221953 Bullies, 4126 online  
  • Register
Our Sponsors:

Results 61 to 70 of 160
Page 7 of 16 FirstFirst ... 34567 891011 ... LastLast
Sponsored Links Spacer Image
  1. OnceLost is offline
    OnceLost's Avatar

    Here's looking at you, squid.

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    North Florida
    Posts
    2,860

    Posted On:
    12/28/2006 8:02am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Ke?po, MMA ultra-newb

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    The point is whether or not TFT fantasy fighters can reproduce the medical, trauma-based damage they claim is possible under 'alive' conditions.
    Of course they can...it's just too dangerous to test, so you have to take their word for it.

    Wait...Kungfoolss, did you say that the central nervous system can consciously override reflex reactions? Say it isn't so!!

    It's time for the test of the Gom Jabbar!!!
  2. curby82 is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    23

    Posted On:
    12/30/2006 8:29am


     Style: Violence

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    wow kung foo, someone seemed to have got you all riled up, just for simplicity can you try to compact your posts and questions in one or two posts as to make it easier to reply to you please.

    I'll touch on a few things that you spoke about, and the first being the liver shot. You should google the fight and more importantly Oscar's comments after the fight. I did'nt say that all the other punches had nothing to do with it, Oscar did when he said and I quote "it did'nt matter how hard he hit me, he got his button, and I went down, and though I was consious of everything around me I simply could not get back up"

    The brick thing was an exageration and if you could not see that.... nvm

    I totally agree with you about the consious controlling of the reflex actions, It is possible to control lets say a strike to the neck or groin Under Controlled Situations.
    There was recently a show on the Discovery channel showing some masters doing some incredible things, there was this one guy that was sticking knives in his eyes to the point that the eye ball was moving around with it, and another guy was bending spears with his neck and everyone was like wow and it makes you wonder if you can ever hurt these guys, but I garantee you if I offered to stick the knife in his eye he would have quickly turned me down, and if I stepped behind and punched the guy with the spear in the kidney,shin kicked him in the groin then drove his knee into the concrete, Stomped on the back of his ankle breaking it, then stepped in front of him and with a knife hand drove him onto his back by striking him in the throat, then took the spear and shanked him in the neck I'm sure it will have no trouble going in. VIOLENCE IS RANDOM you can't prepare to take a strike in a violent conflict.

    I know there were some other stuff that you spoke about kungfool but i can't go back and search through your posts for them right now but finally I say ruptured testicles and broken ribs that bruse and depending on the force of the strike even lacerate organs because if your spending time on a target you want to make sure your putting the maximum force possible at the time on that target and to insure that what ever target you strike is not going to work anymore once your done with it, but quite frankly you don't ned to break the the floating ribs to impact trauma on the kidneys but my ultimate goal when going for the kidneys is to crack his ribs, same with the liver and spleen, I want to crack his false ribs while going for them. And to clarify something again because I remember saying it before. It's not about pain, though there will be pain involved, when we strike a target its natural functioning is going to be altered. I guess thats why the shin is'nt a target, it may hurt like crazy when you get a kick there at times but it still works just fine once that pain is gone,thats a subjective injury, but if I drop my body weight, using the correct tool on top of someones foot, they may be able to by pass the pain but the result was a broken foot, and a broken foot does'nt funtion normally and thats an objective injury.

    Kungfool I really don't want to argue with you because it will go no where (though I have no problems in answering any genuine question about the system you may have for me), I simply replied to the question that the thread posed and in the process raised some questions that some people can only ask in a condecending manner hoping it will provoke a response and an answer that may wow them, but I can't do that, my only advise on that to anyone who has a curiousity about it would be to do some more checking on the topic on other sites for yourself and if you still can't believe what all the gulible people have to say about it then check it out for yourself.
  3. Kungfoolss is offline

    I restore the Balance

    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Sunny Hawaii
    Posts
    4,972

    Posted On:
    12/30/2006 10:26pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: I wear pants

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by curby82
    I'll touch on a few things that you spoke about, and the first being the liver shot. You should google the fight and more importantly Oscar's comments after the fight. I did'nt say that all the other punches had nothing to do with it, Oscar did when he said and I quote "it did'nt matter how hard he hit me, he got his button, and I went down, and though I was consious of everything around me I simply could not get back up"
    Irrelevant. The inference made by you was that the same results can be achieved by TFT practitioners. You may want to go back and read the TFT newsletter put out by Mr. Larkin that makes reference to this boxing match. He was incorrect and so were you, the only difference is you didn’t think you would get caught for citing it.

