Carter Hargrave

**Yoj** · Posted On: 6/29/2009 3:00pm

There's a lot of readers that are going to mutter,"Is that all?"

Everyone is stupid in their youth.

**hungryjoe** · Posted On: 6/29/2009 3:07pm

Originally Posted by Cy Q. Faunce

Twenty years of good conduct says a lot more about one's character than some youthful indiscretions. In truth, I'd trust you more than I would someone who had never fallen to temptation. They have not been tested. You have, and you rose above it.

You are wise to defuse their blackmail attempt by publicizing the information. Now they have nothing with which to threaten you, and their desperation and lack of honor are now a matter of public record.

Well done, Joe.

Cy,

The drug charge was much later and truly a stupid thing to do. I had been good for many years and found myself in circumstances to which I fell. It was not the actions of a responsible adult.

Honestly, it hurt me deeply and I almost lost everything dear to me. Enough so that I would never put myself in that position again. My behavior was selfish and illegal.

Your words are good for the soul. I know there are those out there who will gleefully point to my post and crow.

Thanks Chuck,

Joe

**Sam Browning** · Posted On: 6/29/2009 3:08pm

Joe has been a valuable member of this site and I talked to him over the phone before he made the above post. He was willing to let some personal details of his life come out rather then being silenced as the authors of the above letter intended.

Incidently in Okie, harassment requires:

"A. Any person who willfully, maliciously, and repeatedly follows or
harasses another person in a manner that:

1. Would cause a reasonable person or a member of the immediate family
of that person as defined in subsection F of this section to feel
frightened, intimidated, threatened, harassed, or molested; and

2. Actually causes the person being followed or harassed to feel
terrorized, frightened, intimidated, threatened, harassed, or
molested,"

So for this statute to apply his little helpers have to argue that Joe's invitation to join this thread made them feel frightened, intimidated, or threatened, even though a total of two e-mails were sent, and the texts Joe has posted above were a straight forward invitation to join the conversation here. I think they threw the reasonable person standard out the window some where along the line.* (*this is a figure of speech, I'm not actually accusing them of throwing a real person out the window, they tend to be kinda slow about these sorts of things).

Whoever wrote the letter above might not remember, but a few years back Hargrave had on his site a reference to how Garry Dill his former teacher had allegedly threatened him, and worse. At the time I thought that this might very well be true but now having seen what they and their master consider harassment. (critical comments about Hargrave on an electronic bulletin board) I'm beginning to wonder if Dill didn't simply tell Hargrave not to let the door hit him on his ass on the way out.

Evidently a certain grandmaster feels very threatened by anyone who doesn't accept their grandmastership and call it "harassment" even if the poster never actually communicates with them directly.

**Cy Q. Faunce** · Posted On: 6/29/2009 3:11pm

Joe:

It happens. It's not about never falling. It's about getting up again.

I'm ten years sober, and I've had days where I damn near went back to day zero. I haven't so far, but if I ever do, I'm going to clean up my act and stop. Or so I hope.

**Dsimon3387** · Posted On: 6/29/2009 11:27pm

Originally Posted by hungryjoe

OK folks,

Below is an email I received from the Hargrave's organisation. I will give very little explanation afterwards, but feel this should be out in the open.

Removed is the personal information that was in the correspondence, including my name, address, phone number, etc.

To: "Joe"
We do not appreciate you cyberstalking us. Remove all attacks and stop harassing us and attempting to cause emotional distress. Or is it another felony to add to your list you are looking for.
Possession of Cocaine and Assault and Battery.

World Jeet Kune Do Federation Member Relations
www.worldjkd.com
Box 52820 Tulsa, Ok 74152 USA
************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** *********
This electronic mail message contains information that (a) is or may be CONFIDENTIAL, PROPRIETARY IN NATURE, OR OTHERWISE PROTECTED BY LAW FROM DISCLOSURE, and (b) is intended only for the use of the addressee(s) named herein. If you are not an intended recipient, please contact the sender immediately and delete the message completely from your computer system. Not Intended as a Substitute for a Writing: Notwithstanding the Uniform Electronic Transaction Act or any other law of similar effect, absent an express statement to the contrary, this e-mail message, its contents, and any attachments hereto are not intended to represent an offer or acceptance to enter into a contract and are not otherwise intended to bind this sender, World Jeet Kune Do Federation, Hargrave Arts LLC, or any other person or entity. I can do everything through him who gives me strength.
************************************************** ************************************************** ************************************************** *********

I did some things in the past.

