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Thread: SCA fighters?

  1. #11
    GranoblasticMan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DubhGhaill
    It looks really dorky, but at least they're hitting each other.
    SCA style combat is about as close to historical European combat as Kendo is to historical Japanese combat. That is, they're both sports/games intended to "look like" the combat, but little more.

    The thing is, it's very difficult to practice any armed martial art very safely. However, as mentioned before, the SCA ruleset is simply far too limiting. The point scoring is based on the "honor system," and so long as you can pretend you know how much force would be necessary to do a decent amount of damage to someone wearing (what the fighters "pretend" they are wearing) 11th century chain armor, then you can call the shots too light.

    However, as mentioned earlier, it completely ignores certain aspects of medieval combat, such as wrestling, which was in all likelihood far more common than Hollywood portrays (The Lichtenauer/Ringeck system of German longsword, for example, specifically talks about "Ringen am Schwert," wrestling at/with the sword). I also greatly disagree with the fact that they end up not using a limb that is "hit:" the number of SCA fights I've seen where a person would end up kneeling on the ground because he "lost" one or both legs, but somehow is still able to fight makes me scratch my head.

  2. #12
    Love's Avatar
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    I watched about 100 SCA members skirmish maybe 2 years ago. I've done a little more than a year of fencing, and 3 years of kendo. Additionally, I work at a Japanese highschool and am constantly surrounded by kendo, because all the students have to practice it, and one of my coworkers (and my current teacher) was/is on a women's team that placed in the Japanese national championships, and she practices with the Miyazaki brothers. Kendo is good at generating power. Obviously SCA can't do full power, though I certainly saw some savage bruises on them. But my overall impression is negative, and not because they can't grapple.

    I'm basing my impression on a set of assumptions, and on my single experience watching that fairly large skirmish. In kendo you can tap away all you want, but it doesn't count unless there is a lot of power (at least in comparison to the instinctive swings of a beginner). I am assuming there was some historical reason for the swings needing some power, ie. maybe light taps weren't sufficiently dangerous against armor. Well, when I watched SCA, it had a lot in common with modern point sparring tournaments, specifically the ones where they dance around on one leg with no balance and then tap, ever so gently, with the tip of their toes for the point, often falling over as they "strike". These SCA guys practiced a lot, and they were in decent shape. But most of them used light one handed swords, and they used them by leaning back behind their shields and rotating their weapons back and forth from the wrist (and only the wrist) at just above head level, until the tip tapped their opponent's helmet. It's hard to describe, but it almost looks like a weedwacker, only it goes back and forth, back and forth at the wrist. Everyone did it this way at the skirmish, and supposedly they were a good sized, skilled, and active team within the SCA. I can see why they did it that way too, it was fast and defensive and it got them the point. But, especially based on my experience with kendo, it had no power at all, and very little balance. So I don't think there's a real application to much of it, if as I assume, power is important in sword fighting.
    Last edited by Love; 5/11/2006 7:35am at .

  3. #13
    Love's Avatar
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    I feel like adding, that if the amount of Judo, Kendo, and jogging that all students are required to do where I work is typical, then I'd say the average 16 year old Japanese school girl could beat most of the people in the MAP meet video.

  4. #14

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    I'm willing to take the japaneese school girl vs me test. But it must be in jello.

  5. #15
    Matt Anderson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MMA_Phil
    ARMA - as in the Association of Residential Managing Agents? Wouldn't want to mess with those fuckers.
    That's right and you better watch out or I'll throw a long-term lease on you you'll never get out of!
    Matt Anderson
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  6. #16
    DerAuslander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Love
    I feel like adding, that if the amount of Judo, Kendo, and jogging that all students are required to do where I work is typical, then I'd say the average 16 year old Japanese school girl could beat most of the people in the MAP meet video.
    Sigged.

    Love, I love you.

  7. #17

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    Dammit, I wish there was ARMA, or HACA, or whatever you want to call them here in South Dakota. I even e-mailed them and asked if there was even one guy who had moved here. I should move again.

  8. #18
    solves problems with violence supporting member
    Ming Loyalist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Love
    I feel like adding, that if the amount of Judo, Kendo, and jogging that all students are required to do where I work is typical, then I'd say the average 16 year old Japanese school girl could beat most of the people in the MAP meet video.
    unfortunately as far as i know, kendo and judo are no longer required courses for japanese students (only some schools still require them.)
    "Face punches are an essential character building part of a martial art. You don't truly love your children unless you allow them to get punched in the face." - chi-conspiricy
    "When I was a little boy, I had a sailor suit, but it didn't mean I was in the Navy." - Mtripp on the subject of a 5 year old karate black belt
    "Without actual qualifications to be a Zen teacher, your instructor is just another roundeye raping Asian culture for a buck." - Errant108
    "Seriously, who gives a **** what you or Errant think? You're Asian males, everyone just ignores you, unless you're in a krotty movie." - new2bjj

  9. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by Love

    I'm basing my impression on a set of assumptions, and on my single experience watching that fairly large skirmish. In kendo you can tap away all you want, but it doesn't count unless there is a lot of power (at least in comparison to the instinctive swings of a beginner). I am assuming there was some historical reason for the swings needing some power, ie. maybe light taps weren't sufficiently dangerous against armor. Well, when I watched SCA, it had a lot in common with modern point sparring tournaments, specifically the ones where they dance around on one leg with no balance and then tap, ever so gently, .
    Your experience is unusual. In SCA, a hit does not count unless it is executed with FULL power (enough to penetrate armor). On e-budo there was a thread where a kendo teacher was complaining about a SCA trained student who was hitting way too hard for kendo.

  10. #20

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    My gripe with the SCA is the "Monty Python" rules...when hit to the arm, you stop using the arm...hit to the leg, you kneel. This makes every match look like the black knight bit from the "Holy Grail". I've never heard of any martial art that trains to fight when wounded.

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