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  1. #21

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by devil
    Yes, you're new.
    no ****, you going to answer my question or not?

  2. #22
    His heart was visible, and the dismal sack that maketh excrement of what is eaten. supporting member
    Devil's Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by ginshun
    no ****, you going to answer my question or not?
    No, I'm not.

  3. #23

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I guess I shouldn't be suprised.

  4. #24
    <plasma>'s Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by ginshun
    I am new, so maybe I don't understand. devil, how exactly do you train? Your teacher shows you something and then you guys just go and try it at full speed? That would seem to be what you are saying.

    I don't know, but that just sounds stupid, and like a good way to get hurt.
    Or a good way to learn to muscle the technique and do it wrong.

  5. #25

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by pl4zM4
    Or a good way to learn to muscle the technique and do it wrong.

    Yup, that too, take your pick

  6. #26
    WhiteShark's Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    No you don't immediately use a technique at full speed after you see it once.
    You add progressive resistance and then integrate it into sparring along the way.
    The hope is that you do this fast and free enough that it doesn't become a static pattern.

  7. #27

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    His point about the uke dieing after the first attack isn't that drilling moves at less resistance or lower speed is stupid. It's that in so many traditional martial arts, especially the x-kans, the uke punches, goes limp, and the other person hits 15 different moves while uke just stands there and takes it. Even in this video where the guy seems to be moving at a pretty good speed, there's all this dead time where the uke is just standing there while the other guy just runs around him hitting all these moves. It looks like something out of Walker Texas Ranger, not a real fight. The problem with the x-kans is that they always say, "oh, he's not resisting right now, this is a drill to learn the flow, blah blah blah hippie babble" and they never add the progressive resistance they always talk about.

  8. #28
    Lane's Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Where exactly was Plazma wrong, Ginshun? That seems to be the story I've heard; is there any reason to doubt it?

    Re: Kata

    Yes, judo is taught by starting with the kata method to learn the basic mechanics of the the throw. But most judo dojo, if not all of them, finish practice with randori, and that's where the technique is perfected, not taught.

    Re: The video clip

    Yeah, it's still compliant, but at least it appears done at a reasonable speed. Compliant but full speed is a step up from compliant and slow.
    --
    L.

  9. #29

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I have no problem with that, that is exactly what we do.

    I think that you should have a move down pretty well at slow and moderate speeds though before you ever bother trying to do it at close to full speed.

    To listen to half the guys on this sight, you'd think that all they do is watch fights and fight videos and then try the stuff in full speed sparing. Thats just dumb


    Edit: Where did I claim that Plasma was wrong about anything? I agreed with him.
    Last edited by ginshun; 6/20/2006 1:34pm at .

  10. #30
    <plasma>'s Avatar
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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by ginshun
    I have no problem with that, that is exactly what we do.

    I think that you should have a move down pretty well at slow and moderate speeds though before you ever bother trying to do it at close to full speed.

    To listen to half the guys on this sight, you'd think that all they do is watch fights and fight videos and then try the stuff in full speed sparing. Thats just dumb

    Who do you train with? How long? Why should I take your opinion seriously?

    PS. My post about the Tanemura/Hatsumi split was correct.

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