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  1. EternalRage is offline
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    WARNING: BJJ may cause airway obstruction.

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    Posted On:
    5/05/2006 12:45pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Bajillion Joo Jizzu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I don't think we can say "martial arts is about _____" and try to apply it to everyone who does MA and then label them as we see fit. I think we can only say "martial arts is about _____" for ourselves individually, because it is a question of purpose. For me, martial arts is about fighting... but to impose that on a meditating Tai Chier is just plain ridiculous because its my purpose, not his.

    It's like saying "swimming is all about rescuing people who are drowning." That's obvious bullshit, just ask Michael Phelps.

    So with that perspective in mind, my definition of bullshido is anyone who claims to be doing MA with a certain purpose, and then not actually training like it, or doing something else with it. If a Tai Chier says they are learning it for holistic meditiation I say ok that's cool have fun with that. If a Tai Chier says they are learning it as a comprehensive form of self defense and how they are going to be the next ultimate grand eternal fighter of the world without resistance training or cross training, then I'd raise the bullshido flags.
  2. Tom Kagan is offline
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    Dark Overlord of the Bullshido Underworld

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    Posted On:
    5/05/2006 12:50pm

    supporting member
     Style: Taai Si Ji Kung Fu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by elnyka
    pwned


    Get up, Elnyka! I'm not done with you!
    Calm down, it's only ones and zeros.

    "Your calm and professional manner of response is really draining all the fun out of this. Can you reply more like Dr. Fagbot or something? Call me some names, mention some sand in my vagina or something of the sort. You can't expect me to come up with reasonable arguments man!" -- MaverickZ

    "Tom Kagan spins in his grave and the fucking guy isn't even dead yet." -- Snake Plissken

    My Bullshido fan club threads:
    Tom Kagan's a big hairy...
    Tom Kagan can lick my BALLS
    Tom Kagan teaches _ing __un and bigotry?
    Tom Kagan: Serious discussion here
    Lamokio asks the burning question is Tom Kagan a ***** or just cruising for some
    I'm Dave the gay Kickboxer from Manchester and I have the hots for Tom Kagan
    TOM KAGAN, OPEN ME, THE MKT ARE COMING FOR YOU ! ARE YOU MAN ENOUGH TO MEET ?
    ATTN TOM KAGAN
    World Dominator 'Kagan' in plot to lie about real Kung Fu and Martial Arts
    Tom Kagan just gave me my third negative rep in a day
    I am infatuated with Tom Kagan
    Tom Kagan is a fat balding white guy.
  3. Teh El Macho is offline
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    Senior Member

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    Posted On:
    5/05/2006 12:57pm

    supporting member
     Style: creonte on hiatus

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Kagan

    Get up, Elnyka! I'm not done with you!
    Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!

    Read this for flexibility and injury prevention, this, this and this for supplementation, this on grip conditioning, and this on staph. New: On strenght standards, relationships and structural balance. Shoulder problems? Read this.

    My crapuous vlog and my blog of training, stuff and crap. NEW: Me, Mrs. Macho and our newborn baby.

    New To Weight Training? Get the StrongLifts 5x5 program and Rippetoe's "Starting Strength, 2nd Ed". Wanna build muscle/gain weight? Check this article. My review on Tactical Nutrition here.

    t-nation - Dissecting the deadlift. Anatomy and Muscle Balancing Videos.

    The street argument is retarded. BJJ is so much overkill for the street that its ridiculous. Unless you're the idiot that picks a fight with the high school wrestling team, barring knife or gun play, the opponent shouldn't make it past double leg + ground and pound - Osiris
  4. CNagy is offline
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    Registered Member

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    Posted On:
    5/05/2006 1:01pm


     Style: Hiatus for Gen. Fitness

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    For me, the term martial art denotes an artform based on some warrior practice. That said, I don't consider actual fighting styles to be "martial arts," instead reserving that term for more aesthetically pleasing and less useful styles. More dancing than anything, forms, lack of contact, etc.

    Technically, according to the popular definition, I practice a martial art-- but I doubt anyone has ever looked at what I do and considered it artful. Damaging, yes... destructive, yeah... brutal, quite possibly-- but not artful. I would prefer the term for actual fighting styles to be "martial science" but that sounds kinda dumb (even though I think it would be more accurate.)
  5. Phrost is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/05/2006 1:03pm

    Business Class Supporting Memberstaff
     Guy Who Pays the Bills and Gets the Death Threats Style: MMA (Retired)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by EternalRage
    I don't think we can say "martial arts is about _____" and try to apply it to everyone who does MA and then label them as we see fit. I think we can only say "martial arts is about _____" for ourselves individually, because it is a question of purpose. For me, martial arts is about fighting... but to impose that on a meditating Tai Chier is just plain ridiculous because its my purpose, not his.
    .
    The defining characteristic of the Martial Arts is fighting. Remove the fighting component from arts such as Aikido and Tai Chi and you just have eastern philosophy and funny outfits. Remove the punching and kicking from XMA and you have gymnastic floor exercises.

    So anyone who says the Martial Arts are not about fighting is full of **** and trying to make them about anything but fighting, probably because they can't fucking fight.

    You can say Driving is about the feel of the road, seeing the sights along the way, or expressing your wanderlust. But without the fact that the car is a tool to take you from one place to another, it's all pointless. Martial Arts are for fighting as cars are for driving. You can assign any ancillary fluff to the driving or fighting experience, but you can't change the fundamentals of what they are.

