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  1. MONGO is offline

    Middleweight

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    Posted On:
    7/12/2006 8:23am

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     Style: na

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    From my experience, not much is taught. Mostly because the philosophy and focus is completely different.

    They have evolved apart over the paths that they have taken.
  2. Teh El Macho is offline
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    Posted On:
    7/12/2006 9:52am

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     Style: creonte on hiatus

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    What Mongo said. I just enrolled at this BJJ school (the second one I've been to), and, just like the one I previously went, beyond single and double leg takedowns there is no stand-up at all. Compare that to the typical Judo school where 80% or more is purely stand-up. Or to look it another way, a BJJ school will be mostly gi and no-gi grappling complimented with wrestling takedowns, whereas a typical Judo school will devote 20% or less to newaza (grappling.)

    They are two completely different animals... that can complement each other rather nicely if you have the time, inclination and a brain free of nutriding neural pathways. Here, read this article regarding BJJ and Judo. It's like milk, that is, it will do you good :)

    http://www.bestjudo.com/article6.shtml
    Read this for flexibility and injury prevention, this, this and this for supplementation, this on grip conditioning, and this on staph. New: On strenght standards, relationships and structural balance. Shoulder problems? Read this.

    My crapuous vlog and my blog of training, stuff and crap. NEW: Me, Mrs. Macho and our newborn baby.

    New To Weight Training? Get the StrongLifts 5x5 program and Rippetoe's "Starting Strength, 2nd Ed". Wanna build muscle/gain weight? Check this article. My review on Tactical Nutrition here.

    t-nation - Dissecting the deadlift. Anatomy and Muscle Balancing Videos.

    The street argument is retarded. BJJ is so much overkill for the street that its ridiculous. Unless you're the idiot that picks a fight with the high school wrestling team, barring knife or gun play, the opponent shouldn't make it past double leg + ground and pound - Osiris
  3. rokutanda is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/12/2006 12:04pm


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I started BJJ about a month and a half ago, twice or three times a week. Haven't learned any standup/judo throws/takedowns yet, although I'm sure a few of the ground positions/submissions in the BJJ I've learned might also be found in judo.

    Went to my first judo class yesterday, where I'll train once a week so I can learn some throws/takedowns... I think the two styles could complement each other well.
  4. War Wizard is offline
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    Posted On:
    7/12/2006 12:08pm


     Style: Judo - Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    The only standup we've worked in my BJJ classes are takedown defenses and your basic single or double leg takedowns. Judo, on the other hand is spent about 50/50 standup/ground.
    "Keep a sharp knife, shiny boots and be on time."
  5. lazyartist101 is offline

    Featherweight

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    Posted On:
    7/12/2006 8:04pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: judo/enshin karate/mma

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    a question about judo in self defense i dont want to start another thread. ok i get into a altercation or self defense situation. they guy attacks i throw him to the ground with a judo throw. my question is now what do i do next.. i know there are some submissions i could follow up with maybe. but i already have standing position why go to the ground.

    now i kinow alot of people say run ,but what if im in a closed area and throwing someone does not T.K.O them.

    what am i supppose to do. wait for him to get back up.

    i liek judo and jujitsu,but before i sign up for a class. i kind of want to know where practionersw fall on this.
  6. MONGO is offline

    Middleweight

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    Posted On:
    7/12/2006 8:10pm

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     Style: na

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    If your opponent is not finished and you need to finish him, you can pin or mount and then strike him into unconciousness. You may also decide to use chokes or submissions to injure/incapacitate him until you can get away. You will need to go to the ground to perform those movements, just a fact of life.

    It is possible to perform standing chokes but they are easily excaped unless you are extremely good at them.
  7. Teh El Macho is offline
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    Posted On:
    7/12/2006 8:45pm

    supporting member
     Style: creonte on hiatus

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by lazyartist101
    a question about judo in self defense i dont want to start another thread. ok i get into a altercation or self defense situation. they guy attacks i throw him to the ground with a judo throw. my question is now what do i do next..
    If you get the throw right, most likely your opponent will be stunned/in pain/unconcious. When you practice, you more or less control how your partner falls, but you can make the throw happen in a way that your opponent falls on his head for example. Now consider if it occurs on concrete.

    That's basically the idea in Judo; you end the fight with a powerfull throw. Easier said than done, but that's why practice is important ;)

    Quote Originally Posted by lazyartist101
    i know there are some submissions i could follow up with maybe. but i already have standing position why go to the ground.
    Wait, wait, wait. Things are not that simple and clean. And you are thinking too much ;)

    First, don't assume you are or will be standing. In a fight, you never have 100% control, and you may end up going to the ground. I had an altercation with a cocky aikidoka once who, in his infinite arrogance tried to hip-throw me. Surprise, surprise, I clinged to him like a baby lemur to its mother, brought him down with him, and ended with my knee on his belly.

