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  1. newfieguy30 is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/08/2006 1:45pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: kenpo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Hmm that is interesting. Personally, I wouldn' t feel comfortable wearing my black belt in a new school and style which I had no prior knowledge of. Thats why I'd start back at White all over again, because its totally new.
  2. Cdnronin is offline

    Ghost of Kawaishi

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    Posted On:
    7/08/2006 5:02pm


     Style: judo, parenting

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    So jean, do you believe that what you learned from Jacques Dionne is actually a 12th century Japanese art? Or is it something he learned from Jeff Davis(who as you say tested him for black belt), the Takahashis and maybe his life long friend Gerry Perrier?
  3. unibrow is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/09/2006 6:26am


     Style: jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Cdnronin
    So jean, do you believe that what you learned from Jacques Dionne is actually a 12th century Japanese art? Or is it something he learned from Jeff Davis(who as you say tested him for black belt), the Takahashis and maybe his life long friend Gerry Perrier?
    I believe It's an amalgamation of all starting with the Matsumoto system with which he trained for 10 years in first. Jack was a martial analyst & continually trained & dissected methodologies & techniques (and his bb's & some unfortunate bar patrons while working with the likes of Gerry Barber-grin).

    During those years Jack was training with Tad and Gerry was working his way up and giving Therien's Jitsu credibility and paying his mortgage (Therien is all business and will wring you dry-hence why Gerry got fed up and left to go to "Nasty's" club-seems to be a common occurance there...) Gerry used to come & show Jack some of that canryu techniques and Jack always brutally reversed them. Man what a pleasure to see these two scrap. One instance in Virginia they started to try & dismantle each other on the seminar floor (bored with whatever the workshop was supposed to be) and both came away with torn shirts, bloody faces, and a few nasty aftereffects from blunt trauma hits and big smiles on their faces (laughing while scrapping). Noone of course was paying anymore attention to the seminar (including the instructors). Gerry proceeded to dismantle me after (brown bb at the time) for his ppct workshop and we all went for deserved pints after).

    Jack sided with Jeff David's Jitsu because he didn't think much of canryu & wanted to keep training formally somewheres, but still did have huge respect for Georges Sylvain -who was all about escort & control. Jack went to Takahashi's for finetuning in weight displacement & dealing with resistive strength. Every summer Jack would close shop & encourage all students to train elsewhere for the summer & check out what's out there. We always came back come Sept.
  4. unibrow is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/09/2006 6:31am


     Style: jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by newfieguy30
    Hmm that is interesting. Personally, I wouldn' t feel comfortable wearing my black belt in a new school and style which I had no prior knowledge of. Thats why I'd start back at White all over again, because its totally new.
    I concur. Follow your heart. The codes of chivalry/bushido are still out there (in there)-courtesy, respect, honour, benevolence, loyalty.
  5. unibrow is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/09/2006 7:02am


     Style: jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by andrewa
    Hi Unibrow. I noticed you said you teach at Algonquin College. Apparently there was some kind of split or break between George Sylvain and Therien a few years back. Can you shed any light on this? (If you don't want to answer this I understand.) On another note the thread "Any Bullshido in Ottawa" has touched on Can-Ryu jiu-jitsu.
    Certainly. The professor was the iceman's first boxing trainer who taught him the fundamentals. Roch went on to Therien strictly for the business and marketing support. If you ever get an opportunity to train with him do so (before he retires!).

    http://www.shitoryu.org/bios/tsuruoka/tsuruoka.htm will give you some insight into the "ol boys" martial group that brought martial training to Canada. Robert Forrester & Geroges Sylvain originally came up with early canryu--which has drastically changed since then -in my opinion bastardized by therien's...but what do i know? Professor Georges still holds the occasional seminar (being long retired & having several hip operations) I believe now through Heritage Martial Arts (Sensei Brian Vermillon -spelt right?-a great guy & serious jutsuka)
  6. Cdnronin is offline

    Ghost of Kawaishi

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    Posted On:
    7/09/2006 9:37am


     Style: judo, parenting

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by unibrow
    Certainly. The professor was the iceman's first boxing trainer who taught him the fundamentals. Roch went on to Therien strictly for the business and marketing support. If you ever get an opportunity to train with him do so (before he retires!).

