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  1. Tom Kagan is offline
    Tom Kagan's Avatar

    Dark Overlord of the Bullshido Underworld

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    Posted On:
    5/23/2006 10:44pm

    supporting member
     Style: Taai Si Ji Kung Fu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by psychalogy
    I’m still not saying that the more sport oriented strikes and techniques (i.e. those allowed in competition) have no value or are ineffective, far from it. They are an integral and necessary part of any self-defence oriented martial training. Just that they’re not the be all and end all of hand to hand combat.

    No ****. The point is:

    Punching someone with real contact but with safety (headgear, padded glove, resticted target area, whatever) is far more likely to train a person to have the mindset to gouge their opponent's eyes out than pretending to train gouging a person's eyes out.

    That is the seemingly paradoxical outcome of the automatic response of which you obviously know nothing about. If you did, you wouldn't argue the point. You are not disagreeing with me. You are disagreeing with the methodology of the U.S. Military. Name a country whose Army trains as you suggest and I guarantee their methods are outdated.
    Last edited by Tom Kagan; 5/23/2006 10:47pm at .
    Calm down, it's only ones and zeros.

    "Your calm and professional manner of response is really draining all the fun out of this. Can you reply more like Dr. Fagbot or something? Call me some names, mention some sand in my vagina or something of the sort. You can't expect me to come up with reasonable arguments man!" -- MaverickZ

    "Tom Kagan spins in his grave and the fucking guy isn't even dead yet." -- Snake Plissken

    My Bullshido fan club threads:
    Tom Kagan's a big hairy...
    Tom Kagan can lick my BALLS
    Tom Kagan teaches _ing __un and bigotry?
    Tom Kagan: Serious discussion here
    Lamokio asks the burning question is Tom Kagan a ***** or just cruising for some
    I'm Dave the gay Kickboxer from Manchester and I have the hots for Tom Kagan
    TOM KAGAN, OPEN ME, THE MKT ARE COMING FOR YOU ! ARE YOU MAN ENOUGH TO MEET ?
    ATTN TOM KAGAN
    World Dominator 'Kagan' in plot to lie about real Kung Fu and Martial Arts
    Tom Kagan just gave me my third negative rep in a day
    I am infatuated with Tom Kagan
    Tom Kagan is a fat balding white guy.
  2. psychalogy is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/23/2006 10:46pm


     Style: Hoshin, Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by jnp
    Hey fucktard, thanks for your insight into compliant drilling versus sparring. Gee, you're thoughts are so fresh and new. A poster like Locu5, who has been fighting the good fight on here for years, wouldn't have any idea what you're talking about.

    He is a known quantity and uses logic and empirical evidence to argue with the shitheads that regularly invade this site.

    You on the other hand seem to be an insufferable twit who is heartily impressed with his own stale arguments. **** off
    Blah blah blah…

    Hmm the ‘stale’ and apparently not so ‘fresh and new’ arguments I presented can’t be that far in the past given the shitstorm they’ve managed to stir up. Seems like it was time somebody shone the light of day on them again as you clearly still have issues regarding them. This first paragraph of yours is a great example of why it’s so hard to use sarcasm on the internet.

    And what, so I’m supposed to take whatever **** someone throws my way because of their post count? Don’t think so. He came across an overly aggressive tool so I gave him both barrels. Meh. And the logic he’s apparently so famous for was strangely lacking in his original reply to my first post in this thread.

    Nice work on the “… insufferable twit…” bit though. I appreciate someone who steps outside the box with their insults. Shows a bit of flair.

    You then had to go and lose it all with the last insult. C’mon you’ve shown you can do better than that.

    Nice thread title too, what do you use the ‘Illiterate Troll’ edition dictionary for spellcheck? Last I checked ‘fucktard’ wasn’t in any of the standard English dictionaries.

    And why does Locu5 need you to stand up for him again?
  3. Tom Kagan is offline
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    Dark Overlord of the Bullshido Underworld

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    Posted On:
    5/23/2006 10:49pm

    supporting member
     Style: Taai Si Ji Kung Fu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by psychalogy
    He came across an overly aggressive tool so I gave him both barrels.

    You missed.
    Calm down, it's only ones and zeros.

    "Your calm and professional manner of response is really draining all the fun out of this. Can you reply more like Dr. Fagbot or something? Call me some names, mention some sand in my vagina or something of the sort. You can't expect me to come up with reasonable arguments man!" -- MaverickZ

    "Tom Kagan spins in his grave and the fucking guy isn't even dead yet." -- Snake Plissken

    My Bullshido fan club threads:
    Tom Kagan's a big hairy...
    Tom Kagan can lick my BALLS
    Tom Kagan teaches _ing __un and bigotry?
    Tom Kagan: Serious discussion here
    Lamokio asks the burning question is Tom Kagan a ***** or just cruising for some
    I'm Dave the gay Kickboxer from Manchester and I have the hots for Tom Kagan
    TOM KAGAN, OPEN ME, THE MKT ARE COMING FOR YOU ! ARE YOU MAN ENOUGH TO MEET ?
    ATTN TOM KAGAN
    World Dominator 'Kagan' in plot to lie about real Kung Fu and Martial Arts
    Tom Kagan just gave me my third negative rep in a day
    I am infatuated with Tom Kagan
    Tom Kagan is a fat balding white guy.
  4. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/23/2006 10:52pm

    staff
     Style: xingyi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    This is our new MAP related influx. We have at least 8 active threads dealing with unrealistic sparring.

