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  1. Seraphim is offline

    Senior Member

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    Posted On:
    4/17/2006 10:18am


     Style: Karate, Sadism, Violence.

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Multiple Opponent scenarios. How to?

    How would one go about training for Multiple Opponent scenarios? RBSD takes alot of flak, but how would one properly train for such an event? Is it even worth training for?

    Thanks in advance for any input you may be able to offer.

    -Seraphim
  2. PirateJon is offline
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    and good morning to you too

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    Posted On:
    4/17/2006 10:27am

    supporting member
     Style: MT/BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Where's that heisman pic?
    You can't make people smarter. You can expose them to information, but your responsibility stops there.
  3. FictionPimp is offline

    Sexiest Punching Bag Alive

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    Posted On:
    4/17/2006 10:34am


     Style: BJJ/Judo/Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Train as such, get mutliple people, have them attack you. Perhaps a good drill would be 2 or more people attempting to get a take down on you. Another drill would be 2 or more people attempting a take down with you attempting a technical stand up once you are down.

    *warning aikido speak* In multiple person randori in aikido striking isn't a big deal. The attacks (if more then 2 or 3) are easy to get tripped up and in their own way. Now allow them to take you down and it becomes extreamly hard to stand against more then 2 people (and with 2 people it is still really really hard). In a multiple person fight I suspect the main goal of attackers is to attempt to get you to the ground so they can stomp you. I would suggest learning to defend takedowns from multiple attacks while creating distance to escape. You are not going to win (unless you carry a gun or katana on your person at all times, and even then its risky), but you might have a shot at getting away if you can defend the takedowns/learn some tactics to stand back up and are a fast runner.
  4. CNagy is offline
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    Posted On:
    4/17/2006 12:49pm


     Style: Hiatus for Gen. Fitness

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Agreed with FictionPimp. Even alot of the aikido randori that I have seen placed an emphasis on movement; spinning, avoiding a corner trap, misdirection, etc. I don't think there is a good way to train to win a fight against multiple opponents so much there are ways to train the escape from such a situation.
  5. FictionPimp is offline

    Sexiest Punching Bag Alive

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    Posted On:
    4/17/2006 1:27pm


     Style: BJJ/Judo/Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Another 'drill' we did once was in bjj class. We had one guy in the middle and we all walked in a circle around the mat. The instructor would touch us on the shoulder as we walked by. If he squeezed the shoulder we could attack the guy in the middle (attempt to take him down) anytime before we reached the instructor again. He would start out with just one guy, then work his way up to two or three guys. This way the guy in the middle never knew the number of guys or the angle of the attack. I'm not sure what the instructor was trying to teach us, but I found it a great drill for learning to keep moving and defend takedowns without a sprawl.
  6. Mr. Mantis is offline
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    One Ambulance, Eleven Cops...

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    Posted On:
    4/17/2006 1:35pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Kung Fu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Would you believe 2 on 1 fighting forms are a bridge to multiple opponent sparring, and then fighting situation?

    It's true. You have to start somewhere, and practice. There are certain principles to keep in mind when dealing with multiples. They need to be applied and then practiced, like anything.
    “We are surrounded by warships and don’t have time to talk. Please pray for us.” — One Somali Pirate.
  7. saku39 is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/17/2006 3:00pm


     Style: taido

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    run, run, run. of course you have to have takedown defense, but once you have avoided the initial attack you need to run to a populated place or a house or just keep running so they give up. Run sprints ,run long distance. run outside, in woods on streets. All of this is your most basic self-defense. If you can't run away you are banking on having a 1-1 fight, or a no weapons fight, or facing someone smaller and less talented. Always got to have a back up. So get out there and run. YEAH! WEEE!
  8. hl1978 is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/20/2006 12:15pm


     Style: Aunkai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    from a self defense perspective learn to run

    however, i would start with this drill then move on to having multiple people attack you.

    have several people with air shields move around you within a small area (perhaps 20x20feet), you can move they can move, strike at the shields, try and move around enough so you face as few people as possible, that is to say move, so that you have one opponent between you and a second opponent. you have to move a lot, because if they all rush in at once (this isn't the movies where they take turns) you are screwed.

    Get the movement portion down, then try the same drill without the airshields.

    Again the key concept is move, move and move some more so you have to face the fewest people possible.
  9. Meex is offline
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    Loving Father

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    Posted On:
    4/20/2006 1:03pm

    supporting member
     Style: Tao Ga

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    The implication in most "multiple attack" scenarios is that you can win.
    NO, you cannot.

    Your purpose for practicing ANY drills, or scenario-based exercise must be to survive.

    That said, hl1978 has a few good tips. . .
    - face as few people as possible
    - have one opponent between you and a second opponent
    And, good advice. . .move, move & move.

    You will get hit, you will get hurt, you may bleed.
    Prepare for this. Focus on the goal. . .to survive.
    Don't get too caught up in techniques, or scenarios
    that have a step-by-step progression to follow. . .
    in a fight that all goes out the window.

    One of my students had a training group that ended
    each week with a training session focused on this
    very topic. They practiced two, three, and five on one
    attacks, taking turns trying to survive. Mostly, it was
    a good day when you lasted longer that ten seconds.

    One thing they worked on, was all of the tactics, and
    advice of the 'experts' - and the 'myths' they deal in.

    Here's some of what came out of that:
    - don't fight with you back up against a wall.
    If they all rush you at once, you're dead meat.

    - don't fight between two or in the middle of more opponents.
    *see outcome above.

    - don't fight in 'planned sequences'
    'They' didn't train at your school, so don't know their roles.

    - don't make the 'game' one-on-one with each attacker.
    Fight all as one attacker - strike the closest target to you,
    as you attempt tp get away

    - put obstacles between you and any of the attackers

    - try to sense the shortest route to safety, which is also,
    through the least amount of attackers, an go that ay.

    - don't attempt to 'finish' opponents you put down, just
    get by them. and on to the next one, or get away.


    * * *
    The best thing those days did for some, was to condition them to getting hit.
    Today, they neither worry about getting in a fight, nor do they worry about
    how much damage they can take. They know.

    `~/
  10. Yrkoon9 is offline
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    Brock Sampson

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    Posted On:
    4/20/2006 1:21pm

    supporting member
     Style: 5.56

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I've had 3 or 4 guys put on boxing gloves and we take turns beating the crap out of one guy.

    It really brings out your footwork andhead movement. Sink or swim.

    BTW we were not grappling or doing takedowns with this kind of drill. That would have been suicidal. It was strictly striking. And that was hard enough just to survive. I guess it is worthwhile to develop a specific subset of skills, but be sure it does not encourage people to think they can fight multiple opponents like in a Bruce Lee movie.
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