Thread: Cung Le(kung fu) in UFC?
5/31/2006 10:38pm, #91
- Join Date
- Dec 2005
From what I understand SanShou was not derived from Muay Thai, or created to compete with Muay Thai. After the communist government took over they brought in many famous Kung Fu masters and asked them to develop a system that would be simple to learn but effective. Techniques came from many different styles of Kung Fu, but the main theme was that all the techniques were basic. Basic punches, basic kicks, basic throws. It would probably be safe to say that many of the throws can be traced to Shuai Jiao, as for the basic punches and kicks, almost every Kung Fu style has them.
Most SanShou fighters you see today throw punches like a boxer, but in original Sanshou the jab and cross punches were thrown with a vertical fist, like you see in _ing_un. The body mechanics are basically the same as a boxing jab or cross except they don't turn the fist over. Some Sanshou practitioners in China still train to punch in this manner.
Since SanShou was originally meant for the Military I believe their were also some joint manipulation techniques probably taken from Chin Na, You don't generally see this aspect of SanShou outside of China because the sport aspect is the main focus. But I have seen articles discussing SanShou joint locks in Kung Fu Magazine or Blackbelt (It was some years ago so I can't remember which one).
That being said I do feel that Muay Thai and events like K-1 have had an influence on how SanShou has developed after it's creation, but IMO SanShou did originally spring from Kung Fu
5/31/2006 10:40pm, #92
- Join Date
- Dec 2005
I would like to see Cung Le fight Zhang Qing Jun of China, Sanshou rules. Zhang is a capable SanShou fighter who has fought in the K-1 as well. That would be a true test of his skills.
5/31/2006 10:50pm, #93
btw, jason yee is a natural middle weight, maybe super-middleweight at the most, cung is a natural light heavyweight to cruiser weight. jason was already a multi time national and international san shou and forms champiion when he came out retirement to fight cung. marvn perry is jasons best fighter and cung has said in person that he would never fight marvin because he knows he would lose. its true that cung hand picks his opponents and protects his fight record, but he is still a good fighter.
5/31/2006 10:56pm, #94
Originally Posted by eyebeams
- Join Date
- Sep 2004
- Greater Seattle Area
As well as:
-and my favorite, Tai Chi
I'm suprised no one noticed the Jon Funk photo in post #15 sooner. If you are having a hard time getting your head around what the above list has to do with Kung Fu, think of it instead of as "martial arts form the world's very-largest country." Kung Fu can compete in most of the above, for better or for worse.
As per my San Shou experience, the guys I sparred with were competing against Muay Thai fighters for the most part. This is not to say there weren't stylistic differences (we tended to have our weight on our front leg most of the time, opposite of Maurice Smith's fighters, our lead leg kicks were slighty faster, Smith's students slightly stronger, we tried to throw (and I mean actually throw the fighter) more then they did, they threw more knees in the clinch, etc. etc.) But was this Kung Fu?
It was originally - the Tai Chi (which was not primarily forms,) the Choy Lay Fut, and the full contact sparring was at first taught back-to-back as more-or-less one system. As a wider variety of customers came in, specialization took place, and eventually non-kung-fu guys were doing kickboxing... eventually Choy Lay Fut, Kickboxing, and Tai Chi (then primarily forms) became three seperate classes... you can see how these things evolve (or devolve as the case may be.) Boxers were also trained durring this period:
(Yeah, she learned some Kung Fu as part of her kickboxing training, before her boxing career.)
It's really a case of Cadio Kickboxing as to wheather or not Kung Fu is San Shou:
"The majority of our students taking this class are men and women that simply do it to get in great shape and learn self-defense. You will not be hit in this class and our students have about as much chance of getting hurt as playing a game of tennis or basketball." -Miletich Martial Arts
Anyone can forget to teach their martial arts students how to fight.
(My instructor was Vern Miller, his was Doc Fai Wong, and yes I've met another of DFW's students who opened a school and pretty much doesn't spar at all - and yes I think that's a huge problem.)
Last edited by BFGalbraith; 5/31/2006 11:24pm at .
5/31/2006 11:04pm, #95Originally Posted by QuickJab"No. Listen to me because I know what I'm talking about here." -- Hannibal
5/31/2006 11:07pm, #96Originally Posted by Ronin.74
my 1st san shou coach defected right off the boat from china, and a major focus of his san shou teaching was military chin na, which totally blew away the 'traditional' chin na i had learned. taught a lot of shuai jiao, also taught both verticle and horizontal fist punching, as well as emphasis on fa li 'short power' generation. the military san shou is definately outside the scope of ring sports, although that is where it is tested and evaluated for the most part.
5/31/2006 11:11pm, #97Originally Posted by Garbanzo Bean
5/31/2006 11:58pm, #98
Originally Posted by Arbiter
- Join Date
- Jun 2005
6/01/2006 2:12am, #99Originally Posted by mrblackmagic
6/01/2006 2:52pm, #100Originally Posted by Arbiter
The Lord Apocalypse demands it."No. Listen to me because I know what I'm talking about here." -- Hannibal