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  1. Jadran is offline

    Registered Member

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    Mar 2006
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    Zagreb, Croatia
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    Posted On:
    3/18/2006 6:12am


     Style: N/A

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I investigated a little bit. Shorinji Kempo is thought by Zoran Grgos, 3rd. Dan. But see this picture:

    http://www.shaolin.hr/malaonama.jpg


    Do you see the large guy with beard in white gi?

    There is another place where you can learn Shorinji Kempo. The TKD club "Iceberg Dan-gun."

    http://www.dangun.hr/shorinji.htm

    You will reckognize the same large bearded guy but in blue gi. His name is Miran Škerl and according to the site is an 8th dan Shorinji Kempo.

    " Japanese variant of Shaolin Yu Ch’i Chu’an known as Shorin-ji kempo, which is more well spread in Europe and US than in Croatia. In taekwondo club Iceberg Dan Gun master Miran Škerl 8. Dan teaches Shorin-ji kempo in traditional way, the way it should be teached on its very source."
    Last edited by Jadran; 3/18/2006 6:23am at . Reason: Wrongly named a dojo
  2. Guerrero is offline

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    Posted On:
    3/18/2006 8:41am


     Style: Muay Thai & "t3h gr4ppl3"

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    If you have the time and money to do both then do both. One is a striking art and the other is a grappling art. Both arts should compliment each other, not conflict with each other. Now if you can only take one, then choose BJJ and look for somebody within that academy who X-trains in Boxing or MT. There is a good chance you'll find someone who does. That's my 2 cents.
    Last edited by Guerrero; 3/18/2006 9:29am at .
  3. broken fingers is offline
    broken fingers's Avatar

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    Aug 2005
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    Arlington, Tx
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    Posted On:
    3/18/2006 10:25am


     Style: mixed

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Jadran
    I didn't express my self well in the first post. I wanted to train 2-3 years Kempo and then go study Brazilian Jujitsu. I will go also personally to see how they train.

    And here more pictures:

    http://www.shaolin.hr/slike/polaganj...aring4veca.jpg
    http://www.shaolin.hr/slike/polaganj...aring3veca.jpg
    http://www.shaolin.hr/slike/polaganj...aring1veca.jpg
    http://www.shaolin.hr/slike/polaganj...aring5veca.jpg
    if i were to travel back in time when i was 12 and stop myself from stepping wide eyed into a ninja school, i would say stop young ward, BJJ is the true way!
    oh man, i would be soooo bad ass by now...
    *thinks back like uncle rico from napoleon dynamite...*
  4. PirateJon is offline
    PirateJon's Avatar

    and good morning to you too

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    Posted On:
    3/18/2006 10:48am

    supporting member
     Style: MT/BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Guerrero
    If you have the time and money to do both then do both. One is a striking art and the other is a grappling art. Both arts should compliment each other, not conflict with each other. Now if you can only take one, then choose BJJ and look for somebody within that academy who X-trains in Boxing or MT. There is a good chance you'll find someone who does. That's my 2 cents.

    Like punisher said, it's not that they don't work well together. Not at all. The issue is that YOU aren't working them together. You may go - hey I see an opening for a hook or a takedown, but if you aren't practicing it you're just guessing. Honestly, it took me (striker) going to a pure grappling class to really see that. I could see openings for solid shots but since I can't throw them I have no idea if they'll work, or work conditionally, or even work against me.

    Taking a 'real' mma class would fix this, although like anything else in life if you only took a MMA class you wouldn't be as good at pure striking as a pure striker or as good on the ground as a pure grappler.

    If you can get lucky enough to be able to work pure striking, pure grappling, and MMA then you're perfect. I cantt wait to start my mma classes. :laughing1
    You can't make people smarter. You can expose them to information, but your responsibility stops there.
  5. Punisher is offline
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    Seeker of Truth

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    Sacramento, CA
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    Posted On:
    3/18/2006 12:07pm

    supporting member
     Style: Five Animal Fighting

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    PirateJon is the correct.

    My ideal school.
    http://www.moderncombatives.com/

    Check out their course list:http://www.moderncombatives.com/clas...ults_core.html

    Separate classes in striking and grapppling (specifically boxing/kickboxing and bjj) as well as MMA classes to integrate those core skills together. They also offer specialized classes to work on other aspects on your game, i.e wrestling, judo.

    All this with an understanding that most people are looking to have fun, develop some real skill, and achieve some level of fitness not to pursue a career as a professional fighter.

    Unfortunately for me, they're too far away for me train there. If I won the lottery, and didn't have to worry about being at work 8+ hours a day, I'd be there. Or more likely, since I'd be filthy rich, I'd build a place just like it where ever I went.

