Step right up! Take your shots at Kuk Sool Won!

**Backdraft** · Posted On: 7/25/2006 11:17am

What the **** are the pink fans for?

**Wolf** · Posted On: 7/25/2006 11:35am

Originally Posted by oni

but really, the uniforms. i mean, HOW can you train in a roll neck sweater thing?

We don't train in those uniforms. We train in plain black doboks. Usually there is a set of patches you get from the WKSA, but it's a regular dobok. My current one I got for $40 from my instructor which he got through tigerclaw. Those you speak of are for demo only.

Originally Posted by Backdraft

What the **** are the pink fans for?

Well, the fan is a traditional Korean Royal Court weapon. One starts learning to use it at 3rd Dahn. This includes strikes with it folded up as well as strikes with it open because they were somtimes made to have sharpened spines. As I understand it this weapon was traditionally used by the female bodyguards of the Royal Court because it was eaily concealed. As for why they're pink today. My guess is that in Korea the color pink doesn't have the same feminine connotation it does here. Though, I could be wrong on that last one. Any Korean historians (DerAuslander) feel free to correct me if I'm wrong about the history at all.

**Lu Tze** · Posted On: 7/25/2006 12:13pm

KSWolf you're no fun to troll, you're far too rational and coherent.

Originally Posted by KSWolf

Examples please? I've always had to break standard 10x12 pine boards. And now they're speed breaks which means they're barely held, making them more difficult to break. I'm not stating there's any practical app to breaking, but you brought it up, so I'm telling you I haven't seen any difference in our breaking as other styles.

Your wish is my command.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yH55Y...k%20sool%20won

Those kicks, such power, such vigour... I think his next trick was breaking matchsticks or something...

I believe this is technically the attitude after one receives blackbelt. However, I have never once heard of it being enforced. Anymore, I don't think anyone cares. We even have at least master who has been cross-training in BJJ in an effort to expand the ground game of his students.

[..]

It's respect, not worship. He's the founder of the style, so we respect him. When I see him in real life, I bow to him. He, unlike some styles, is an extremely personable guy. He'll shoot the **** with even the lowest grades and tell jokes with you. People respect him because he doesn't COMMAND respect. He knows we pay his bills, and treats us like real people, not subjects.

The policy stated above about cross training being forbidden, that's official policy right? Well this man is the personification of the institution that instigated that policy, in all likelyhood it came directly from him. How can you respect that? And if you ignore the policy then you obviously don't respect him as much as you say.

Face it, KSW is mcdojo from the top down. There are probably good schools and good people in it, but at the heart it's just a huge mc-franchise designed to wring money out of people, it's pretty much the embodiment of everything that Bullshido stands against.

Edit: wurst speelung eror evar.

***WhiteShark*** · Posted On: 7/25/2006 12:27pm

KSWolf if you had waited a week you wouldn't have ahd to post this thread. You will understand your martial position better on Saturday.

**BackFistMonkey** · Posted On: 7/25/2006 12:34pm

Originally Posted by WhiteShark

KSWolf if you had waited a week you wouldn't have ahd to post this thread. You will understand your martial position better on Saturday.

Which brings me to my question ..

KSWolf ... are you really gonna try to bang using "straight" KSW ? You have no other Martial Art experience ?

**hvyhands81** · Posted On: 7/25/2006 12:42pm

I believe this is technically the attitude after one receives blackbelt. However, I have never once heard of it being enforced. Anymore, I don't think anyone cares. We even have at least master who has been cross-training in BJJ in an effort to expand the ground game of his students.

Its also in an attempt to boost enrollment. Many "traditional" schools are now incorporating bjj to get people in the door. Its like saying 'welcome to the mcdojo/jang would you like fries with that'.

I'm just playin, I havent had a chance to see a kuk sool wan practitioner up close, looking forward to it.

**Wolf** · Posted On: 7/25/2006 1:33pm

Originally Posted by Lu Tze

KSWolf you're no fun to troll, you're far too rational and coherent.

Sorry to ruin your fun. :icon_bigg

Your wish is my command.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yH55Y...k%20sool%20won

Those kicks, such power, such vigour... I think his next trick was breaking matchsticks or something...

After my last post I kind I realised that I forgot about tournament breaking which you have posted a video of. Basically, I won't defend tournament stuff. While I think they're fun to compete in, I think the tournaments can use a lot of improvement. For one reason or another they use 6x12 boards for tournament breaking which, as you said, are probably eaiser than matchsticks. When we do breaking for tests or demos (at least in all my experiences both participating and watching) we use the standard 10x12 yellow pine boards.

