is under attack.... or do they have guys with brains who constantly plan for different scenarios, spending their time avoiding, escaping and dissuading attacks, as well as learning how to deal with the few attacks that will get through these other layers.
    Were you briefed on the details of the hiring process for the secret service before or after you started posting in this thread?

    I'll only be back to answer good questions. But for you? Bye now!
    Last edited by Shuma-Gorath; 10/11/2006 9:40am at .
    Quote Originally Posted by The Wastrel
    I think the forum's traditionally light-handed approach to moderation has become untenable.
  8. bujutsuboy is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    66

    Posted On:
    10/11/2006 10:54am


     Style: Self Protection

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Hey, he's going for next week's award!

    That's ambition.
  9. Kungfoolss is offline

    I restore the Balance

    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Sunny Hawaii
    Posts
    4,972

    Posted On:
    10/11/2006 1:53pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: I wear pants

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by bujutsuboy
    It is a form of acting, though there is no script. And, of course, the quality of it will depend on the skill and experience of the people using it. The term "role play" may be more appropriate in some ways.

    The very best and most successful business organisations use role play in their own staffs' training, development and promotion. So it can be just a tad more than poor acting.

    The ideas to use it effectively include:-

    * Consciously trying to use an approiate conflict resolution strategy as you go. It's easy to sit behind a keyboard and say "All you need is a personality", but see how you feel when you're doing it in front of a live audience and begin to dry up, as many do at first.

    * The "bad guy" responding as they see fit, within peramters of trying to keep it real.

    * Varying the apporach by the bad guy, from a long term "winding himself up" process, to a shot term explosive manner, and everything in between. No pre determined scripts. Keep them guessing and thinking.

    * Keeping going to a conclusion no matter what so, if the person being trained fooks up? Keep going anyway, no "can I stop and try again."

    * Keeping contact levels appropriate to the skills and expereince of the person being trained. So when training the top guys? Go for 'em, but obviously be more progressive over time with the lesser able.

    * Not always attacking. Hey, if the student does a great job of talking the role player down, that's great. Sometimes let 'em go. Sometimes appear to let 'em go, and then go for them anyway.

    * Freating different scenarios based on real life. From the mugger starting off with "Can you lend me 5 pounds?", to the basic thug's "You've been staring at me!" etc. etc. Familiarity breeds skill, and these kinds of things happen for real.

    * Perform under the eyes of the rest of the class. This helps in both the feedback you will get after the event (what went well, what could be improved etc.) as well as the butterflies felt during the scenario itself. Filing it, as well as debriefing it later, has a simlar effect.

    * Throwing different things into the equation without warning like, for example, half through a scenario let another guy come wading in to threaten the student, and the drawing of a weapon etc. Keep them in their toes.
    This is why I dislike RBSD kooks, they've always got some monotonous fantasy list. The fact they created such a list, underscores the reality that they have virtually no comprehension that life never follows a predictable path.

    I don't claim to be an expert, neither.
    That much is obvious.
    Kungfoolss, Scourge of the theory-based stylists, Most Feared man at Bullshido.com, and the Preeminent Force in the martial arts political arena
  10. Kungfoolss is offline

    I restore the Balance

    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Sunny Hawaii
    Posts
    4,972

    Posted On:
    10/11/2006 1:58pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: I wear pants

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Shuma-Gorath
    Is your training a series of strained analogies?
    I was thinking they were dreary and unimaginative postings.
    Kungfoolss, Scourge of the theory-based stylists, Most Feared man at Bullshido.com, and the Preeminent Force in the martial arts political arena
Page 12 of 14 FirstFirst ... 289101112 1314 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Powered by vBulletin™© contact@vbulletin.com vBulletin Solutions, Inc. 2011 All rights reserved.