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  1. PointyShinyBurn is offline
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    Gnarly King of Half-Guard

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    Posted On:
    4/28/2006 10:59am

    Join us... or die
     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by PirateJon
    Or could it be that the sport reflects that having a good grappling game *IS* more important than a good striking game and thus bjj wins again?
    PirateJon has guard-stalled the correct into submission.
  2. Teh El Macho is offline
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    Posted On:
    4/28/2006 11:16am

    supporting member
     Style: creonte on hiatus

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by PointyShinyBurn
    I think Pe de Pano had been striking for about a month at that point.
    No wonder. I hope he doesn't think his win over Mir was proof that he can take on the uber-heavies yet .ie. Sylvia, Arlovsky et al.
    Read this for flexibility and injury prevention, this, this and this for supplementation, this on grip conditioning, and this on staph. New: On strenght standards, relationships and structural balance. Shoulder problems? Read this.

    My crapuous vlog and my blog of training, stuff and crap. NEW: Me, Mrs. Macho and our newborn baby.

    New To Weight Training? Get the StrongLifts 5x5 program and Rippetoe's "Starting Strength, 2nd Ed". Wanna build muscle/gain weight? Check this article. My review on Tactical Nutrition here.

    t-nation - Dissecting the deadlift. Anatomy and Muscle Balancing Videos.

    The street argument is retarded. BJJ is so much overkill for the street that its ridiculous. Unless you're the idiot that picks a fight with the high school wrestling team, barring knife or gun play, the opponent shouldn't make it past double leg + ground and pound - Osiris
  3. vladoshi is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/28/2006 11:38am


     Style: Judo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Jeff Fenech seconds that

    triple world champ, he commentated a kick boxing night and called it 2nd rate boxing with a few kicks. Which is what it is. Boxers are far better close fighters.

    What is the flooring of a UFC/MMA match like?

    I remember the Gracies infamously used pillow like floors in their matches to neutralise strikers in UFC 1. Kimura stated that judo techniques that would knock a man unconcious could not work on Helio because they fought on mattresses instead of mats. Helio never bothered to do anything until they were both lying down.
  4. BoardHitBack is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/28/2006 12:10pm


     Style: Kyokushin

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by vladoshi
    Kimura stated that judo techniques that would knock a man unconcious could not work on Helio because they fought on mattresses instead of mats. Helio never bothered to do anything until they were both lying down.
    source please.
  5. PointyShinyBurn is offline
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    Posted On:
    4/28/2006 12:28pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: BJJ

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by vladoshi
    triple world champ, he commentated a kick boxing night and called it 2nd rate boxing with a few kicks. Which is what it is. Boxers are far better close fighters.
    If you're talking about FC rules (American karate derived) kickboxing you're right. They'd both get fucking ruined in Muay Thai.
    Quote Originally Posted by vladoshi
    I remember the Gracies infamously used pillow like floors in their matches to neutralise strikers in UFC 1.
    Bullshit, I've got the video. How the hell does 'pillow' on the floor neutralise striking anyway?
  6. bodar is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/28/2006 12:31pm


     Style: none currently, ex-TSK

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    There's also the matter of specialization. A Boxer just punches, therefore his punching is going to be far better than someone who trains MMA, assuming they have been training for about the same amount of time.

    And trash-talking?! Boxing pundits should keep their mouth's shut as long as that goddamn thug Mayorga is still running his mouth. Also I don't recall any MMA fighter ever publicly describing how he was going to eat the faces of his opponent's children a la Tyson.
  7. bodar is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/28/2006 12:37pm


     Style: none currently, ex-TSK

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by vladoshi
    What is the flooring of a UFC/MMA match like?

    I remember the Gracies infamously used pillow like floors in their matches to neutralise strikers in UFC 1.
    The Gracies didn't pick the floor in UFC 1 because they didn't run it, they just participated in it. I don't recall it being pillow-like anyway. Nowadays, it's quite firm. That's why people get knocked out by double-leg slams and spiking an opponent's head is illegal. Your ignorant arguments amuse me though.

    EDIT: Look a bit soft, but far from a mattress. In the vid, it's evident that there's maybe 1/4" of sink in their feet but that doesn't do anything to striking, since a lot of schools train on that type of floor.

    Last edited by bodar; 4/28/2006 12:56pm at .
  8. vladoshi is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/28/2006 12:46pm


     Style: Judo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    judoinfo.com

    http://www.judoinfo.com/kimura2.htm

    "The throws had no damage on Helio since the mat was soft. "

    "But under the Brazilian rule, if Helio got pinned on the ground, all he has to do is to stay calm and be cautious not to get caught in a choke or joint lock, and remain still till the time runs out."

    "I intended to cause a concussion. But since the mat was so soft that it did not have much impact on him."

    The rest can be argued ad infinitum. General concensus (Gracies excepted) is that the fights they won were on soft flooring that made stand up hard (grips your foot to the spot, easier to lose balance), and grappling much easier.

    Thats why it should all be on grass. Its as natural as it gets.
  9. Neildo is offline
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    Posted On:
    4/28/2006 12:47pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: FBSD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Screw grass. You ever try to get grass stains out of a Gi? **** that.


    Sand, you pussies.
    :new_all_c
  10. bodar is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/28/2006 1:04pm


     Style: none currently, ex-TSK

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by vladoshi
    http://www.judoinfo.com/kimura2.htm

    "The throws had no damage on Helio since the mat was soft. "

    "But under the Brazilian rule, if Helio got pinned on the ground, all he has to do is to stay calm and be cautious not to get caught in a choke or joint lock, and remain still till the time runs out."

    "I intended to cause a concussion. But since the mat was so soft that it did not have much impact on him."

    The rest can be argued ad infinitum. General concensus (Gracies excepted) is that the fights they won were on soft flooring that made stand up hard (grips your foot to the spot, easier to lose balance), and grappling much easier.

    Thats why it should all be on grass. Its as natural as it gets.
    What about your UFC claim? I don't know anything about Helio vs Kano, so I'm willing to believe that they fought on a soft floor (especially if they set it up). Modern MMA floors are far more uniform and are harder than grass, however. Pride fights in a boxing ring for crying out loud! That bad for standup too?

    :icon_conf
    Last edited by bodar; 4/28/2006 1:07pm at .
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