Jujitsu or Judo for Self Defense?

***Cassius*** · Posted On: 4/03/2006 11:35pm

The second rates at my club go up and I see my instructor driving a brand new BMW when the mats need replaced, I'll get annoyed. Until then, meh.

**Meager** · Posted On: 4/04/2006 3:30am

Originally Posted by Hannibal

If you lift somone and dump them hard on concrete, you won't need to armbar them, or worry about gaining good position trust me.

Maybe, maybe not. I've been seio naged on a hardwood floor and been perfectly fine.

I love how you always post in vague generalizations, though. I bet you have a textbook lift and dump.

**Otaku Waffle** · Posted On: 4/04/2006 6:02am

Originally Posted by Garbanzo Bean

Why? Well, probably because amateur wrestling and (American) football are popular sports here. I'm not saying I'm never going to get the takedown against guys with 8-10 years of amateur wrestling in them, but I'd be amazed if I did.

GB makes a great point here in that you need to be aware what is relevant for your situation.
Here in Belgium, judo is a great choice because:
a) the weather is sucky enough that people'll nearly always walk around in a jacket and b) even in my little hometown with Pop: 25K there were 4 judo clubs and knowing how not to get thrown by a judoka then becomes important as well.

**Hannibal** · Posted On: 4/04/2006 6:24am

Originally Posted by Meager

Maybe, maybe not. I've been seio naged on a hardwood floor and been perfectly fine.

I love how you always post in vague generalizations, though. I bet you have a textbook lift and dump.

Huh ?

Let me get this straight.

Somone did a shoulder throw on you, you landed on a hardwooden floor and your still walking around in one piece ? Bullshit. If anyone does a correct shoulder throw or any other forward throw and you land flat on a wooden floor, then its hospital time.

Getting thrown and landing on thick crashmats still hurts as it is. Your a bit winded, but you can get up again. I honestly can't see anyone landing on a hard wooden surface safely.

My guess is your bullshitting about the whole thing or are confused on what a shoulder throw is.

**Sophist** · Posted On: 4/04/2006 6:46am

Originally Posted by Hannibal

Getting thrown and landing on thick crashmats still hurts as it is. Your a bit winded, but you can get up again. I honestly can't see anyone landing on a hard wooden surface safely.

Eh. Depends who's throwing and how hard and how they do it. I've been hit with a few seoi-nages where my feet have landed first and broken most of the impact so my body's not dropping far afterwards; but even if you're landing on your back after more or less falling under gravity from hip height you can survive fine if you breakfall, sometimes even on concrete. Winded maybe, bruised certainly, but not hospitalised. If you know how to breakfall, well, ****, people have fallen off fairly high ladders onto hard surfaces and not ended up in hospital.

On the other hand, I've been buried in crash mats by muscular dans who would almost certainly hospitalise me if they threw me for real. Sufficient acceleration plus somebody else making a crunching landing on your rib-cage is going to **** you up on concrete.

***JohnnyCache*** · Posted On: 4/04/2006 6:51am

textbook lift and dump + bad ukemi

(not saying you can regularly shrug off a hard fall on a hard surface, but to say one would cripple you is a bit much)

In otherwords, hannibal, he didn't land flat, he landed right. (a trick I'm notoriously bad at)

**babo78** · Posted On: 4/04/2006 7:49am

Originally Posted by Hannibal

Bullshit. If anyone does a correct shoulder throw or any other forward throw and you land flat on a wooden floor, then its hospital time.

If person who threw him did a textbook shoulder throw, it's not much damaging as it is. Because if you do a text book shoulder throw, ure opponent can or could drop feet first and absorb some impact. Text book execution of techniques don't teach u 'dirty judo'

Best way to injure someone in Judo is improper text-book execution of throws. At my old school, my instructors were cool or crazy enough to teach us how to improperly throw someone with specific intent to cause much injury as possible.

for example, in shoulder throw, instead of throwing the opponent so he'll drop toward's his back. we were also taught to throw the opponent so he'll drop on his head or face first if we wanted to hurt someone.

You still can injure someone with text book throws if you do them hard but best way to injure someone is to execute the technique non-text book. Like Sasae Tsurikomi Ashi, we actually did more of kick rather then sweep...that is not text-book.

How long did you do Judo for and what rank are you?

Edit: Spelling error.

**Otaku Waffle** · Posted On: 4/04/2006 7:52am

Originally Posted by Hannibal

Getting thrown and landing on thick crashmats still hurts as it is.

When you say "crashmats", do you mean tatami? I think of this when someone says crashmats and I don't see anyone doing randori on those, let alone getting thrown hard enough to hurt.

**Gezere** · Posted On: 4/04/2006 9:12am

From my personal experience, JUDO is better for SD. I've used this more than JJJ or BJJ in real fights. If you Judo sucks (like Shumas does) then you will need BJJ. If your Judo is good then I don't know many pple want to keep fighting after meeting the ground at a high rate of speed.

**Fearless Ukemi** · Posted On: 4/04/2006 9:20am

Originally Posted by Mr. Jones

This is off subject. But BJJ needs to change it's prices. If it doesn't BJJ will be just a bunch of middle class white people from the suburbs. Poor people have always been the best fighters.

Why should anyone change their prices if people are willing to pay it?