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  1. OZZ is offline
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    Posted On:
    4/13/2007 1:33pm

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     Style: Short Fist Boxing

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Sources?
    " If one wants to have a friend one must also want to wage war for him: and to wage war one must be capable of being an enemy." - Fr. Nietzsche 'On The Friend' Thus Spake Zarathustra
  2. burningmonk is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/15/2007 7:41pm

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     Style: Southern Short Fist

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I wrote a paper on the history of Okinawan martial arts for a Japanese history course at UWO about six or seven years ago. There were about three decent books at the University library, and my dad had about six books. Karate Do, my way of life, by Gichin Funakoshi has a little of the history in it. Much of what I know is anecdotal, however, it came from Matatsu Yagi, the Son of Yagi Meitoku, Chogun Miyagi's head student, and the head of Meibukan Gojuryu.

    As far as sources go, in this case I would trust him over any book put together in the west.
  3. OZZ is offline
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    Posted On:
    4/16/2007 9:44pm

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     Style: Short Fist Boxing

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Cool, just asking because this particular forum is a bit sticky about sourcing.:icon_thum
    " If one wants to have a friend one must also want to wage war for him: and to wage war one must be capable of being an enemy." - Fr. Nietzsche 'On The Friend' Thus Spake Zarathustra
  4. DerAuslander is offline
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    Valiant Monk of Booze & War

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    Posted On:
    4/16/2007 10:59pm

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     Style: BJJ/C-JKD/KAAALIII!!!!!!!

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Weapons were banned in Okinawa in the 9th century?

    Double check that.
  5. burningmonk is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/18/2007 10:05am

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     Style: Southern Short Fist

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Hiya.

    I think as early as the ninth, and will take an opportunity to check it. It may be off by a couple centuries. Admittedly, this is remembered from past study, and I should confirm details. Certainly weapons were banned amoung the common people from very early on, first by the indigenous king, and later by the satsuma clan from Japan.

    The weapons that we commonly associate with Karate, the sai, nunchucks, koma, bo, were all clear adaptations of farm implements. Sai were portable posts that farmers stuck in the ground to tie animals up with. Coma were a common tool for cutting grain in much of the world. nunchucks were for flaying grain. The bo was of course a simple staff. I've heard Okinawan folk story, and wheather it is true or not, it is certainly interesting, of an Okinawan Karateka defeating a satsuma samurai with a wet towel, disarming him and breaking his sword. his family was executed for his trouble. The point was that weapons were banned, and the farmers had to develop a means of self defence to protect themselves in a world without police or courts as we understand them today.
  6. DerAuslander is offline
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    Posted On:
    4/18/2007 11:38am

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     Style: BJJ/C-JKD/KAAALIII!!!!!!!

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    The sai and the nunchaku were not farm implements as is thought in popular mythology, but were actually imported from Southern Chinese martial arts, where they had been used for centuries with no connection to farm use. The rokushakubo is a staff, period. Non-farming cultures have developed stave techniques as well. The only one that is essentially a farm tool is the kama.

    Check the dates on the Satsuma occupation as well.
  7. burningmonk is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/18/2007 4:48pm

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     Style: Southern Short Fist

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    You might be right on the Sai and the nuchuku, I won't argue with you, however if it is mythology, it is well ingrained in the okinawan imagination that they were onced used as farm implements. I spent a brief period of time in Okinawa (one month), and a year in Japan, and this was the explanation that I got there. I will check on the satsuma occupation... now. And will be back.
  8. burningmonk is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/18/2007 4:59pm

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     Style: Southern Short Fist

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Three kingdoms that were nominally tributary to China were in control of the island from 9 Ad to 13 ad, when the island was united under one okinawan king.

    The Satsuma controlled the island from 1609 to 1879, when the Japanese gov't took over (for those who study japanese history, this was the time of the satsuma rebellion and the Meiji restoration).

    I am unaware of the use of Sai in southern Chinese styles, but I would be very interested to learn about it.
  9. burningmonk is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/18/2007 5:00pm

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     Style: Southern Short Fist

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Three kingdoms that were nominally tributary to China were in control of the island from 9 Ad to 13 ad, when the island was united under one okinawan king.

    The Satsuma controlled the island from 1609 to 1879, when the Japanese gov't took over (for those who study japanese history, this was the time of the satsuma rebellion and the Meiji restoration).

    I am unaware of the use of Sai in southern Chinese styles, but I would be very interested to learn about it.
  10. DerAuslander is offline
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    Posted On:
    4/18/2007 10:40pm

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     Style: BJJ/C-JKD/KAAALIII!!!!!!!

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by burningmonk
    I spent a brief period of time in Okinawa (one month), and a year in Japan, and this was the explanation that I got there.
    From who?
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