Final Report: Systema-

**Happycrow** · Posted On: 7/03/2006 12:06pm

True , although you can train that little triangle above the abs a little bit... but then again, who needs a video to know that getting nailed in the breadbasket can knock the breath out of you?

**RatRun** · Posted On: 7/03/2006 3:06pm

I think this is one of the UK TD vids mentioned.

http://rapidshare.de/files/24849760/GEN2.WMV.html

Other vids added:
http://rapidshare.de/files/24858462/DAMJEK01.WMV.html

http://rapidshare.de/files/24857012/VTPAUL.WMV.html

http://rapidshare.de/files/24857511/robjekgrnd.wmv.html

http://rapidshare.de/files/24857829/vtjonnrob.wmv.html

RR

**mrblackmagic** · Posted On: 7/03/2006 3:17pm

:eusa_thin Didn't see the domination Genge was talking about on his website. Wasn't bad though. What other guys did Systema?

**DdlR** · Posted On: 7/03/2006 4:54pm

Dear god, I've created a monster! I hope my fellow forum members will accept my sincere apology.

Touche!

It's unfortunate that you can't come up with specific citations from the Systema forum via WayBack, I'd like to see them; not to score points either way, I'm genuinely curious about what was going on there in years past.

Do you recall whether these gems were presented as Systema dogma, or whether they were just points of discussion on the forum? It should be pretty easy to trace; Ryabko Systema being a relatively young MA, "dogma" must presumably have been issued by the founders and their senior representatives, who seem to be few in number.

Down to brass tacks, you're suggesting that whereas pseudo-scientific claims were rife in Ryabko Systema in the "early days", "they" are now attempting to divorce themselves from this sort of quackery. That's one interpretation.

Another would be that pseudo-scientific claims were made on "their" (Ryabko/Vasiliev's) behalf by others - TRS marketers, wide-eyed true believer students, people who simply didn't understand what they were looking at, and people who made errors in translating Russian into English - and that these mistakes have now been largely corrected. I'm not much of a conspiracy theorist, and I suspect that the truth is somewhere in between.

If you had wanted to present court-quality evidence of endemic Systema quackery, or even just to achieve a cogent argument, then you should have checked and cited your sources properly.

If you had bothered to contact Mr. Robinson with your specific concerns relating to his article, he might have informed you that the "bioplasm" references were his own theory, not related to anything his Systema instructors had told him; and that the Vasiliev quotes regarding psychic training exercises in the Systema handbook were drawn from a Q&A section in which Mr. Vasiliev was answering questions about his life and his experiences in the Spetsnaz, not Systema exercises. Instead, you jumped the gun, made a series of inaccurate assumptions, and ended up producing a misinformed smear job.

Regarding "no-touch BS", I challenge you to find a single example of Ryabko, Vasiliev or any other leading Systemist performing anything presented as a "psychic push". I'm not asking for examples of psych-out tactics, deliberately compliant movement exercises, marketing hype produced by second and third parties, nor for speculative written accounts. I'm looking for specific proof that these people have actually claimed what you assert that they claimed.

**mrblackmagic** · Posted On: 7/03/2006 4:58pm

I'm satisfied. The clips speak for themselves.

**kiai_killer** · Posted On: 7/03/2006 5:28pm

Originally Posted by mrblackmagic

Old boxing trick is to punch someone in the diaphragm while they are inhaling. When you exhale your muscles tense up and protect your organs, but when you inhale your diaphragm is vulnerable no matter how hard your abs are. I've yet to find anyone that is an exception to that rule.

Try it out. Exhale all the air out of your lungs and press on your diaphragm. Inhale and do the same. Much softer.

I think it's a nice thing to know but IMO I doubt its something that would be useful on teh dedly street (Which is what RBSD is supposed to be about, apparantly) for obvious reasons. But I think something like this illustrates one of the things that puts me off RBSD, it seems like they are all looking for some sort of 'secret technique' that gives them an unfair advantage. My personal opinion is I don't think there are any shortcuts and training for self defence should revolve around basic techniques without any mumbo-jumbo or unneccesary cruft. I also think that any style teaching no-touch KO's is not suitable for self defence, and anyone teaching people BS like that and making them believe they could defend themselves with it definately gets a firm two thumbs down.

**mrblackmagic** · Posted On: 7/03/2006 5:34pm

Originally Posted by kiai_killer

I think it's a nice thing to know but IMO I doubt its something that would be useful on teh dedly street (Which is what RBSD is supposed to be about, apparantly) for obvious reasons. But I think something like this illustrates one of the things that puts me off RBSD, it seems like they are all looking for some sort of 'secret technique' that gives them an unfair advantage. My personal opinion is I don't think there are any shortcuts and training for self defence should revolve around basic techniques without any mumbo-jumbo or unneccesary cruft. I also think that any style teaching no-touch KO's is not suitable for self defence, and anyone teaching people BS like that and making them believe they could defend themselves with it definately gets a firm two thumbs down.

I was just explain that were ways to hit someone to stop their breathing. Nothing more. If you want supermoves, this is only secret technique I can teach you.

**kiai_killer** · Posted On: 7/03/2006 5:40pm

Originally Posted by mrblackmagic

I was just explain that were absolute ways to hit someone to stop their breathing. Nothing more. If you want supermoves, this is only secret technique I've got.

I wish I knew a Systema gun defence but I dont :( Although TBH I'm probably safer that way.

**Dirty Rooster** · Posted On: 7/03/2006 5:43pm

Great post Omega,
looks like some thorough analysis despite there being
no systema instructors willing to give the goods.

**isol8d** · Posted On: 7/03/2006 6:23pm

Originally Posted by DdlR

Touche!
Regarding "no-touch BS", I challenge you to find a single example of Ryabko, Vasiliev or any other leading Systemist performing anything presented as a "psychic push". I'm not asking for examples of psych-out tactics, deliberately compliant movement exercises, marketing hype produced by second and third parties, nor for speculative written accounts. I'm looking for specific proof that these people have actually claimed what you assert that they claimed.

Systema by Vladimir Vasiliev video

This unique self-defence Video based on highlights of UK Seminar Vladimir Vasiliev teaches breathing exercise, ground fighting, two attacks at once with knifes, Physic Energy, Mass attacks, and Much, Much, More....

Okay, Ddlr, need more proof the Eaaster bunny exists?