    To make it simpler TMA VS Sport. You are trying to dress it up differently but, that is where your posts are leading.
  5. psychalogy is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/23/2006 11:12pm


     Style: Hoshin, Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by It is Fake??
    Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha..............

    You call someone an internet tough guy while issue a challenge from Sydney.

    Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha.............


    Hahahahahahahahahahah......................IQ..... ..bwahahahahahahaahahaah

    You are calling into question Locu5's IQ with, the spelling of a made up word? Bwahahahahahahahahaha.

    Please stay. Please...
    Learn to read. Look up the word 'context' in a dictionary and then re read the post you seem to find offensive. You can't simply cherry pick the words you like out of a sentence or paragraph. Their meaning is directly modified by the 'context' (there's that word again) in which they appear.

    In this case it should be obvious that the challenge was a mental one confined to the bullshido forums.
    Take another shot at reading it and see if you can figure that one out. And the ‘keyboard tough guy’ title was earned by referring to me as a ‘punching bag’ on the internet , so it seemed kind of fitting. And where else does someone issue challenges from apart from where they live? Dude, think, then type.

    As for the IQ bit... well the intention was to insult him so I went for the tried and true targets of masculinity, competence, intelligence and masculinity (yep, did that twice if you include the ‘keyboard tough guy' line). In that order. I also went for the condescending angle just to mix it up a bit and to come up with something more amusing than simply trading ‘**** you’, ‘No. **** you!’ insults.

    Getting to the 'made up word' argument, ALL words are made up. It's the level of common usage that ends up defining whether they make the dictionary or not.
    As 'fucktard' is clearly derivative of the word '****' it's not unreasonable to give someone **** about spelling it incorrectly. Besides, as previously stated, the whole idea was to be insulting.

    Next…
  6. Tom Kagan is offline
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    Dark Overlord of the Bullshido Underworld

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    Posted On:
    5/23/2006 11:19pm

    supporting member
     Style: Taai Si Ji Kung Fu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by psychalogy
    ... As 'fucktard' is clearly derivative of the word '****' it's not unreasonable to give someone **** about spelling it incorrectly. Besides, as previously stated, the whole idea was to be insulting.

    So what does having the brilliance of using an incorrect spelling of "psychology" as your screen name merit on that IQ and/or insult scale of yours, you fucktarded pile of made up fucking fucktardedness?
    Calm down, it's only ones and zeros.

    "Your calm and professional manner of response is really draining all the fun out of this. Can you reply more like Dr. Fagbot or something? Call me some names, mention some sand in my vagina or something of the sort. You can't expect me to come up with reasonable arguments man!" -- MaverickZ

    "Tom Kagan spins in his grave and the fucking guy isn't even dead yet." -- Snake Plissken

    My Bullshido fan club threads:
    Tom Kagan's a big hairy...
    Tom Kagan can lick my BALLS
    Tom Kagan teaches _ing __un and bigotry?
    Tom Kagan: Serious discussion here
    Lamokio asks the burning question is Tom Kagan a ***** or just cruising for some
    I'm Dave the gay Kickboxer from Manchester and I have the hots for Tom Kagan
    TOM KAGAN, OPEN ME, THE MKT ARE COMING FOR YOU ! ARE YOU MAN ENOUGH TO MEET ?
    ATTN TOM KAGAN
    World Dominator 'Kagan' in plot to lie about real Kung Fu and Martial Arts
    Tom Kagan just gave me my third negative rep in a day
    I am infatuated with Tom Kagan
    Tom Kagan is a fat balding white guy.
  7. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/23/2006 11:44pm

    staff
     Style: xingyi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I read the conext correctly.

    Again all you did was dress up an argument again . He called you a fuctard, then with an avalanche of words, you said:

    As an example:
    "Locu5 is a FUCKTARD!"

    I also went for the condescending angle just to mix it up a bit and to come up with something more amusing than simply trading ‘Fuck you’, ‘No. **** you!’ insults.
    Wow, so you forget what you type don't you? Because that is exactly what you have done.

    So, the context doesn't really work. You insulted someone by trying to argue about a made up word.
  8. psychalogy is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/23/2006 11:47pm


     Style: Hoshin, Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Locu5
    Tell you what, you go and find places that ever spar with eye gouges, fish hooks, etc at medium contact. Since you won't find any you will have to content yourself with people who drill them in a compliant manner. While you are looking for sources, I would refer you to the wide number of "limited sports stylists using basic techniques" who spar with what they do all the time. Who has a better grasp on their skill sets and can translate them better into violence?

