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  1. Fighting Cephalopod is offline
    Fighting Cephalopod's Avatar

    Submitting 1d6 Investigators per round

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    Jun 2005
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    new jersey
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    Posted On:
    1/02/2006 2:13am

    supporting member
     Style: ZHOO ZHITSU

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreadnought
    To be fair, I do this to everyone who doesn't know what they're doing. If you punish someone enough they'll lose all their bad habits on their own.
    If you tell them, they'll lose their bad habits faster, which results in a more rapid transition into a person who A) will be a more challenging rolling partner, helping you improve more, and B) will not embarrass you when they rep your club at a tournament.
  2. Shuma-Gorath is offline
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    Senior Member

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    Posted On:
    1/02/2006 2:23am

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     Style: BJJ - Homeland Security

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by I Choke You
    When you consistently beat somebody they will learn one of two things:

    1) To avoid mistakes
    2) To fear you

    If all they learn is to be afraid, they won't get better.
    A wrestler comes to BJJ class and starts rolling. He reaches back with one arm to open my closed guard and I triangle him. I do this every time he reaches back. Eventually, he fears my triangle and the conditions that allow me to use it, specifically him having one arm in and one arm out of my guard and me having free motion with my hips. Through similar mechanisms he learns to fear not having good base and posture when in my guard, me having certain grips and so on until he learns all the dangerous elements of being in someone's guard.

    Another less friendly version of this at our school is that if you catch someone in the same choke three times in a row you are allowed to choke them just short of unconsciousness the third time you catch them. We don't do this all the time, but when I was starting out one of the brown belts did it to me and after that no one, including the higher belts, hit that same choke on me for months.

    Quote Originally Posted by fatherdog
    If you tell them, they'll lose their bad habits faster, which results in a more rapid transition into a person who A) will be a more challenging rolling partner, helping you improve more, and B) will not embarrass you when they rep your club at a tournament.
    I'll tell them if they ask, but I'm not going to stop in the middle of rolling to explain something at length; that's for after class or on breaks. If they don't ask then they can tap until they show some initiative and/or critical thinking.
    Last edited by Shuma-Gorath; 1/11/2008 6:33pm at .
  3. Roidie McDouchebag is offline
    Roidie McDouchebag's Avatar

    Injury Waiting To Happen

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    May 2002
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    Kamloops, BC
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    9,419

    Posted On:
    1/02/2006 2:29am

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     Style: Snatch Wrestling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I used to think the same way, then I started instructing and felt the weight of responsibility...so I changed.
  4. Shuma-Gorath is offline
    Shuma-Gorath's Avatar

    Senior Member

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    Posted On:
    1/02/2006 2:43am

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ - Homeland Security

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I've done some instruction too. I've found people gain a greater understanding of something once they have seen the consequences of failing to apply it.

    To put it another way, I'll usually let the students roll with each other and coach them on what they should be doing in a given position, but it never really sticks until I roll with them and hit the same technique repeatedly and unopposed. They'll almost universally ask what the defence is before I have to explicitly tell them. Keep in mind that all of this comes after technical instruction and drilling for the majority of class. During that time I'll explain why the basic steps in any technique are important.

    Anyway, I thought this thread was more about beating wrestlers in a competitive setting so I'd rather not hijack it with further discussion of teaching methodology.
  5. fanatical is offline
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    Hi, guys

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    Oslo, Norway
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    Posted On:
    1/02/2006 2:56am

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     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Isn't this a discussion on teaching methods for wrestlers getting into jiu-jitsu? Sounds right on topic to me.

    Anyway, just because someone taught you like a dick doesn't mean you have to be a dick too. :)
    More human than human is our motto.
  6. Roidie McDouchebag is offline
    Roidie McDouchebag's Avatar

    Injury Waiting To Happen

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    May 2002
    Location
    Kamloops, BC
    Posts
    9,419

    Posted On:
    1/02/2006 3:14am

    supporting member
     Style: Snatch Wrestling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Isn't this a discussion on teaching methods for wrestlers getting into jiu-jitsu? Sounds right on topic to me.
    That was what I figured.

    Anyway, you're right Dreadnought, now that I understand your method.
  7. Aesopian is offline

    Light Heavyweight

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    Oct 2011
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    Posted On:
    1/02/2006 10:02am

    Business Class Supporting Member
     Aesopian.com 

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Of course you should let people (and wrestlers) know what they are doing wrong so they can correct it, but they won't learn to do the right thing until you physically beat them with it repeatedly. Only then will they actually learn to counter it. I've told plenty of wrestlers "Both hands in, both hands out -- you never want to leave one arm alone in the guard" and they understood, but it wasn't until triangled them for the uptillionth that they really started to put the idea into practice.
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