    The brick thing was an exageration and if you could not see that.... Nvm
    If you can’t make a coherent or believable presentation of your belief structure that isn’t so easy to dismantle, ultimately, who’s fault is that?

    I totally agree with you about the consious controlling of the reflex actions, It is possible to control lets say a strike to the neck or groin Under Controlled Situations.
    If that’s all you’re willing to agree to, then you totally missed my point.

    There was recently a show on the Discovery channel showing some masters doing some incredible things, there was this one guy that was sticking knives in his eyes to the point that the eye ball was moving around with it, and another guy was bending spears with his neck and everyone was like wow and it makes you wonder if you can ever hurt these guys, but I garantee you if I offered to stick the knife in his eye he would have quickly turned me down, and if I stepped behind and punched the guy with the spear in the kidney,shin kicked him in the groin then drove his knee into the concrete, Stomped on the back of his ankle breaking it, then stepped in front of him and with a knife hand drove him onto his back by striking him in the throat, then took the spear and shanked him in the neck I'm sure it will have no trouble going in. VIOLENCE IS RANDOM you can't prepare to take a strike in a violent conflict.
    These are issues of stage magic, but to then equate that against an individual that is prepared to be hurt and to hurt you, taking an attacker out is not so cut and dry if you fail to comprehend the variables present or are unprepared physically to affect those variables as I believe TFT practitioners to be.

    I know there were some other stuff that you spoke about kungfool but i can't go back and search through your posts for them right now but finally I say ruptured testicles and broken ribs that bruse and depending on the force of the strike even lacerate organs because if your spending time on a target you want to make sure your putting the maximum force possible at the time on that target and to insure that what ever target you strike is not going to work anymore once your done with it, but quite frankly you don't ned to break the the floating ribs to impact trauma on the kidneys but my ultimate goal when going for the kidneys is to crack his ribs, same with the liver and spleen, I want to crack his false ribs while going for them. And to clarify something again because I remember saying it before. It's not about pain, though there will be pain involved, when we strike a target its natural functioning is going to be altered. I guess thats why the shin is'nt a target, it may hurt like crazy when you get a kick there at times but it still works just fine once that pain is gone,thats a subjective injury, but if I drop my body weight, using the correct tool on top of someones foot, they may be able to by pass the pain but the result was a broken foot, and a broken foot does'nt funtion normally and thats an objective injury.
    This is the problem with TFT methodology, always attempting to go around “hitting your targets as hard as you can” is a flawed approach. Why? What if you miss? Surely, you aren’t naïve enough to believe you will always connect with your targets. What's worse, when you put everything behind that one strike and miss, you become extremely unbalanced and must recover before you can once again generate the same power output. Guess what, you won't always get that second chance to screw up. That stupidity could very well cost you your life.

    As for generating all that structural damaging force, I don’t believe you can do that either as it is a common philosophy for TFT individuals ‘not’ to even practice on heavy bags. Well, let me tell you something, if you don’t workout on a heavy bag to develop that power and instead wish to rely on TFT crayola crayons and hallucinatory garbage because it makes you feel better about yourself, then you’re going to hit like a wimp and not affect those targets. It’s really that simple.

    Kungfool I really don't want to argue with you because it will go no where (though I have no problems in answering any genuine question about the system you may have for me), I simply replied to the question that the thread posed and in the process raised some questions that some people can only ask in a condecending manner hoping it will provoke a response and an answer that may wow them, but I can't do that, my only advise on that to anyone who has a curiousity about it would be to do some more checking on the topic on other sites for yourself and if you still can't believe what all the gulible people have to say about it then check it out for yourself.
    Your problem is you jumped into a discussion which you believed nobody here had the first inkling to the TFT system. You were incorrect. You also believed that your knowledgebase regarding the peripheral nervous system exceeded everyone elses, you were wrong in that assumption as well. You’ve got about 10-years of catchup work to do before you can come in here and start lecturing other individuals on the principles of fighting - let alone mechanics - as it pertains to the peripheral nervous system and breaking the structure of another human being. The last thing you want me to do is to test your knowledge on Firearm disarmament protocols and mechanics thereby making you look foolish.

