Not really, it funny how all the n00bs spew the same tired line and expect it to be their own personal insight or some ****.
Originally Posted by SFGOON
Also, harassing n00bs is necessary for filtering out Martial Artists from keyboard warriors that haven't been punched in the face enough.
Yeah, but now that guys feeling are hurt!
Originally Posted by SFGOON
Oh man, is this ever awesome. Totally sig worthy if you weren't a n00b. Good job.
Originally Posted by Rashaka_13
Okay, maybe THIS is the problem with _ing _un. Trapping is *NOT* _ing _un. Nor is trapping "basic wing chun theory". That's like showing someone a RNC and saying "You know BJJ now!" So he's showing them some chi sau tricks without showing them how to even do the basics. Big fucking deal there. "My wing chun that I learned in 20 minutes didn't work! Oh no!"
Originally Posted by KempoFist
? Okay, get this. A _ing _un person *IS* supposed to get hit. There are no blocks in _ing _un. You are not going to stop anyone from punching you. Nor are you supposed to. The idea is simply to minimize what your opponent is doing, while maximizing your ability to damage your opponent. It is not to make yourself invincible, and teaching "trapping" as a means to that end, is NOT teaching ving tsun.
Originally Posted by KempoFist
Dagon "the gimp finger" Akujin :la:
My beef isn't with wing chun. Some of the ideas in wing chun I like. Being very explosive, not stopping until the opponent is down, strong forward pressure being hard for untrained people to deal with etc. I never trained WC, since I find the style to be pathetically dull to practice and would hence never reach any level of proficiency in it.
No, my beef is with the chunners. Along with Jehovah's witnesses, teenage girls and objectivists, these are the most chronically annoying and undeservedly self-important people on the planet.
Being a chunner is sitting in your couch watching Lennox Lewis box thinking "I'd Lap Sao his ass to pieces!"
Being a chunner is doing chunning hand movements in public places, to the acute embarrasment of anyone who knows you
Being a chunner is weighing in at 140 pounds of skin and bones or 350 pounds of flab and lard and thinking that you'll still defeat stronger, fitter opponents due to the inherent "principles" of your art.
Being a chunner is belonging to the ONLY FUCKING WC ORGANIZATION/CLUB in the galaxy that actually does WC right. Everybody else does it wrong.
Being a chunner is taking credit for the fighting prowess of Bruce Lee. You know, the Bruce Lee that crosstrained boxing, judo and TKD and ended up declaring WC "utterly gay."
Being a chunner is defending a video of two of your style's grandmasters fighting like retarded toddlers over their teddy bears.
Being a chunner is being secure in the knowledge that only your style will allow you to fight numerous uncouth ruffians attacking you at the same time.
Being a chunner is believing that size is unimportant.
Being a chunner is believing that you actually hit hard.
Being a chunner is eyegouging the spine of grapplers double-legging you.
Being a chunner means you're more arrogant than BJJ players, a feat that should be impossible to accomplish.
Being a chunner is pissing me off.
Being a chunner will get you summarily executed when I stage the coup I've been planning.
This constitutes the VAST majority of chunners I've met, both in real life and on internet forums. There are exceptions, of course, and I've enjoyed talking to them, even if I disagree about some of their ideas, such as antigrappling.
I think this has something to do with the people who're attracted to WC as well as the delusions of grandeur instilled into most chunners, because even crosstraining chunners are usually pathetically annoying.
And did I mention that wing chun is a cult? I meant to, cuz it is. But then again, so's BJJ.
Holy **** your right!
Originally Posted by Shawarma
About Wing Chun...
Hey guys. I'm kind of new around here and this thread sort of caught my attention. I hope what I say does not make people spout flame in my face, so have mercy please! :new_puppy
I admit that I practice Wing Chun, and I feel no shame in that. I can't account for the large mill of "chunners" that have been floating around in large numbers, but I do know that the style is an effective fighting system. I'm sure you guys heard enough about the centerline system and all that, so I'm not going to elaborate this now.