The assault was nearly 20 years ago and involved a fight that ensued after I was struck from behind by a drunk driver and his passenger. When the police arrived I was the only person standing. Result - 5 years deferred sentence and no felony.

The drug conviction was the result of a small amount and I don't want to go into detail. The result was a 5 year deferred sentence and I believe still no felony since the deferred period has also passed.

I have stayed out of trouble, truly regret the drug charge and being stupid enough to put myself and those close to me through that period of time. There is no looking back. It is not exactly easy to post this to the BS community.

Those who know me know the person that I am. It is better to post and let you knowing what type of organization Hargrave runs.

This post is surely not what Hargrave expected when he or his minions sent me the above threat.

He is still, in my personal opinion, a joke as a 3 time grandmaster.

Hargrave - you should know that I am a bit older than you, so it's not as though I haven't heard the stories over the years.

BTW - the cyberstalking charge is a misdemeanor in Oklahoma -

http://oklegal.onenet.net/oklegal-cg...856914687992+F

Go bark up another tree.

Joe

**** this ahole Joe. We have corresponded and you come across as a good family man. We all have youthful indisretions, and a little bit of blow imo hardly even qualifies as such.... It is funny that this guy brings this up and one can only imagine what some of his past must look like.

This type of dirt digging is true trailor park detective work... it is pathetic and a way to really stretch when you can't legitametly discredit someone.

since it seems a good way to support you, CY having shared, and a few others I will share as well: To get through graduate school my wife and I did our masters together, she was an exotic dancer here... and lets just say we consumed a few substances in those years that were not legal!

here is another idea: In San francisco alot of people did that sort of thing.. so you can simply imagine yu lived here and people would seriously laugh at the accusation.

**hungryjoe** · Posted On: 6/30/2009 12:21am

Thanks.

Wondering if anyone out there has had dealings with Carter Hargrave?

PM me if you want. If need be, you can remain completely anonymous.

It would be good if his website was left out of this. He has threatened me due to contacting his website. You cannot reply to the emails he sends back.

It is now a bit personal and he knows why.

That's where Bullshido is best. Weeding out self promoted and possibly dangerous to their students instructors for some semblance of quality control.

Hargrave,

You know you're looking - how about a response?

**Sam Browning** · Posted On: 6/30/2009 12:27am

If we write him, he'll claim "harassment" from now on, so all we can do is invite him to come here.

**It is Fake** · Posted On: 6/30/2009 12:27am

Okay hold on a minute. I don't care if you did this yesterday. What exactly does it have to do with Hargrave ducking the questions?

You got into a fight 20 years ago whoopdeefuckingdo. So what?
You did some dumb **** concerning drugs? >..and this concerns Hargrave how?

Hey, we can go over to sociocide and get in a huge argument if you like but, really what does it have to do with this thread?

Apparently, you worked it out and everything is good now.

Again what does it have to do with Hargrave?

Seriously, digging up old **** makes him look very bad in my eyes.

**Sam Browning** · Posted On: 6/30/2009 12:29am

I think Hargrave thinks it supports his claim of "cyberstalking" that's why he brought it up in his reply.

**Yojimbo1717** · Posted On: 6/30/2009 12:59am

Glad this thread was brought back. I was looking over his site a few weeks ago and it's just so damn ridiculous. His martial arts descriptions, his books on Kempo and Jeet Kune Do...his little spiel on MMA which lead to him claiming he'd offer HMMA classes (wtf?)...etc.

Hope he comes on and explains himself. By the by, he has a RIDICULOUS number of sites about him and his supposed martial arts expertise. Try googling him and seeing where it goes. Very interesting.