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  1. Fantasy Warrior is offline
    Fantasy Warrior's Avatar

    Misguided style basher

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    Posted On:
    6/08/2006 8:14am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Kata

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I love how kata appologisors try to redefine "kata" to include everything under the sun just to excuse why they do Bil Jee in the bathroom mirror every morning.
    You are a total Douchbag. Train more, post nevermore.
    FickleFingerOfFate -08-21-2007 08:59 AM

    just die already.
    Plasma - 08-20-2007 11:45 PM


    Aikidokkkkakkakakakaaaaa
    Best MA website ever!!!!!: http://www.dogjudo.co.uk/
  2. hl1978 is offline

    Registered Member

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    Posted On:
    6/08/2006 8:19am


     Style: Aunkai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by kickcatcher
    I love how kata appologisors try to redefine "kata" to include everything under the sun just to excuse why they do Bil Jee in the bathroom mirror every morning.
    And kata haters ignore any benefits ;)

    Can you practice martial arts without kata. Yes.

    Is it better too? Well.......
    there are plenty of threads which debate this, I am not going to get drawn into that one.
  3. ChanceDuBois is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/08/2006 8:49am


     Style: bjj, judo and chinese MA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Any type of training involving preplanned sequences of moves is a kata. Most sports people just don't call it that. Learning new technique and building skill involves starting off with low or no resistance. This has been the case in judo, bjj, wrestling and boxing as I have trained them.

    The only difference that I see in some trad MA is that kata are formalised and elevated to a position they don't deserve. I think Kano had the right idea when it came to katas, pre-planning and drilling with reduced resistance.

    Can you practice martial arts without kata. Yes.
    I don't agree, you can't lean a skill without pre planning what you are going to do and the level of resistance.
    Last edited by ChanceDuBois; 6/08/2006 8:52am at .
  4. Rhamma is offline

    Not over zealous, but just zealous enough. 病気の粗悪品

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    Posted On:
    6/08/2006 9:05am


     Style: Okinawan Karate

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I don't usually get into this type of your style sucks debates, but I will say this about kata.

    Kata in and of itself is not important.

    What kata is is the "text book" in which technique is recorded. The movements are put into a sequence that is not necessarily a straightforward technique.

    Pieces of kata are supposed to be pulled out and worked on as drills. First in a kind of shadow boxing, then in a group for timing, then with a partner who increases resistance as you go. When you have it down then you have one more tool in your "tool belt of techniques".

    Do you have to have kata to train? No, but you have to "reinvent" everything if you don't. Kata is learned movements are there for a reason. You examine the movements and then "figure out" the reasons. I put figure out in quotes because it was already figured out and put into the kata.

    It is a training tool that is all.

    Can you be a Christian without a Bible?

    Can you be a Muslim without a Koran?

    Yes, and yes.

    But it is easier with the book. Kata is the book that technique is written in.

    If you have no use for kata that is your problem.
    People often tell me that I fail to see the gravity of the situation.
    I see the gravity, and I say...

    Step right up folks and watch me defy gravity!
  5. ChanceDuBois is offline

    Registered Member

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    Posted On:
    6/08/2006 9:14am


     Style: bjj, judo and chinese MA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    If you have pre-planning then you have kata. If you have an idealised idea of a technique then you have kata. That is all it is, nothing to be scared of.
  6. Fantasy Warrior is offline
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    Misguided style basher

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    Posted On:
    6/08/2006 10:20am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Kata

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    You are choosing not to differentiate between isolation drills and two-person kata. Pad work isn’t kata just as makiwara isn’t. Kata is kata. Compliant drilling of isolated moves is a necessary but small step in a bigger picture, kata though is pure silliness. When you do your Bil Jee that is silliness. This is silliness:

    It’s an inherently unrealistic way of learning techniques which seeks to confuse the student by looking like a fight in their minds eye in a way padwork never does. When he punches with X, I respond like with Y even though I know beforehand he is going to deflect with Z… It’s a recipe for disaster and must be stopped.

    One person being silly: http://www.prairieaikikai.com/Movies...Count_Slow.mpg

    Two persons being equally silly: http://www.hsing-i.com/pics/W2Mn5Ele.mpg
    Last edited by Fantasy Warrior; 6/08/2006 10:23am at .
    You are a total Douchbag. Train more, post nevermore.
    FickleFingerOfFate -08-21-2007 08:59 AM

    just die already.
    Plasma - 08-20-2007 11:45 PM


    Aikidokkkkakkakakakaaaaa
    Best MA website ever!!!!!: http://www.dogjudo.co.uk/
  7. Plasma is offline
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    Bullshido's Greatest Ninja

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    Posted On:
    6/08/2006 10:28am

    supporting memberforum leaderstaff
     Style: JJJ/Judo[Nidan] BJJ[Blue]

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Kickcatcher, when you start training again I'll take you more seriously. Till then carry on Keyboard warrior!
  8. Rhamma is offline

    Not over zealous, but just zealous enough. 病気の粗悪品

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    Posted On:
    6/08/2006 10:31am


     Style: Okinawan Karate

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Kickcatcher you are full of crap, and you don't have a clue what you are talking about.
    People often tell me that I fail to see the gravity of the situation.
    I see the gravity, and I say...

    Step right up folks and watch me defy gravity!
  9. Fantasy Warrior is offline
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    Misguided style basher

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    Posted On:
    6/08/2006 10:37am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Kata

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    So those two person kata ("form" in the Hsing-I case) are not silly?
    You are a total Douchbag. Train more, post nevermore.
    FickleFingerOfFate -08-21-2007 08:59 AM

    just die already.
    Plasma - 08-20-2007 11:45 PM


    Aikidokkkkakkakakakaaaaa
    Best MA website ever!!!!!: http://www.dogjudo.co.uk/
  10. Plasma is offline
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    Bullshido's Greatest Ninja

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    Posted On:
    6/08/2006 10:37am

    supporting memberforum leaderstaff
     Style: JJJ/Judo[Nidan] BJJ[Blue]

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Rhamma
    Kickcatcher you are full of crap, and you don't have a clue what you are talking about.

    Its sad cause he used too.

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