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  1. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/31/2006 9:08pm

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     Style: xingyi

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by new2bjj
    I keep reading how SanDa comes from Gung Fu- which system? White Eye Brow? N.Preying Mantis, ing hun? this whole idea that Sanda goes way back is another case of revisionism. Yes people fought on platforms in certain areas, but it probably looked like the Ng vs Chan clip in the Video section, not the dynamic splish splash of whatever works that we see in Modern San shou/SanDa. I like SanDa, and yeah, Cung le is a bad dude, but none of my friends are looking forward to him fighting a soup can- ****- he's a Champion, put him in with Matt Hughes.
    See, you are doing what most kung fu guys do. San Da/San Shou is a type of fighting tournament. It wasn't for a specific style at all. It was to test different styles ala UFC.

    See, the revisionism comes in when Kung Fu people say they train the style of SanDa/SanShou.

    Sounds ridiculous. I will teach the pretty techniques of Mei Hua but, to do Sanda, I'll teach you the correct way to compete but remember, all the techniques are in your forms.

    This is where it gets stupid.
  2. QuickJab is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/31/2006 9:32pm


     Style: Boxing

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    San shou in the early day was more like NHB where Kung Fu masters could test their skill. San Shou as we know it today was created by the chinese military for hand to hand combat. It had nothing to do with Muay Thai.

    Is San Shou really Kung Fu? Yes. They took all the real, applicable moves from various Kung Fu systems (and maybe a punch or 2 from Boxing). Whether San Shou is its own entity or if its the full contact sparring for TCMA;ers, either way its still Kung Fu. People don't think of it as Kung Fu cause it doesn't look like what they think Kung fu should look like, but its Kung Fu.
  3. QuickJab is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/31/2006 9:35pm


     Style: Boxing

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Cung's new to MMA, give him time before you throw him in there with a high caliber opponent. I read some where that Cung is now a BJJ purple, I wonder if thats true?
  4. Arbiter is offline
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    punch-drunk

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    Posted On:
    5/31/2006 9:59pm

    supporting member
     Style: SanDa / MMA / Kung-Fu

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by new2bjj
    I keep reading how SanDa comes from Gung Fu- which system? White Eye Brow? N.Preying Mantis, ing hun? this whole idea that Sanda goes way back is another case of revisionism. Yes people fought on platforms in certain areas, but it probably looked like the Ng vs Chan clip in the Video section, not the dynamic splish splash of whatever works that we see in Modern San shou/SanDa. I like SanDa, and yeah, Cung le is a bad dude, but none of my friends are looking forward to him fighting a soup can- ****- he's a Champion, put him in with Matt Hughes.
    if i wanted your opinion i would beat it out of you, now stfu
  5. Arbiter is offline
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    punch-drunk

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    Posted On:
    5/31/2006 10:00pm

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     Style: SanDa / MMA / Kung-Fu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by QuickJab
    San shou in the early day was more like NHB where Kung Fu masters could test their skill. San Shou as we know it today was created by the chinese military for hand to hand combat. It had nothing to do with Muay Thai.

    Is San Shou really Kung Fu? Yes. They took all the real, applicable moves from various Kung Fu systems (and maybe a punch or 2 from Boxing). Whether San Shou is its own entity or if its the full contact sparring for TCMA;ers, either way its still Kung Fu. People don't think of it as Kung Fu cause it doesn't look like what they think Kung fu should look like, but its Kung Fu.
    yep, hats about it
  6. Arbiter is offline
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    punch-drunk

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    Posted On:
    5/31/2006 10:18pm

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     Style: SanDa / MMA / Kung-Fu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    to some ppl kung fu = a bad stereotype for ma. to me and plenty of other cma people its just a broad encompassing term for everthing w/in cma, san shou included. believe it or not (i would say i could care less, but i suppose i care enough to type this response) there is some worth while things w/in cma. that said, i agree most cma sucks donkey balls and that for said cma posers to compare or validate themselves by association to san shou or cung li is a joke.
  7. Ronin.74 is offline

    霍氏八极拳徒弟

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    Posted On:
    5/31/2006 10:26pm


     Style: CMA,Muay Thai ,Yudo,TKD

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by new2bjj
    Beaton,

    No disrepect, I studied with Phillip Wong and Jiang Ho Mae for three years doing wu shu. I thought that, since I was doing kicks and punchs, wu shu style, including a little bag work, that it would transfer over to my free fighting. I had done TKD and some full contact, years before. It did not work out that way. You have to train your techniques the way you use them. Jason Yee, a better martial artist in the traditional sense than many of us could hope to be- winning in forms and full contact, until he was crushed and carried on cable by Cung Le, has said " do forms or do fighting- don't try to do both". After that, I went to Fairtex- why **** around.
    Cung is pretty phenomal athlete, but he loves fighting people that have little or no experience in his sport. He got school in grappling at the Sabaki Challenbge, and he has been knocked out in international competition. He is annoounced as the best in the world , but only one a bronze in amateur, international competition. His back ground is wrestling and TKD, with a tiny bit of Vietnamses Kung Fu. If he really wanted a match, he could invite the guys from China over, but he never has- i'm sure they would love the payday. He will continue to fight soup cans for as long as he can, and people are willing to watch.
    IMO this is the most accurate explanation for Cung Le's success. He is a phenomenal athlete, but he is still an athlete who seems to avoid testing himself. A lot of his wins are against fighters who not only do not compete regularly in SanShou, but are also not very well known in Muay Thai either. The guy he fought in his first MMA fight was a guy that he had already beaten in SanShou.

    How challenging was that for Cung Le? "Hey I know I can land kicks and punches on him and score takedowns, sure I'll fight him in a MMA match."
    It would have been easy to get a fighter with little to no pro experience in MMA for Cung Le to fight, someone who is training MMA, has some amateur experience and is looking to go pro could not be that hard to find. Cung Le fought this guy for the same reason he fights anyone else, he knows ahead of time that he can beat them.
  8. QuickJab is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/31/2006 10:28pm


     Style: Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Its understandable why Cung has become CMA's poster child. Since the emergence of MMA, Kung Fu people have been hearing that they suck and are a big joke (unfortunately, alot of them are). Then they have someone with great potential, using some of the same techniques they use. The CMA people now think "wow, if he can do it, I can too". This is A VERY GOOD THING for CMA. If more of them started training like Cung, with alive drills and sparring, it will help erradicate both the bullshido within CMA and its lackluster rep.
  9. Arbiter is offline
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    punch-drunk

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    Posted On:
    5/31/2006 10:32pm

    supporting member
     Style: SanDa / MMA / Kung-Fu

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    some people just get a hard-on over the semantics and won't let anything assoviated w/ the word kung fu go.
    if kung fu only = rediculous forms that many worthless gyms do, that is news to me. but it is only a popular western term for cma and really means nothing anyway. i think it is funny too, but don't go trying to lecture me on it. bottom line is, fighting is fighting, call it what you want. just don't be suprised if kung fu kicks your ass sometime.
  10. QuickJab is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/31/2006 10:35pm


     Style: Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Cung Le is fighting Brian Warren. Warren has already lost to Cung, in San Shou, but...

    Brian Waren is a KOTC veteran with a 9-4 record. 2 of his 4 loses came to Karo Parisyan and Jason "mayhem" Miller. Most of his wins have been by submission. Even though Cung Le has beaten Warren in San SHou, Warren has much more MMA experience.
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