    End of commercial.
  6. Yamabushi is offline
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    Isolated and Confused

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    Posted On:
    3/18/2006 2:16pm

    supporting member
     Style: Bartitsu, Aikido

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Jadran
    I investigated a little bit. Shorinji Kempo is thought by Zoran Grgos, 3rd. Dan. But see this picture:

    http://www.shaolin.hr/malaonama.jpg


    Do you see the large guy with beard in white gi?

    There is another place where you can learn Shorinji Kempo. The TKD club "Iceberg Dan-gun."

    http://www.dangun.hr/shorinji.htm

    You will reckognize the same large bearded guy but in blue gi. His name is Miran Škerl and according to the site is an 8th dan Shorinji Kempo.

    Well, it confirms my suspicion that he's not a WSKO 8th Dan. His uniform and belt are wrong - WSKO does not allow blue uniforms and 8th dans wear black belts. He also appears to be wearing a hakama in the image link to the Shorinji Kempo page. Shorinji Kempo practitioners do not wear hakama. For demonstrations and special occasions they wear Zen Buddhist monk's uniforms call hoi like these blokes.

    The information given about Shorinji Kempo here is inaccurate, both about the Buddhist underpinning of Shorinji Kempo (it's Kongo Zen not Shingon) and about the presence of internal Chinese arts (Shorinji Kempo does not claim any internal influences).

    I also notice that the Shorinji Kempo and Hapkido classes are held together, which makes me suspicious that this Miran Škerl guy read about Shorinji Kempo, thought "That sounds cool" and stole the name and basic ideas.
    Failing to become awesome since 1976
  7. Jadran is offline

    Registered Member

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    Zagreb, Croatia
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    Posted On:
    3/18/2006 2:56pm


     Style: N/A

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    My God! Phrost was right. There really is bullshido is martial arts. I never knew to such a degree. I finally understand the basic idea behind this site. We really should fight such bullshit like this. You just prevented that I spend money on a McDojo!
    Last edited by Jadran; 3/18/2006 3:09pm at .
  8. Shuma-Gorath is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/18/2006 3:48pm

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ - Homeland Security

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    You know what complements BJJ better than Kenpo? More BJJ.
  9. Punisher is offline
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    Seeker of Truth

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    Posted On:
    3/18/2006 7:21pm

    supporting member
     Style: Five Animal Fighting

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Shuma-Gorath
    You know what complements BJJ better than Kenpo? More BJJ.
    I know you were just being cute, but I disagree. I also don't think if Jadran had to chose one or the other, that BJJ would be automatically the best choice. Assuming the kempo school was legit and trained the right way, which it appears is not the case, I'd probably lean towards the kempo school, depending on what Jadran's goals were for training.

    If there was a place like Modern Combatives close enough for me to train at, I would stop training at both my kenpo and bjj schools and train there exclusively. But there's not. The only MMA schools in the area are focused towards people that want to pursue fighting as a career and I don't. Spliting time between the two schools I train at is the best I can do.

    Some people may be shocked to hear it, but if someone asked me which school would be better for someone looking for some practical self-defense skills, I'd probably end up referring them to my kenpo school.

    I'd estimate about 80% of the material taught at my kenpo school are things I can see myself using if I'm ever in a self-defense situation, compared to 20-30% of the stuff I've been shown at my bjj school. Now that's just the physical moves, strategies, and concepts. You still have to train in a manner that allows you to actually use the stuff if you have to.

    X% of fights might end on the ground, but almost 100% of fights start on the feet and my bjj school barely addresses that. Their focus isn't self-defense or even fighting, it's teaching bjj. Almost all the classes are 100% on the ground with gi tops on. The sweeps, guard passes, and submissions I'm learning are fun to do and work against resisting opponents, but I don't think most of them transfer well to the self defense world. I just can't see myself armbarring a guy on "the street", in a bar, on a beach, or anywhere else outside a training or competition setting.

    The Saturday self-defense class at my bjj school is different. It starts mostly on the feet and it's all about taking the guy down and establishing a position of control. It's also where we do our no-gi training. Primo self-defense stuff, very practical, but it's a single 2 hour class once a week that most students don't bother to go to.
    Last edited by Punisher; 3/18/2006 7:23pm at .
  10. Hannibal is offline

    Grandmaster Sensei of Village Idiocy

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    Posted On:
    3/19/2006 7:18pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Kyokushin and Judo.

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Good point Punisher.

    The answer is Judo.
    Hannibal: The sworn enemy of dishonest politicians, source of entertainment on Bullshido and newly appointed Office Linebacker. Terry Tait ain't got **** on me !!!!
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