what distinguishes bjj from other submission wrestling systems?

**odd_lifter** · Posted On: 2/27/2006 4:18pm

i read in the gracies their book on bjj bjj became popular almost overnight because of the ufc s. the idea is the grapplers had a major advantage, because when there are no rules, the fight will go to grappling automaticly. what made bjj superior to wrestling was the submissions according to the book. are you telling me there were no other grappling arts with lots of submissions? or was in reality the true cause that they were exceptional fighters?

not a troll, please don't flame

**Camus** · Posted On: 2/27/2006 4:25pm

a better question would be:

"What distinguishes other submission wrestling systems from BJJ?"

**JohnnyS** · Posted On: 2/27/2006 4:49pm

I believe there's a few things that distinguished BJJ from other grappling systems, especially at the time of the first UFC's:
1) Straight away people were taught how to apply grappling to fighting. I've trained a little Judo, but was never once taught how to throw the guy when he was trying to punch me. In BJJ, you learnt to cover up, do a (crappy, but workable) takedown, get mount, punch and finish the guy with a back choke in the first class.
2) BJJ was taught in a systematic fashion. There is a clear hierarchy of positions, and a set progression to get from one position to another.
3) It had a history of fighting and that fight knowledge was passed down to the next generation. You knew that what you were taught worked because you'd seen it working on videos like Gracie in Action, the UFC and other fight videos.

**Darkpaladin** · Posted On: 2/27/2006 4:51pm

BJJ has more emphasis on the guard in groundwork. While still not the greatest position to be in, being on your back doesn't have to be a completely helpless situation. Also the guard isn't exclusive to BJJ (a fight between any grappling style or styles can end up with a competitor in the guard), but a high percentage of training time goes into guardwork. The other big claim to fame is that a small BJJ fighter can defeat much larger opponents, but that's a bit of a marketing ploy. I'm 215 and I wouldn't want to go against someone weighing at 250, as I'm sure a 180 pounder wouldn't want to wrestle me optimally.

Wrestlers (Catch, folkstyle, submission) do not like to be on their backs as much, and subsequently their scrambling, takedowns, and ability to stay on top are very sharp. I don't know too much about sambo, so I can't say much about it. I wouldn't consider Judo a "wrestling" style, but the groundgame is similar to BJJ, only not as emphasized. However the projection throws pack a punch, as getting dumped on your head or back from 5 feet isn't fun.

Also, the first UFCs had a big BJJ spin on them (thanks to Rorian Gracie, who created it). Truth be told, any grappler had as much a chance as Royce to win against the pure striking competition. Ken Shamrock for instance was doing well, losing to Royce early due to Royce using his gi for a choke (something Shamrock wasn't familiar with).

**Yrkoon9** · Posted On: 2/27/2006 4:51pm

Submission wrestling usually emphasizes submission over position.

BJJ emphasizes position over submission. Mainly so that BJJ can strike effectively. This is the essence of BJJ. The competitive aspect of BJJ might hide this fact but the reality is never completely obscured.

**Darkpaladin** · Posted On: 2/27/2006 4:54pm

Originally Posted by Yrkoon9

Submission wrestling usually emphasizes submission over position.

BJJ emphasizes position over submission. Mainly so that BJJ can strike effectively. This is the essence of BJJ. The competitive aspect of BJJ might hide this fact but the reality is never completely obscured.

Heh, I still can't wrap my mind around getting a submission without good position (damn bjj training :laughing7 )

But yeah, I guess there are strikes hidden in the secret bjj kata.