Traditional vs Authentic MAs, what's the difference?

[DerAuslander]

Dr. X, I am so glad you came here. Having dealt with you at the Other Place, your reasonableness, your understanding, (and your ability to silence racist idiots) is greatly appreciated.

Please continue here.

{Auslander is going back to drinking. -Ed.}

[Doctor X]

Dr. X, I am so glad you came here. Having dealt with you at the Other Place, your reasonableness, your understanding, (and your ability to silence racist idiots) is greatly appreciated.

Please continue here.

{Auslander is going back to drinking. -Ed.}

I am Doctor X, and I approve of this message!

Paid for by the Committee to Elect Doctor X as Nicole Kidman's Snuggle-Bunny.

[Steve]

Yeah, I see this is an essential issue. Budo is not simply about fighting, and never was simply about fighting. It should aim to make you a better fighter, and should not claim to do this if it can't. Nonetheless, it is a way of being, not simply a kind of technical skill. For my part, I think that Aikido has a very slim chance of achieving either, Judo has a good chance, and Karate is hit-and-miss.

It is a typically aristocratic unity of physical, moral and intellectual prowess (however infrequently this unity has been achieved).

(my emphasis)

Ah-ha! I think that is a very good description of the reason that this thread exists, trying to figure out what styles could fit your above description. The sticky part would be the whole can of worms that is the idea that it is the practitioner not what's practiced that makes an art Traditional or Authentic (or dead or alive, if you like).

Going back to my original post:

Traditionalist's, IMO, are stuck in the past. While those who are Authentic keep there style growing, as the founder of their system would have done (if they we're still alive. IE. adopt, adapt or improve).

Would it be safe to assume that Traditionalists then have decided to live in the fantasy world where Budo has the exact same meaning today as it did all those hundreds of years ago? And that Authentic MAists have chosen to change the definition (altho not greatly, the principle is the same) to work in our modern times, dropping the "my master's way (or my master's master's master's etc. way) is the only way" ideology, updating the physical side of the definition of Budo.

[DerAuslander]

Would it be safe to assume that Traditionalists then have decided to live in the fantasy world where Budo has the exact same meaning today as it did all those hundreds of years ago? And that Authentic MAists have chosen to change the definition (altho not greatly, the principle is the same) to work in our modern times, dropping the "my master's way (or my master's master's master's etc. way) is the only way" ideology, updating the physical side of the definition of Budo.

One of the things Hee Il Cho has steadfastly maintained is that he is a traditionalist....while adding boxing and groundfighting to his curriculum. His mindset is traditional, the search for self in hard training, the philosophical outlook...the definition doesn't change. The application does.

[DerAuslander]

I am Doctor X, and I approve of this message!

Paid for by the Committee to Elect Doctor X as Nicole Kidman's Snuggle-Bunny.

Thank you for understanding why I got fed up trying to engage in reasonable discussion with Shotocunts.

[Steve]

One of the things Hee Il Cho has steadfastly maintained is that he is a traditionalist....while adding boxing and groundfighting to his curriculum. His mindset is traditional, the search for self in hard training, the philosophical outlook...the definition doesn't change. The application does.

Definition was not the best choice of words, I was using it to link back to what DAYoung was describing as Budo.

From what you said about Hee Il Cho, he sounds like the ideal. But I don't like what I find when I type in his name on Google: http://www.google.com/search?q=Hee+I...en-US:official

esp the first link with a lot of merchandising: http://www.aimaa.com/

I've always been of the mind set that my O'sensei kept to: "karate is not for money."

I know that A LOT of people ride the coat tails of real masters (Hohan Soken, anyone?) so I'm taking those merchandising sites with a grain of salt. I'll also take your word on it since you know more about him than I do (and that you know kimchi is a deadly weapon :new_smile ).

[Doctor X]

Thank you for understanding why I got fed up trying to engage in reasonable discussion with Shotocunts.

No problem. I did not mind that place, it was just a very small place.

I give them credit for trying to find accurate history behind the various styles.

--J.D.