To start off, my beef about Wing Chun is not the style - it is the people who treat the art badly, similar to what Shawarma said. (btw man, "Being a chunner is pissing me off." I laughed at that looking down the list. :lol:)
What makes Wing Chun so popular as a fighting style is its implied simplicity: the concept of the "centerline" is easy to understand, and its effectiveness seems to have a wow effect over many of the other martial arts because of it. This has then lead to the common occurence (well, in my experience anyway) of people who have went and learned the style for three months, or maybe even a year, and think they are masters of the art and are invincible. Therefore, you have people who use their "Wing Chun" as a badge to flash their ULTIMATE FIGHTING SKILLS, even though they do not have the experience, nor the conditioning to back up their claims.
These are the "chunners" my school deals with on a frequent basis.
What many people (especially the grandeur "chunners") fail to grasp is that there are many aspects behind each of the movements that define the Wing Chun style, and they are far from simple; for just even the arm movements - the angle of the arms, how the hand is formed for the particular "sau", the timing of its application, where to place the hand movement for maximum effectiveness, the transition from one "sau" to another...--but the fundamentals of these hand movements stem from the workings of the body - from the body's angle, the positioning of the legs, the necessary state of relaxation, the co-ordination of the body with your movements, how to distribute your weight, so on so on so on. Then there's the fundamentals of kicking, punching (the one inch punch is hard to do, and it requires training to master, obviously), stepping, anti-grappling, weapon forms (of which there are commonly two, and there are extensive techniques behind these), mindset, etc. Then you anchor all this down with the famous centerline principle, which also is not easy to maintain. And suprisingly, all of this works, as I've seen my Sifu (a five foot two chinese man) take down people twice his size using these techniques.
The basic concept of Wing Chun is easy to understand, but the mastery of such an art form is an entirely other matter, as the list compiled above is just some of the many foundations and branches of knowledge that need to be acquired for one to truly be a master, and each aspect requires very fine tuning, for even half an inch off the mark with your movements can mean your opponent entering. Many of the movements are easy to mimic, but it does not mean that a person who can mimic the moves is doing them correctly. Even if one does know the purposes of these movements, applying them correctly is a matter of practice, critical thinking, and the acquisition of a proper mindset, for in order for any of the movements to be useful, the above foundations must be followed, otherwise they become useless.
Ultimately, because of Wing Chun's "simplicity", many either:
a) fool themselves into thinking that they are masters of the art after a short period of training, and (in some cases) leave to open up their own "Ving Tsun" schools (I'd like to ask about this term later, because to me it doesn't make sense).
b) think the style is too weak, and become arrogant enough to create their own style (this has happened).
c) stay in the school, and boast that their style dominates over all other martial arts to other schools, ruining their school's reputation.
d) a combination, variation, or all of the above.
Because of the actions of a large number of madly delusional "chunists", and the numbers of bad teachers who claim to teach the style, the art of Wing Chun has been marred by severe scrutiny, which is why this thread exists, and why I am writing to defend its authenticity. For me, it is also a matter of culture, because I don't believe the Wing Chun system survived three hundred years of history to be only bulls*t.
Personally, I am open minded to other forms of martial arts that are presented with respect. What I don't tolerate are the posers who either don't put forward the effort to backup their skills, and the bullies who step on others to feed their egos. Wing Chun, and other styles as well, are filled with such people, and I pity them.
Well, there's my input. Please feel free to tell me if I had missed anything, or if there are any errors in my argument. I hope no one got bored of my huge rant!
Be happy, love each other.
P.S.: What exactly is "Ving Tsun"? It's neither a mandarin or cantonese romanization (they are "Yong Chuen" and "Wing Chun" respectively), so it's not chinese. Can anyone clarify why the term is spelled this way?
P.P.S.: Dagon Akujin, can you please tell me about your style of Wing Chun? Because it seems very different from the system that I have learned.
Last edited by Liu Bei; 2/19/2006 1:55am at .
Yeah i have sparred with and once fought a couple wing chun guys. Its awsome to watch but any linear or power moves blew through any defence they had, i dont hate it, but it didnt have anything on me.
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