    Spoiler:
    HINT: It involves sparring.


    Also your previous assertion that current UFC rules restrict strikers shows a laughable understanding of the ruleset, which actually favors strikers over grapplers for the most part.

    So let's step back a bit shall we... what kind of sparring do you do?
    Took a while to get back to you Locu5, there was a queue.

    I don’t think I ever stated that there were many places out there that train with any measure of force or speed with the above mentioned techniques. I did state that you do at least need to train them in some fashion to have a reasonable chance of using them in a confrontation that matters. You can’t just rely on having some mental awareness of the existence of these techniques to be able to apply these non-standard attacks on the fly.

    As for your point about ‘sports stylists’ having a better grasp on their skill sets due to their regular sparring there’s no question. Absolutely. Again though, the main thrust of my argument has been, more or less, that the skill set of the average ‘sports stylist’ is somewhat incomplete from a H2H standpoint. Which was what Nubee, the guy who started this increasingly hijacked thread, was asking about. He is wanting to gain a measure of self-defence ability and so I thought it reasonable that someone at least start the discussion of possible weaknesses in the more sports oriented styles. That’s what internet forums are for, or so I’d been led to believe. Hey, I even train in a sport oriented style myself so I’m not bad mouthing them, just saying that some questioning is probably healthy.

    As for your 2nd paragraph, I don’t think that’s me you’re talking about. I’ve never voiced any opinion on the UFC from any angle, let alone one as specific as whether the rules favour one type of stylist or another. I don’t know enough about it given that it’s not widely available to view in Australia and I really couldn’t be bothered downloading several hundred meg vids to see an entire championship. All I’ve seen of it is highlight reels of particular fights and the odd short knockout clip. I freely admit I know very little about the ruleset that this competition uses, and as such have never commented on it.

    As for what type of sparring I do that depends on where I’m training.
    Nothing gets me to the point of wanting to throw up quicker than newaza when I’m at a judo class, stand up randori is less tiring for me. As for the intensity I train that depends on the other person and the wishes of the instructor. As I said, when it’s on the ground there have been more than a few occasions where the only thing stopping me from losing my lunch was the desire not to throw up on the mats.

    As for striking sparring it never gets beyond medium contact (i.e. enough to double you over if you cop a clean shot to the stomach but not enough to break someone’s nose… well at least that hasn’t happened yet), and unfortunately doesn’t even get there regularly enough. Keep in mind though that if you’re training full speed, full contact and full intensity then you’re no longer sparring you’re fighting.

    So that’s me, what about you?
  9. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/24/2006 12:03am

    staff
     Style: xingyi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by psychalogy
    Getting to the 'made up word' argument, ALL words are made up. It's the level of common usage that ends up defining whether they make the dictionary or not.As 'fucktard' is clearly derivative of the word '****' it's not unreasonable to give someone **** about spelling it incorrectly. Besides, as previously stated, the whole idea was to be insulting.

    Next…
    BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAA....................

    Please stay.

    I love it, this is beautiful. Sad thing is you can't get you argument correct. I don't know why you are saying "next."

    Let me point out why your statement is fallacious. ****+Retard(ed)=Fucktard. So, fucktard is not "clearly a derivative of the word ****." This is a combination of two words, it is called a blend in linguistics.

    "For example"
    suit+case=suitcase.

    Two functioning words blended together to create a new word with, a merged definition.

    NEXT
  10. psychalogy is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/24/2006 12:06am


     Style: Hoshin, Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Kagan
    No ****. The point is:

    Punching someone with real contact but with safety (headgear, padded glove, resticted target area, whatever) is far more likely to train a person to have the mindset to gouge their opponent's eyes out than pretending to train gouging a person's eyes out.

    That is the seemingly paradoxical outcome of the automatic response of which you obviously know nothing about. If you did, you wouldn't argue the point. You are not disagreeing with me. You are disagreeing with the methodology of the U.S. Military. Name a country whose Army trains as you suggest and I guarantee their methods are outdated.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Kagan
    So what does having the brilliance of using an incorrect spelling of "psychology" as your screen name merit on that IQ and/or insult scale of yours, you fucktarded pile of made up fucking fucktardedness?

    I see I’m dealing with a real brains trust here.

    Gee tom where to start?
    Let’s go with the screen name first. It’s an old screen name I’ve been using for as long as I’ve been on the intramanet thingy. The spelling is purposeful and has meaning, just not to you.. or most other people for that matter.

    That first post of yours is just a train wreck, really. You start out with a statement that you present as fact but have still made no attempt to support. It’s also becoming apparent that you have NFI about what the American armed forces may or may not do from a psychological perspective with their training. Again you don’t bother to back up any of your statements on this issue. You make what’s called an ‘appeal to authority’ without actually knowing what it is that authority says on the issue. And I at least have the knowledge to correctly use the term ‘conditioned response’ when it applies and not make up some pseudo scientific variant which you think sounds cool. Hint: it doesn’t. You simply sound like a know nothing wannabe.

    I did try being nice to you, but
    You remain,
    A Tool.
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