    PS. You should know, I’m not particularly impressed by instructor Torin either.
    Last edited by Kungfoolss; 12/30/2006 10:31pm at .
    Kungfoolss, Scourge of the theory-based stylists, Most Feared man at Bullshido.com, and the Preeminent Force in the martial arts political arena
  4. Kungfoolss is offline

    I restore the Balance

    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Sunny Hawaii
    Posts
    4,972

    Posted On:
    12/31/2006 4:16am

    Join us... or die
     Style: I wear pants

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    In case anyone is interested, here is a TFT workout. As you can see from the footage, these guys are merely going through the motions, sufficed to say these sort of mechanics and leverages are fine when applied to another human being of equal size or smaller. However, utilized against another person of larger proportions they will most likely fail and not go as smoothly. The reason these mechanics will ultimately fail is obvious - well, to me - is the lack of power being generated by both workout partners through the lack of drive and penetration, but this is what you can expect from a system that believes heavy bag workouts are not required.

    Clearly, is not how you learn to handle resistance.
    Last edited by Kungfoolss; 12/31/2006 4:35am at .
    Kungfoolss, Scourge of the theory-based stylists, Most Feared man at Bullshido.com, and the Preeminent Force in the martial arts political arena
  5. BackFistMonkey is offline
    BackFistMonkey's Avatar

    Actual Photo

    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Dayton
    Posts
    8,285

    Posted On:
    12/31/2006 5:52am

    supporting member
     Style: Recovery-Fu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Kungfoolss
    In case anyone is interested, here is a TFT workout. As you can see from the footage, these guys are merely going through the motions, sufficed to say these sort of mechanics and leverages are fine when applied to another human being of equal size or smaller. However, utilized against another person of larger proportions they will most likely fail and not go as smoothly. The reason these mechanics will ultimately fail is obvious - well, to me - is the lack of power being generated by both workout partners through the lack of drive and penetration, but this is what you can expect from a system that believes heavy bag workouts are not required.

    Clearly, is not how you learn to handle resistance.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nOyE6aQ6qKE
    compliance and rag doll physics FTW
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhi108 View Post
    Nuke a unborn gay whale for Christ.
    “I don't mean to sound bitter, cold, or cruel, but I am, so that's how it comes out.”
    BILL HICKS,
    1961-1994
  6. curby82 is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    23

    Posted On:
    12/31/2006 2:01pm


     Style: Violence

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    LOL you really think I care if you saw the newsletter that the fight with Oscar was posted, all that tells me is that you showed an interest in knowing more about the system before you say something about it, it still does not change the fact that it happened, and your problem is you still think of punching and kicking as arm and leg strength so you will always be at a lost as to how you can generate the forces required to do the structural damage I speak of. Kungfool you are exactly that. And for you information TFT is ALL about follow through with the strikes and while your punching with 20lbs for your arm I'll be striking you with 150lbs, and because we don't lead with our arms and legs there is little chance of loosing balance also the only place we train to fight is through the guy's space so if he does move a target it's not going to move very far. (INJURE< PENETRATE<ROTATE) we don't duel with the guy trading punches and kicks from a distance we go through him. I used the example with the brick because I know I would get some stupid response from someone like you saying I can't break a nose at will with my bare hands and then I would have to go through the mechanics of it which i did not have the energy nor time but the result is the same, you end up with a broken nose and your hands rise up to your face to protect and cover it.

    I really don't want to continue this with you honestly but as always us guys have that problem with having the last word but I have to do as I preach and walk away, so you can have the last word Kungfool. TO EACH HIS OWN
  7. Kungfoolss is offline

    I restore the Balance

    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Sunny Hawaii
    Posts
    4,972

    Posted On:
    1/01/2007 2:03am

    Join us... or die
     Style: I wear pants

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by curby82
    LOL you really think I care if you saw the newsletter that the fight with Oscar was posted,
    Then why make such a big deal about the crayola newsletter?

    all that tells me is that you showed an interest in knowing more about the system before you say something about it,
    I do my research, you can see how it benefits this discussion to destroy your misinformation.

    it still does not change the fact that it happened, and your problem is you still think of punching and kicking as arm and leg strength so you will always be at a lost as to how you can generate the forces required to do the structural damage I speak of.
    Do your research on me, you’ll realize just how moronic a statement that truly was. After all, if I didn't know a thing about what I was speaking of, why would the Founder of TFT bother to visit my personal forum to read what I had to say about fighting mechanics?

