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  1. Plasma is offline
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    Heel Hook Hunter

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    Posted On:
    2/19/2006 5:18pm

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     Style: Jiu Jitsu | Knife

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Shawarma
    He's thinking of Dave Beneteau (wrestling, judo) vs Asbel Cancio. (_ing _un)

    Summary of fight: Bell rings, Cancio drops into stance, Beneteau shoots and takes him down, is in side control, takes mount, starts punching the **** out of Cancio, Cancio taps out before the 0.30 mark.

    I saw that! My instructorand I watched like 10 times laughing hystically.
  2. JKing is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/19/2006 5:27pm

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     Style: Kajukenbo, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Firebrand
    Liu Bei posted

    A lot of Kung Fu styles were originally trolled on as well. But many of these have since then stepped up. For instance, JFS made a good showing of what Hung Gar and SPM can do in the many Maryland showdowns
    He did? I dont recall any actual evidence of his ability.
  3. Plasma is offline
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    Posted On:
    2/19/2006 5:46pm

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     Style: Jiu Jitsu | Knife

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by JKing
    He did? I dont recall any actual evidence of his ability.
    There were a few videos of him striking.
  4. Liu Bei is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/19/2006 6:02pm


     Style: Wing Chun

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    As said by Firebrand (whoa, I missed this one).

    Well, there are nutriders and trolls and there is everyone else. Nutriders and trolls just like beating on WC to make themselves feel better since it seems to be a favorite target around here. Then there's everyone else.

    For everyone else, we want good video evidence because there is so much bad video evidence out there. WC guys did not do very well in the early NHB events. Of course, most striking arts didn't do too well in those early events. Worst of all though was the William Emin fight.

    A lot of Kung Fu styles were originally trolled on as well. But many of these have since then stepped up. For instance, JFS made a good showing of what Hung Gar and SPM can do in the many Maryland showdowns before being called for some questionable grappling marketing. There are others as well.
    Ah, okay. Well, I've never heard of these events before. It is unfortunate though that the people who do not attend these kinds of "no holds barred" events may be from respectable schools run by respectable masters, but are regarded as bullshidoists. It's so easy to make generalizations in the martial arts world, especially with the archaic "pitfight" mentality going around ("If you're a MAist and don't fight in the ring, you're a pansy!") People seek instant gratification, and what many people want to see when they hear the term "martial arts" is a bloodsport. It is this great misnomer that has allowed the "art" aspect of martial arts to be lost.

    from whybother:

    I guess where I'm confused is how or why someone would believe "wing chun is good" absent evidence -- what are they looking at to make the claim in the first place? If the evidence exists, then please by all means show it to us! Martial arts claims without supporting evidence is a sure indication of bullshido.
    Personally, I didn't take Wing Chun to start barfights; not all people take up martial artists just to become emperors. I took it to connect with my culture, and to cultivate my spirit. I wanted to learn the "art" of my martial art. But because I have no "video evidence" to back up my claims, I can't exactly show you what I feel. I train in the style, which is where I get my views from, but I didn't exactly bring a camera with me to my training sessions in preparation of coming to this forum, and sending you guys vids of my kwoon (plus I just became aware of this site a few days ago, so I didn't expect to be prodded angrily for vids). I came here because I wanted to talk about martial arts, and its philosophies, period, not to tread on people's faces.

    I hate McDojo's too - they are the exact misrepresentations of the cultures that created these martial arts centuries ago, and I admire Bullshido for cracking down on these places and peoples (the likes of Ashida Kim and Leo Clausen, for example). What I don't admire is the archaic "pitfight" mentality that floats between some martial artists and some schools. That's why I don't go out of my way to challenge other schools; I fear misrepresenting my culture and my kwoon. When I do spar, it is with friends who are also MAists, half to test my skills and half to have fun, but even then I do not tread on their ideals and say "Wing Chun is l337er than your style!!!"

    But yes, I understand why Wing Chun is under such criticism, and why you guys need cold, hard evidence of me backing up my claims. All I can say is come to my school in Montreal and check it out yourself, because I'm not going to go out of my own way and try to beat up on other people just to put my ego on videotape.

    Be happy, love each other.

    -Liu Bei

    P.S.: Um, about this:

    Originally Posted by Firebrand:
    Liu Bei posted

    A lot of Kung Fu styles were originally trolled on as well. But many of these have since then stepped up. For instance, JFS made a good showing of what Hung Gar and SPM can do in the many Maryland showdowns

    Emphasis mine. I didn't post this, Firebrand did. If you read back carefully, you will see I did not write this at all.
    Last edited by Liu Bei; 2/19/2006 6:06pm at .
  5. JKing is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/19/2006 7:06pm

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     Style: Kajukenbo, BJJ

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    can I get a link to any of these video clips?
  6. Plasma is offline
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    Posted On:
    2/19/2006 7:13pm

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     Style: Jiu Jitsu | Knife

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by JKing
    can I get a link to any of these video clips?

    I believe groundcontrolba has them. If you send him a PM he probably repost them.
    Last edited by Plasma; 2/19/2006 7:22pm at .
  7. kikkoman is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/19/2006 9:50pm


     Style: TKD

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Firebrand
    Didn't Kikkoman say some good things about that Wing Chun guy he sparred?

    Ya. I thought he was pretty good considering he is a skinny guy. I beat him in a MMA match and a grappling match. But I was impressed during the grappling match. I know some BJJ (but very newbie, i learned it from another TKD guy, and a few rolls with a BJJ guy in frederick).

    In the MMA match I don't remember the details, but I threw some big punches. One of them hit pretty hard and we stopped.

    Then we did some grappling. I think I pulled guard. He did a forearm choke on me. I usually try to do a guard sweep that involves turning sideways. I could not turn sideways becuase his forearm was on my neck. It was uncomfortable, but wasn't actually choking me. It was a stalemate for a while with him doing forearm chokes and me being clueless. After a while a light bulb popped into my head, and I put pressure on his neck with my fingers. This created space and I went for a triangle choke and got it.

    He lost the fights, he gave me a hard time with the forearm chokes.
  8. kikkoman is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/19/2006 9:53pm


     Style: TKD

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by JKing
    can I get a link to any of these video clips?
    I believe kagekaze vs. grond was not taped. Niether was me vs. grond.


    I think there was only 1 camera and there was more than 1 fight going on at the same time.
  9. Liu Bei is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/19/2006 9:55pm


     Style: Wing Chun

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Hey kikkoman. What exactly did you know about the skinny guy you fought? Any trademark techniques that you saw which described his WC style?
  10. Plasma is offline
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    Posted On:
    2/19/2006 10:07pm

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     Style: Jiu Jitsu | Knife

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by kikkoman
    I believe kagekaze vs. grond was not taped. Niether was me vs. grond.


    I think there was only 1 camera and there was more than 1 fight going on at the same time.

    I think he was referring to the JFS striking video. I think we had a JFS vs. Kikko in the November videos.

    But those fights you referred to, wasn't taped.
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