    http://www.shitoryu.org/bios/tsuruoka/tsuruoka.htm will give you some insight into the "ol boys" martial group that brought martial training to Canada. Robert Forrester & Geroges Sylvain originally came up with early canryu--which has drastically changed since then -in my opinion bastardized by therien's...but what do i know? Professor Georges still holds the occasional seminar (being long retired & having several hip operations) I believe now through Heritage Martial Arts (Sensei Brian Vermillon -spelt right?-a great guy & serious jutsuka)
    Uhh, Jean-Yves was a student of Jean Therien from about 1973, along with his brothers. Jean-Yves first fight was in 1976. george Sylvain was most definitely an earlier trainer of JYT, but JYT did not leave George Sylvain for the marketing and development support.
  7. Cdnronin is offline

    Ghost of Kawaishi

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    Posted On:
    7/09/2006 9:48am


     Style: judo, parenting

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    So Jean, there are 3 schools in Canada that teach the teachings of Jacques Dionne. You say two of them are bullshido. Based on the reaction that you have received on Sword Forums, with the historical inaccuracies of your western and JSA sword techniques, how is it you escape the bullshido throne?

    If Jacques Dionne was the greatest thing to ever come out of Ottawa martial arts, how come no one else knows of Matsumoto? If he taught at Rockcliffe air base for over 10 years, have you ever met another direct student of his?

    In all the years that Jacques Dionne taught, only one direct student(you) teaches? The other two schools are from students who took seminars? Jacques' inherited art issupposedly founded in 1129, roughly 300 years before Takenouchi ryu, considered by many as the first jiujitsu system?
  8. unibrow is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/09/2006 10:44am


     Style: jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Greetings CDronin,

    thanks for the details on Sylvain, perhaps you could fill in andrewa with more. my information comes from conversations i had with the professor during a couple of workouts with him.


    [quote=Cdnronin]how is it you escape the bullshido throne?

    I'm a legend in my own mind. I have no claims to fame. I simply try to instruct functional evasive self defense for crisis intervention based on the jutsu i learnt & casefile results. Katana swordwork fundamentals i also received from Jack.

    [quote] If Jacques Dionne was the greatest thing to ever come out of Ottawa martial arts, how come no one else knows of Matsumoto? If he taught at Rockcliffe air base for over 10 years, have you ever met another direct student of his?

    I think Fern Cleroux, Iceman, & Sylvain are the greatest out of Ottawa. I of course have a bias towards my personal instructor. Tad taught Jack during lunchhour breaks with his father present (who was friends with tad-worked bldg. next to the messhall), no formal classes as i know it was offered to the public. tad barely spoke any english as well.

    In all the years that Jacques Dionne taught, only one direct student(you) teaches? The other two schools are from students who took seminars? Jacques' inherited art is supposedly founded in 1129, roughly 300 years before Takenouchi ryu, considered by many as the first jiujitsu system?
    yeah the founded in 1129 thing...i can't answer that since that is a halifax claim. i have no idea where that is based from. Their history page is dubious too. The prefectures page comes right out of The Five Rings-slightly modified...

    The Kingsville club's instructor did indeed learn from Jack & I believe is sincere in his endeavors. Roger Nantel instructs during the fall out of Plantaganet when not away on shiftwork. He recently associated himself with Sylvain to stay out of the halifax mess-ken sei ryu. I don't believe that randy neelin, mike epp, bob villa, have been active for a long while..there are a couple others I have in mind but their names escape me presently.
  9. Cdnronin is offline

    Ghost of Kawaishi

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    Posted On:
    7/09/2006 10:50am


     Style: judo, parenting

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    yeah the founded in 1129 thing...i can't answer that since that is a halifax claim. i have no idea where that is based from. Their history page is dubious too. The prefectures page comes right out of The Five Rings-slightly modified...


    interesting, I have an old flyer with your name on it making the same claim.
  10. unibrow is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/09/2006 11:22am


     Style: jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Cdnronin
    yeah the founded in 1129 thing...i can't answer that since that is a halifax claim. i have no idea where that is based from. Their history page is dubious too. The prefectures page comes right out of The Five Rings-slightly modified...


    interesting, I have an old flyer with your name on it making the same claim.
    yes...groan...must be south keys tact partnership club or crackheadville (kemptville)...i was caught up in it too which was why after I woke up we parted ways..there should be some old t-shirts too with the same claim on the back with some picture taken out of some historical book on samurai arms & armour I believe...those make your own t-shirts deal with iron-ons..gifts from halifax. I will now again attempt to commit suicide with a pellet gun....
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