    Kungfool you are exactly that. And for you information TFT is ALL about follow through with the strikes and while your punching with 20lbs for your arm I'll be striking you with 150lbs, and because we don't lead with our arms and legs there is little chance of loosing balance also the only place we train to fight is through the guy's space so if he does move a target it's not going to move very far.
    That is the dumbest thing you could have possibly iterated. You really have no idea who you’re talking to. Read the following and learn a thing or to ’all powerful TFT nut burger’ -

    “However, that having been said, I, in all honestly could never use it to factor fighting mechanics. For one, we will never know the measurement of mass that is being transferred into a bodily target, there is no way I know of doing that. We can state 10% or 20% of the fighters mass is being utilized, but there's absolutely no way of knowing. The less mass, the less energy transference, with all things being equal, speed for us is a balanced and even distribution with our energy output.

    In addition, even if we could make such a determination of the mass being utilized by the practitioner, how much force would a 100 lb women need to exert to move a 230 lb man and/or the level of resistance caused by the surrounding environment? While math and physics can address some of these issues, it clearly neglects the physiological properties of the attacker or how that alone affects resistance. Likewise, our fighting mechanics is not restricted to the application of kinetic force alone, but compression force and all the complexities those principles entail as well.

    If this discussion has shown anything, is that THERE IS a science to combat and it is applicable. This is why I state and will continue to state, that combat is a Science, and while none of us may not have all the answers, part of the thrill is the struggle to make these matters quantifiable. However, you'll never accomplish that goal if you insist on going through life blindly believing fighting’s an art.

    Kungfoolss 2003


    (INJURE< PENETRATE<ROTATE)
    Yes, yes. I am quite aware of your brainwashed mantras.

    we don't duel with the guy trading punches and kicks from a distance we go through him. I used the example with the brick because I know I would get some stupid response from someone like you saying I can't break a nose at will with my bare hands and then I would have to go through the mechanics of it which i did not have the energy nor time but the result is the same, you end up with a broken nose and your hands rise up to your face to protect and cover it.
    Stupid response? As far as everyone else can see, you’re the one not making a lick of sense and the only thing you’ve done is regurgitate the TFT garbage spoon fed to you in their indoctrination camps.

    I really don't want to continue this with you honestly but as always us guys have that problem with having the last word but I have to do as I preach and walk away, so you can have the last word Kungfool. TO EACH HIS OWN
    If you want to flee from this debate, that’s your choice. It takes a man to stand up to criticism and not to run away like a coward.
    Kungfoolss, Scourge of the theory-based stylists, Most Feared man at Bullshido.com, and the Preeminent Force in the martial arts political arena
  8. Bladesinger is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Appleton, WI
    Posts
    558

    Posted On:
    1/01/2007 3:24am


     Style: MMA, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Were they really slapping the mats in that video like them funny pro wrestlers?
    Combat arts/training like that make baby Odin cry.
  9. Kungfoolss is offline

    I restore the Balance

    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Sunny Hawaii
    Posts
    4,972

    Posted On:
    1/01/2007 1:43pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: I wear pants

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Bladesinger
    Were they really slapping the mats in that video like them funny pro wrestlers?
    Combat arts/training like that make baby Odin cry.
    It was either the poor quality of the mats ( a lack of absorbtion properties) or they were purposefully hamming it up before the spectators. Personally, I believe it was both only because you should've heard a lot more sharp exhaling sounds on impact rather than the pro wrestling sound effects. The lack of vocal sounds suggest the power generated was not present. When you really get slammed with power, you will make noise with your lungs to disperse the energy, merely slapping the ground as the TFT instructors are doing is just not going to cut it. This is part of the reason I knew these guys in the video were not generating any substantial power with their use of leverages and throws or hits.

    I'll give you an example, my training partner and I were working out at a section of Waikiki Beach at night. Sand is very soft so there wasn't any of the pro wrestling sounds you hear in the TFT footage, but because we were hitting, throwing and slamming each other hard we did make lots of vocal sounds to dispel energy. After about 30-minutes, 4 police cushman's converged on our area because they were getting complaints from the hotel residents people were 'beefing' on the beach. We told them we were just working out and the cops shrugged and went away. When real force is being applied against you in training, you breathe loudly, if you aren't as these instructors are, then it's just TFT fluff and eye candy.
    Kungfoolss, Scourge of the theory-based stylists, Most Feared man at Bullshido.com, and the Preeminent Force in the martial arts political arena
  10. curby82 is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Posts
    23

    Posted On:
    1/02/2007 9:25am


     Style: Violence

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    "Oh how our egos get in the way of peace"

    someone sent him the post that was made of the crayons, and I believe that was made clear in the the letter, wether it was meant for you or not I do not know.

    unfortunatly I was not able to pull up the youtube vid that you posted but I can preety much imagine what it looked like and I must say if your trying to base an argument on how hard someone hits the mat in training then you truely are a retard looking for attention and recognition, remove the mat from the equation and put concrete k.