The policy stated above about cross training being forbidden, that's official policy right? Well this man is the personification of the institution that instigated that policy, in all likelyhood it came directly from him. How can you respect that? And if you ignore the policy then you obviously don't respect him as much as you say.

Yes it was a policy handed down by Kuk Sa Nim (that's the title he holds). However (and I've not read the rule anywhere, so I don't know the exact wording) I have been told the rule is more about getting certified in other Associations and teaching conflicting material (i.e. TKD style striking vs. ours). My own instructor has crosstrained in a number of different arts and Kuk Sa Nim knows this. I don't think there is a problem with cross training as long as you you don't teach conflicting material. (Note: This is my interpretation of the rule based on what I've seen in practice)

Face it, KSW is mcdojo from the top down. There are probably good schools and good people in it, but at the heart it's just a huge mc-franchise designed to wring money out of people, it's pretty much the embodiment of everything that Bullshido stands against.

Edit: wurst speelung eror evar.

Is it a mcdojo from teh top down? Maybe...it IS a business. I won't deny that at all. Not all MA's can survive without taking in money. Are there Mcdojoish practices, sure. KSW is billed as a "family martial art." That means it does cater to children to some degree. That has been cited on this forum as one criteria for McDojoism. However, that doesn't mean that the training you receive is any less effective. I would say it's certainly not designed to wring money out of people. The school I go to charges $70/mo for training. I think that's pretty reasonable actually. It's my understanding that while, McDojoism is frowned upon on this site, what Bullshido is really against is...well...Bullshido (i.e. teachers teaching what they have no business teaching) Though I guess my understanding of Bullshido could be off as well.

The other thing I could think of that might be McDojoish are somewhat expensive BB testing fees. Yes they are somewhat expensive, but you test only promote every 4 years or so. You're allowed to break up the fees into multiple payments, and if you're a school owner these are tax writeoffs anyway.

Originally Posted by WhiteShark

KSWolf if you had waited a week you wouldn't have ahd to post this thread. You will understand your martial position better on Saturday.

Perhaps. I'm not a blindfaith kind of person. It's entirely possibly my MA perspective will change after the TD. I like to think I have a pretty wide open perspective as it is though.

Originally Posted by BackFistMonkey

Which brings me to my question ..

KSWolf ... are you really gonna try to bang using "straight" KSW ? You have no other Martial Art experience ?

As far as striking goes KSW is it. That's what I plan to use. Grappling is another story though. I have some VERY basic BJJ training from another guy I work with. I'll admit, I think on the ground BJJ is superior to KSW.

Now, when it comes to KSW's jointlocks and throws and such...my view is that these techniques are of better use in a situation where you're opponent is not facing you in a situation where both parties are expecting to lock up and grapple. They're more responsive techniques. I have trained these with resistive training, which I can go into more detail if you'd like. Some work well, others need work, or don't at all. This is the difference I think with a fight and sport. That being a difference of expectations. In the sport, both guys know what the other is skilled at and plays to that. In a fight, neither of us knows. So, I may throw punches/kicks with this guy, or if he tries to grab me that's when I respond with a technique.

I have actually used the locks and throws agains some of my friends/family in friendly sparring sessions successfully. One of my favorite things to do is to use one of the hip throws we learn to take a guy down then submit him. Though this has only worked repeatedly on my lesser trained friends. I can get the throw sometimes on more trained people, but my submissions aren't great.

Originally Posted by hvyhands81

Its also in an attempt to boost enrollment. Many "traditional" schools are now incorporating bjj to get people in the door. Its like saying 'welcome to the mcdojo/jang would you like fries with that'.

I'm just playin, I havent had a chance to see a kuk sool wan practitioner up close, looking forward to it.

Yeah, at least it's recognition that the art is lacking somewhere, and they're not all of a sudden saying, "Wait, we just discovered the MYDTJ has t3h d34dly guillotine choke. It's always been in our style! We just didn't know it!"

***WhiteShark*** · Posted On: 7/25/2006 1:40pm

Perhaps. I'm not a blindfaith kind of person. It's entirely possibly my MA perspective will change after the TD. I like to think I have a pretty wide open perspective as it is though.

Yeah I agree he is much too reasonable to troll :P

I thought this was a challenge thread by the title.

**Wolf** · Posted On: 7/25/2006 1:44pm

Sorry, I may train in KSW and enjoy it a lot, but I like to think I'm not a total KSW nutrider. I'm CERTAINLY no Pagan (and he didn't even know what the hell he was talking about)!

**Dagon Akujin** · Posted On: 7/25/2006 1:50pm

How do cut grass

****! Limited to 20 pics? Anyway, this is just too easy. I'm through not even 5% of what Yahoo came up with, and I still had to cut off 15 pics.

Um... explain?

Dagon

P.S. Korea sucks.