Good post Haru!
I agree with you that someone should take accountability, but that won't happen from any of the instructors until they get the go ahead from JP himself. JP will not by any means own up for some of the crap that's been fed to the students. He really believes in his seminars and such that why would he admit that some of them are nothing but circus attractions to make money. Jerry and Scott might actually shed a lot of light on some things if you could sit down with them over a cup of tea. I'm sure they are reasonable men who would calmly take constructive criticism and engage a worthwhile conversation on Martial Arts. However, they have their feet buried pretty deep in JP's **** that they have to be careful also, or they could end up with a whole bunch of excess work load that they don't want. What I mean by this is that JP could do what he has done to Mr. Forgee, Mr. Dean etc... and open up a whole mess of legal **** and annoyance that I'm sure two family men like Hill and Levac don't want. Although, JP claims to be a philosophical man and should know that real men own up and take responsibility for things they have caused. Right???
A question for us: If JP would apologize to us for overcharging us on some things, charging credit cards of people who quit, physically and verbally abusing some students, and regretfully admit that he lost some really good students to greed and displays of unworthiness, would we all respect him more than we have on these threads?
I'd have to say that I would think more of him if he could infact own up to such unethical behavior. (I expect he doesn't care what anyone of us or anyone of his students think so I wouldn't hold my breath) However, sometimes people just need to clear the slate so that they can move forward once again. A new beginning so to speak.
The Way of Survival
CJOE won't own up to it because:
a) admitting fault opens the door to liability, potentially even civil litigation
b) can a self proclaimed/purchased 10th Dan/Grandmaster/Hall of Fame Inductee be wrong?
Seefoods won't criticize / change
a) they honestly think they are right and that FSD is THE WAY
b) it's the way they are trying to make a living
a) Either leave, or they buy into it even harder.
If CEEJOE did what you propose, I would have to reconsider a few opinions and I don't want to. I want FSD to be a laughing stock. I want people to realize that self defence against a side kick isn't catching the attackers foot in both hands as it hits your abdomen, twisting it over, stepping over the persons leg, sitting down on the back of his knee and twisting his foot into submission (don't laugh, we've practiced that manouever a few times when I was in FSD). I want people to wake up and walk away, or never join. I want the good instructors to still teach, but something else.
I am a bit torn because I want the good Seefoods to still be able to make a living and teach, and overall I don't want people want suffer financially but personally I would like FSD to go away in a big implosion. I'd smirk. Repeatedly.
I don't expect him to apologize, say "I was wrong, I've seen the error of my ways, and now I really want to present a quality MA school". I've more chances of seeing the face of Jesus on my excrement on my next trip to the bathroom.
OK I found a BJJ club that charges $80 a month. I can attend up to 12 classes a week if I wanted to. Sounds better than the $120 a month 2 classes a week at FSD. Is this a typical BJJ fee cause is sounds pretty good.
PS- I just watched my 3 year old son in his first JJ class. It was awsome and hillarious. And no instructor solicited him to attend a $40 weekend seminar.
For 12 classes! Sounds like a bargain--even if you cannot make it that much! Let me see 12 X 4 weeks . . . carry the . . . um . . . it comes out to like less than two dollars a class!
As for the rest, Seafood will NOT apologize, because he feels he is more important than others. It is as simple as that. What if Hitler apologized?
Kids in Jits is a fun thing to witness. Its also nice to know you can show up without being sold seminars, clothing or vitamins.
Originally Posted by HAVOC
It appears that Gerry, along with the FSD crew are mininmizing genuine problems into "sour grapes". While this may piss some people off, I actually like it. I don't think FSD deserves a chance to get it right. Their blind faith in their bullshit seems to ensure that they won't.
Originally Posted by Haru_the_larger
Yeah . . . I am glad someone else noticed the attempt to minimize the abuse as "sour grapes."
Drinking the Koolaid. . . .
Found this message posted on another forum....interesting.
"I tried out Fang Shen Do for about 6 months, then I went to a two day training camp with boot camp like drills. But we began the camp byt cleaning each others feet and they passed around a pail with dog **** in it. Then they talked about denying reality and making our own way in the world, if the dog **** smelled good we would be able to overcome something or other.
Then my friends that did other Martial Arts beat up on me sparring and then I quit.
Sorry for the ****."
Have a nice day!
1.) He just wasn't committed enough to Seafood's teachings.
Originally Posted by red-dragon
2.) He didn't train hard enough.
3.) We didn't learn 'that' defense yet.
4.) This event never happened, quit spreading lies.
5.) This will all be discussed in a book which I have no intentions of publishing.
Did I miss anything?
I can just see Jack and Jerry standing around before the seminar daring each other to **** in the bucket. They next decided who was going to wipe for who first!
PS - The dog called, he asked to be left out of this. He was under the impression that his artistic rights would be respected and not used as a teaching tool for the sheep of the world.
"Gerry Mansfield" has shown up all over this board as well as some other martial arts forums under various guises. In another forum (martial arts planet???) he had just moved to Ottawa from Montreal and found this great school called FSD. On another thread on this forum about Gracie JJ he attacked the local Ottawa BJJ schools whilst claiming to have no affiliation with any school. The funny thing with "Gerry" is he or she is too stupid to keep track of his or her lies and outed him/herself as an FSD stooge.
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