    Also, you may be going to the ground by design. You can make a throw much more powerfull by falling on top of him. Not only is your opponent striking the ground with the force of his weight, but with your own.

    You don't really want to go to the ground, but you should never expect that you will always be standing. That would be a very dangerous assumption.

    Whether you remain standing or falling with your opponent will be dictated by the circumstances, by his experience, and by your experience.

    Quote Originally Posted by lazyartist101
    now i kinow alot of people say run ,but what if im in a closed area and throwing someone does not T.K.O them.

    what am i supppose to do. wait for him to get back up.
    No. No. No. Just because Judo doesn't allow striking in practice or competitions, that does not mean that you will close your mind and do strictly Judo in a real life confrontation.

    If you went down with him, most likely you are in close to be in a better position from which to mount him and punch/elbow/knee the **** out of him. Or you can try to submit him if you are confident enough for that. You'll do what you need to do in that case (submit him, punch him into a pulp or until you can get up and get the **** out.)

    This actually happened to me. I had an argument when I was in HS, and I was thrown to the ground (with something resembling a seio nage); it caught me by surprise, stunned me and before I realized, the fucker was on top of me raining punches. One of my classmates managed to pull him away from me and my face resembled a fucking, gigantic rasberry. Submission by punching-jitsu :viking:

    Ok, back to the topic... If you are standing and you cannot run and your opponent is not KOed, kick the **** out of him. Don't let him get up; if he tries to get up, kick him. If he is managing to get up, clinch him and throw him again.

    Quote Originally Posted by lazyartist101
    i liek judo and jujitsu,but before i sign up for a class. i kind of want to know where practionersw fall on this.
    Judo and Jujitsu gives you tools. Tools have advantages and limitations, and the best thing is 1) be aware of them and 2) to crosstrain.

    Having said that, if you have a minimal, yet decent training in a single effective art, be it Judo, JJ, BJJ, Boxing, MT, whatever, you'll have a much better chance to defend yourself against your average, uneducated punk.
    Read this for flexibility and injury prevention, this, this and this for supplementation, this on grip conditioning, and this on staph. New: On strenght standards, relationships and structural balance. Shoulder problems? Read this.

    My crapuous vlog and my blog of training, stuff and crap. NEW: Me, Mrs. Macho and our newborn baby.

    New To Weight Training? Get the StrongLifts 5x5 program and Rippetoe's "Starting Strength, 2nd Ed". Wanna build muscle/gain weight? Check this article. My review on Tactical Nutrition here.

    t-nation - Dissecting the deadlift. Anatomy and Muscle Balancing Videos.

    The street argument is retarded. BJJ is so much overkill for the street that its ridiculous. Unless you're the idiot that picks a fight with the high school wrestling team, barring knife or gun play, the opponent shouldn't make it past double leg + ground and pound - Osiris
  8. RoninPimp is offline
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    BJJ Black Belt

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    Posted On:
    7/12/2006 8:49pm

    supporting member
     Style: Rex Kwon Do

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    This thread hurts my brain...Ignorence must indeed be bliss...
  9. Method2Madness is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/12/2006 9:00pm


     Style: BJJ and MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    If your teacher knows judo then you should expect some judo throws to be taught at some point in time. My teacher is a black belt in judo, but prefers to teach wrestling take downs. He does, however, teach judo techniques when someone asks him too. So it really depends on what your teacher knows and what he prefers to teach.
  10. pauli is offline

    i keep tryin to spar, but nothin happens!

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    herndon, va, usa
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    Posted On:
    7/13/2006 12:42am

    supporting member
     Style: karate / bjj

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    a question about judo in self defense i dont want to start another thread. ok i get into a altercation or self defense situation. they guy attacks i throw him to the ground with a judo throw. my question is now what do i do next..
    you've thrown your attacker beautifully. he drops from waist height onto the hard concrete, and is stunned for the moment. two voices echo in your head, one talking about what has just happened, and the other about what is about to happen.

    "ippon!"

    "GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL GOL GOL GOL GOL!!!!!!!"

    (and for the original question, the takedown game i've seen from most bjj guys consists of clumsy double legs they just saw on ufc, or a good double leg they learned while wrestling.)
    Last edited by pauli; 7/13/2006 12:44am at .
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