    The people who say the Martial Arts are not about fighting are exactly the same as the idiots who put racing rims and an F-1 wing on a Ford Contour, while claiming they just do it because they like the way it looks. It's bullshit, because deep down they want their 4-door shitbox to be fast and are hoping they can convince a casual observer that it is.

    Car modifications that don't enhance performance are a hell of a lot like martial arts belts and ranks that don't reflect ability. It's all about putting out an image.

    And that's the true reason why people say the Martial Arts aren't about fighting. It's so they can put out the image of being good at fighting, without ever having to actually prove it.
  6. Teh El Macho is offline
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    Senior Member

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    Posted On:
    5/05/2006 1:24pm

    supporting member
     Style: creonte on hiatus

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Phrost
    The defining characteristic of the Martial Arts is fighting. Remove the fighting component from arts such as Aikido and Tai Chi and you just have eastern philosophy and funny outfits. Remove the punching and kicking from XMA and you have gymnastic floor exercises.

    So anyone who says the Martial Arts are not about fighting is full of **** and trying to make them about anything but fighting, probably because they can't fucking fight.
    :bowdown:


    Quote Originally Posted by CNagy
    For me, the term martial art denotes an artform based on some warrior practice. That said, I don't consider actual fighting styles to be "martial arts," instead reserving that term for more aesthetically pleasing and less useful styles. More dancing than anything, forms, lack of contact, etc.
    Nope. See FMA's as an example. These are martial arts strictly evolved for fighting. No aesthetical nonsense in them. The popular idea of martial arts is just nonsense from pop culture.

    You are also thinking art == something aesthetic, and that's not necessarily so. Some (but not all) definitions of arts are the following:

    - A superior skill that you can learn by study and practice and observation
    - Art, in its broadest meaning, is the expression of creativity or imagination, or both.
    - Skill acquired by experience, study, or observation.
    - An occupation requiring knowledge or skill.

    None of these definitions require an aesthetic element. Therefore, martials arts are not necessarily required to be aesthetically pleasing just because the word "arts" is in it IMO.
    Read this for flexibility and injury prevention, this, this and this for supplementation, this on grip conditioning, and this on staph. New: On strenght standards, relationships and structural balance. Shoulder problems? Read this.

    My crapuous vlog and my blog of training, stuff and crap. NEW: Me, Mrs. Macho and our newborn baby.

    New To Weight Training? Get the StrongLifts 5x5 program and Rippetoe's "Starting Strength, 2nd Ed". Wanna build muscle/gain weight? Check this article. My review on Tactical Nutrition here.

    t-nation - Dissecting the deadlift. Anatomy and Muscle Balancing Videos.

    The street argument is retarded. BJJ is so much overkill for the street that its ridiculous. Unless you're the idiot that picks a fight with the high school wrestling team, barring knife or gun play, the opponent shouldn't make it past double leg + ground and pound - Osiris
  7. DerAuslander is offline
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    Valiant Monk of Booze & War

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    Posted On:
    5/05/2006 1:24pm

    supporting memberstaff
     Style: BJJ/C-JKD/KAAALIII!!!!!!!

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Anybody here read Donn Draeger or any hoplogical studies?
  8. CNagy is offline
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    Registered Member

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    Posted On:
    5/05/2006 1:26pm


     Style: Hiatus for Gen. Fitness

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Ah, in my opinion calling a system used for fighting a "martial art" is something of an insult, considering all of the other things that are also called "martial arts." It instantly puts styles that focus on actually fighting in the same category as styles that do everything but.
  9. BoardHitBack is offline

    Senior Member

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    Posted On:
    5/05/2006 1:35pm


     Style: Kyokushin

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by CNagy
    Ah, in my opinion calling a system used for fighting a "martial art" is something of an insult, considering all of the other things that are also called "martial arts." It instantly puts styles that focus on actually fighting in the same category as styles that do everything but.
    If I call a spoon a fork, I'm incorrect in my application of the word "fork" and in no way have I made the spoon into a fork. If I call a fork a fork I am using the term correctly and the fork is still as it always was- a fork.

    Hope this helps.
    He who attains his ideal by that very fact transcends it- Nietzsche

    I like my Te like I like my tea- from Fujian province and without any bullshit in it. Oh, and green. And scented with jasmine blossoms...

    Quote Originally Posted by A Better American Than You
    In every country and every age, the priest has been hostile to liberty. He is always in alliance with the despot.
  10. MaverickZ is offline

    Heavyweight

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    Posted On:
    5/05/2006 1:41pm

    supporting member
     Style: white boy jiujitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by EternalRage
    I don't think we can say "martial arts is about _____" and try to apply it to everyone who does MA and then label them as we see fit. I think we can only say "martial arts is about _____" for ourselves individually, because it is a question of purpose. For me, martial arts is about fighting... but to impose that on a meditating Tai Chier is just plain ridiculous because its my purpose, not his.

    It's like saying "swimming is all about rescuing people who are drowning." That's obvious bullshit, just ask Michael Phelps.

    So with that perspective in mind, my definition of bullshido is anyone who claims to be doing MA with a certain purpose, and then not actually training like it, or doing something else with it. If a Tai Chier says they are learning it for holistic meditiation I say ok that's cool have fun with that. If a Tai Chier says they are learning it as a comprehensive form of self defense and how they are going to be the next ultimate grand eternal fighter of the world without resistance training or cross training, then I'd raise the bullshido flags.
    your analogy would fit more if you said "swimming is all about travelling through water". people use that skill to achieve different ends, but that's what it is. martial arts are skills for hurting other people. what your ends are is a different story.
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