    I'm honestly and I mean honestly trying to figure out what part of TFT that you have the real problem with. Everyone says oh not everyone will react to this and that strike, I remember right after I came back from the seminar and I was talking to one of my friends about it and another one of my friends said thats retarded I would'nt put my hands there because I would have it in a defensive position blocking, and all the bells went off in my head because this is exactly the response we were told to look for when searching for a workout partner, and the solution we were given was to educate them, and I just jumped at the opportunity, so I said fine np and in the same wind I stepped in and back handed him to the groin, and sure enough a picture perfect groin reaction with little to no effort, and of course He said in the end " I only did that because it was you but in a real fight I would not do that" poor soul did'nt even realise that it was involuntary, He does'nt know that I could do him that everyday the same way and his body would betray him the same way every single time (well until he caught on to me that is)

    Whats the moral? Well I've hit lots of people in the groin before and have also been hit there and the day I successfully injure the groin and get no reaction is the day I drop into a crab back and like my own nuts.

    There are some targets in training that we obviously could not go all out on but there were some that we could (mainly the nerve strikes) and I remember every time I got hit in my LFC and sapheanous my legs gave out every single time and so did my partner's and every other person in the room, so I'll take a 100% probabilty in a class of 30 odd people over your fancy words anyday fool.

    Oh and there was one factor that you left out in your theory of speed + mass =
    and that was a TARGET. A 100lb woman could drop out of the sky on top a 320 guy and not even make him budge , but put an impact tool ( in this case lets use a knee) and a target (lets say his bladder"very poorly muscled area", we used groin to much all ready) and then drop that woman out of the sky and by golly we got our selves an injury. now I just want you to now picture if you were that guy that got 100lbs suddenly dropped through somone's kness onto your bladder, how do you think your body will move in response to having said injury. yup we all had the same picture in our heads with the body rolling to the side into a semi fetal position, and guess what that was a spinal reflex and it is universal to every single person in the planet.

    Now everyone has an issue about you cant hit it with the adrenaline pumping etc. but the thing is nothing stops whatever is happening to you at the point unless you injure the guy, so I don't see what the issue is, what ever thought you have in your mind as to how you deal with a given situation no matter how you go about getting there, whether you plan to you his force against him or to throw in combinations or what ever, nothing changes until you injure him, and all TFT teaches you is to immediatly go for that injury and it also shows you the places that the body is easiest to be injured, wether you believe the way in which we choose to strike is ineffecient is your views and understandable but it does not change the suseptability of the weak areas of the human body.

    now never mind the fact that in the mastery program they begin to use the reflexes strategically the fact is if I get that first injury his body will show me another area to injure and I just pick the one that I choose, I don't have to do it the fancy way like striking to the groin and knowing where his chiin and throat will be now going place my forearm there so he could slam his throat into it etc etc. I could simple step in with a forearm to the throat and push him all the way trough to the ground then while he is on the ground stomp the life out of him, nothing fancy about that but it works. TFT is'nt about Tim-inizing anyone it is about using violence but they show you the full scope that the information can be used in. Like They say all the time, if all else falls you can still pick up that rock and hit the guy repeatedly in the head and that will work too.

    So FOOL you can talk your semantics all day long but you know as well as everyone else in this room and on the planet that a thumb in the eye is a thumb in the eye and though some may react more dramatically than others the baseline reaction is always going to be the same, unlike the animal kingdom where there are many species of fish and dogs, cats, etc with us there is only one though we may have different faces and names our bodies are made up the same for the most part thats why I can study medicine in Cuba and still know how to patch someone up in China.

    Why do you seek so much attention KUngfool, poking me to enter into a debate about firearm disarment. Should just the fact that I don't particularly like you tell me that you know nothing about said topic. But you sure think that way, and I guess your use to getting your way in this forum right "do you know who I am" lol my girlfriend says that to me all the time so when you say it its a bit funny. I know I'm the new guy and may come off very arogant and it is by no means my intention so again I appoligise to everyone whom I may have offended. even you fool.
    Last edited by curby82; 1/02/2007 9:37am at .
Page 7 of 16 FirstFirst ... 34567 891011 ... LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Powered by vBulletin™© contact@vbulletin.com vBulletin Solutions, Inc. 2011 All rights reserved.