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  1. Little Lamb is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/13/2009 9:20pm


     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by grammatoncleric View Post
    SFGOON this is a serious question... how do you explain this? Alot of the systema guys in this thread seemed to say that this kind of stuff doesn't exist in systema...

    YouTube - systema psychic demo

    Do you guys get taught stuff like that? Or is it just at seminars?

    Is the plump man in on the scam? At the end, after he's toppled by psychic aikido, he gets up and assures everyone that he was trying very hard not to fall, but he just couldn't resist the power of the dark side.

    Is this part of the official Systema canon? Is there an official Systema canon?
  2. DdlR is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/14/2009 4:16pm

    supporting member
     Style: Bartitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Try watching it as a demonstration of suggestibility (i.e., psych-out rather than psychic, telekinetic, etc.)

    A few comparable clips from Derren Brown, an English hypnotist, magician and arch-skeptic of "the supernatural". Pay special attention to how he sets his subjects up with tone of voice, "command words", suggestive imagery, gestures, etc., then re-watch the Vasiliev demo.

    YouTube - Derren Brown Voodo
    YouTube - Derren Brown Controls Shopping Mall Visitors - With sound
    YouTube - How to get drunk without drinking
  3. Little Lamb is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/14/2009 6:53pm


     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by DdlR View Post
    Try watching it as a demonstration of suggestibility (i.e., psych-out rather than psychic, telekinetic, etc.)

    A few comparable clips from Derren Brown, an English hypnotist, magician and arch-skeptic of "the supernatural". Pay special attention to how he sets his subjects up with tone of voice, "command words", suggestive imagery, gestures, etc., then re-watch the Vasiliev demo.



    I'm sure that if Plumpy was not in on it, then he was probably acting from suggestibility or conditioned response or some other mental state common to many students of a certain type of martial art.

    This does not excuse the instructor from using his students' credulous nature to line his pockets. I heard nothing in the video to suggest that the students were in on the instructor's game. I did not hear the instructor warn his students that attackers will be unlikely to respond to psychic hand waving in the same way that Plumpy responded. On the contrary, the instructor claims he gathered Plumpy's thoughts up and spun them around to cause Plumpy to fall.

    One of the Youtube comments said it well:

    "Vlad (instructor) is basically telling the interpreter to concentrate on a recent memory, because an older memory is too "deep".
    He then claims to "catch" the memory with his own mind and shake it about, disorientating the subject.
    This is clearly a claim of psychic ability, and not a bad translation of "psychological" as some systema defenders say."

    The most likely interpretation of these events, assuming that Plumpy translated the Russian reasonably well, is that this instructor is engaging in purposeful chicanery in order to convince his students that he can fight with magical, psychic powers.

    And I'm still wondering if there is a canon of Systema, if only to prevent instructors from training this sort of foolishness under the aegis of Systema. Or is this actually part of the canon of Systema?
  4. SFGOON is offline
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    and humble, too!

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    Posted On:
    5/14/2009 9:20pm


     Style: Systema, BJJ, Arrestling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Little Lamb View Post
    Is this part of the official Systema canon? Is there an official Systema canon?
    No, because no. K-sys and ROSS? Yes. But not Ryabko's systema.

    Disclaimer, I have never met Vlad nor Ryabko.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cullion
    You sound like a foaming-at-the-mouth-loon out of Dr. Strangelove.
    Sometimes, we put Ricin in the Cocaine. :ninja7:
  5. theotherserge is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/14/2009 11:14pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: sambo/crossfit

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    the **** works, I'm doing it to G"OON now:

    "SFGOON, turn on schoolgirl p0rn and jack off-right now!"

    See?
    Many things we do naturally become difficult only when we try to make them intellectual subjects. It is possible to know so much about a subject that you become totally ignorant.
    -Mentat Text Two (dicto)
  6. DdlR is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/15/2009 12:51am

    supporting member
     Style: Bartitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Little Lamb View Post
    I'm sure that if Plumpy was not in on it, then he was probably acting from suggestibility or conditioned response or some other mental state common to many students of a certain type of martial art.

    This does not excuse the instructor from using his students' credulous nature to line his pockets. I heard nothing in the video to suggest that the students were in on the instructor's game. I did not hear the instructor warn his students that attackers will be unlikely to respond to psychic hand waving in the same way that Plumpy responded. On the contrary, the instructor claims he gathered Plumpy's thoughts up and spun them around to cause Plumpy to fall.
    Have you seen footage of this demo in context, or are you basing your opinions on what is seen in the YouTube excerpt?
  7. Mtripp is offline
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    Choked out by Gene Lebell

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    Posted On:
    5/15/2009 8:59am

    supporting member
     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I have seen "Troopa" from start to finish. It makes this video seem sane.

    So my opinion is based on a VERY long time of listening to the defense of this kind of silly stuff, and watching the people in question "demonstrate" it.

    Missing here is that if you don't react, they hit you, hard. Its why you see people flinch, they think they are going to be hit.

    Sure hope we will see Troopa up soon....
  8. Little Lamb is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/15/2009 10:28am


     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by DdlR View Post
    Have you seen footage of this demo in context, or are you basing your opinions on what is seen in the YouTube excerpt?

    I understand that context can be critical. I am basing my opinion on this video excerpt.
  9. Little Lamb is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/15/2009 10:31am


     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by theotherserge View Post
    the **** works, I'm doing it to G"OON now:

    "SFGOON, turn on schoolgirl p0rn and jack off-right now!"

    See?
    That's some powerful mojo! I think you hit me, too. I'm gonna have to wipe my hard drive.

    But you're Honor, most of those girls looked at least 18!
  10. Little Lamb is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/15/2009 10:39am


     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Mtripp View Post

    Missing here is that if you don't react, they hit you, hard. Its why you see people flinch, they think they are going to be hit.
    So they inflict pain on compliant students in order to make the student more compliant? That's pure douchebag.

    Doesn't anybody ever call them on it? Don't people walk out, at the very least? Or hit back!

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