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  1. Coyote is offline
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    Your RBSD Cannot Save You Now.

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    Posted On:
    2/02/2006 11:46am

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     Style: Spanish Rapier/Epee/Foil

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by eyebeams
    When I worked out with capoeiristas (about a decade and a bit ago), they didn't advocate delivering force outside of the travel path of the kick, which is how you put strain on the side of the knee. The side of the foot should be moving up or down, not slappin sideways at the peak of the movement.

    By contrast, my knees are shitty and I can get the lead out with those kicks just fine. On the other hand, it's a whole bunch of movement to get the same power you get out of a round kick. Thus, I don't give much time to those other kicks these days.
    Correct on all counts.
    Crescent kicks are used mostly for show in Capoeira, not efficiency.
  2. Chance is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/02/2006 11:57am


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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    OK I still say you are ignoring my points and I can't make them any clearer, Capoeira is about history and culture you haven't commented on what I said about that, you just keep criticising me personally.

    Don't start lecturing me on which kicks are considered aggressive in Capoeira because I don't care. A martial art is about winning. Those kicks were absorbed into Capoeira by Mestre bimba as I understand it when he created what we now refer to as Capoeria Regional.

    Popquiz hot shot if this thread is about evasive manouevres do you know why there is no active blocking in Capoeira? Once again it relates back to the history of the art, displaced Afro Carribbean people and their culture. That's why the comment about the film Rize is relevant.

    I would like independant clarification from someone on Bullshido who is from Brazil but the way I was told it there is a saying in Brazil that "milk and fruit(I forget which fruit) are poison when taken together" The reason for this saying is the answer to your entire thread about the evasive characteristic of Capoeira.

    Once again separate issue don't you think that as someone who breakdances I would be overjoyed finding a martial art that compliments that? But it's not a martial art, it does not stack up against boxing, Muay Thai or BJJ.
  3. rexkwon is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/02/2006 11:57am


     Style: Thai boxing , JJ ,TKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Chance
    Nobody knows the history of Capoeira for sure, the records were burned only a few survive.
    There is no way it stacks up against boxing, Muay Thai or BJJ. Have you tried any of those circular crescent kicks on a heavy bag that would simulate using them on someone coming at you? I have, you nearly break your knee from the side force on the joint.

    Razors? Puh-lease do you train with knives like in Escrima? No, so that's out the door straight away.

    Separate issue, how Capoeira is marketed ouside of Brazil. Right everyone you've got to sing the songs in Portueguese, Bongo accompanyment. "Why?" "It's important to respect the culture and history of Capoeira" "What are we singing about?" "Orishas" "From Candomble?" "er" "Didn't the displaced Africans disguide their religion into Roman Catholocism to avoid persecution" "er" "Isn't Candomble connected to Vodun (Voodoo)" "NO! NO! Capoeira isn't a religion! No it's nothing to do with that my fearful of Voodoo European chums!" "So why do we have to sing the songs then could it be it's good marketing all smiling, clapping along?" WHITEWASH ALERT

    As I said in another post " There is some documentation of the undergroung "gangsta" period but I think this is misinterpreted as giving credibility to Capoeira as a martial art. It's just as relevant to say any dance form that has people in it who are connected to organised crime is martial. I think the confusion comes from the movements which are Afro Carribbean in origin. If you've seen the excellent film "Rize" by David LaChapelle documenting Krump there is a very interesting scene where the founders of Krump are shown footage of African tribal dances and they can't believe the similarity because to their knowledge they created the movements themselves. It's think it's a genetic memory, it just happens that these movements look warlike."

    Outside of martial arts one of the major wind ups for me is when dipshits who do Capoeira say stupid craplike "it's so cool we all use our Capoeira moves on a dancefloor!" you would be fucking owned by any Krumper or Breaker if you did that ****! I ever see anyone trying that when I'm out and I'll make a point of making you look stupid, you zero dancing ability twats. "You can come test, realize you're no contest"
    Here most of the songs Afro-Spanish with a little Portueguese and they are mostly about fighter, chiefs and old African stories.
  4. Chance is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/02/2006 12:06pm


     Style: None at the moment,

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by rexkwon
    Here most of the songs Afro-Spanish with a little Portueguese and they are mostly about fighter, chiefs and old African stories.
    Research the names in those stories and you will find Candomble. But why is it not presented with the full depth of its culture when it is marketed abroad? Ask your mestre about Candomble and he will most likely avoid the subject saying Capoeira is not a religion. It's not but it is a cultural expression and I object to any cultural whitewash for the sake of money, some Europeans would not like the association with African religions so they conveniently don't explain it.

    Just do a search for Orishas of Candomble on Google
  5. rexkwon is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/02/2006 12:10pm


     Style: Thai boxing , JJ ,TKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Chance
    Research the names in those stories and you will find Candomble. But why is it not presented with the full depth of its culture when it is marketed abroad? Ask your mestre about Candomble and he will most likely avoid the subject saying Capoeira is not a religion. It's not but it is a cultural expression and I object to any cultural whitewash for the sake of money, some Europeans would not like the association with African religions so they conveniently don't explain it.

    Just do a search for Orishas of Candomble on Google
    They don't sing of Orishas , El Maestro es Bautista.
    Yo entiendo las canciónes. No son de las Orishas.

    last ed for spelling
    Last edited by rexkwon; 2/02/2006 12:50pm at .
  6. Chance is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/02/2006 12:25pm


     Style: None at the moment,

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I wish I hadn't sold my copy of Origins of the Dance Fight Game because I could have quoted you exact songs.

    I don't understand what "El Mestro es Bautista" means is it Spanish?

    Coyote actually said "As for the musical factor of Capoeira, I must remind you that Capoeira is for fun. It is a game with a bit of martial arts thrown in" It's bad to be stepping all over someone else culture and religion and not even know it.

    But if this thread is about the evasiveness of Capoeira let's stay on that subject not how it's happy clappy bongo drum marketed.
    Last edited by Chance; 2/02/2006 12:28pm at .
  7. Coyote is offline
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    Posted On:
    2/02/2006 12:28pm

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     Style: Spanish Rapier/Epee/Foil

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Chance
    OK I still say you are ignoring my points and I can't make them any clearer, Capoeira is about history and culture you haven't commented on what I said about that, you just keep criticising me personally.

    Don't start lecturing me on which kicks are considered aggressive in Capoeira because I don't care. A martial art is about winning. Those kicks were absorbed into Capoeira by Mestre bimba as I understand it when he created what we now refer to as Capoeria Regional.

    Popquiz hot shot if this thread is about evasive manouevres do you know why there is no active blocking in Capoeira? Once again it relates back to the history of the art, displaced Afro Carribbean people and their culture. That's why the comment about the film Rize is relevant.

    I would like independant clarification from someone on Bullshido who is from Brazil but the way I was told it there is a saying in Brazil that "milk and fruit(I forget which fruit) are poison when taken together" The reason for this saying is the answer to your entire thread about the evasive characteristic of Capoeira.

    Once again separate issue don't you think that as someone who breakdances I would be overjoyed finding a martial art that compliments that? But it's not a martial art, it does not stack up against boxing, Muay Thai or BJJ.
    Once again, CAPOEIRA IS A GAME WITH MARTIAL ARTS TECHNIQUES THROWN IN!!!
    People go there to have fun, not to learn how to kick ass! And if they do, they are going to the wrong place.
    If you don't care about which techniques are considered agressive in Capoeira, why bother to post the fact that you don't? Could it be that you have been ignoring everything I have said about how Capoeira is just for fun? Of course martial arts are about winning! Capoeira is about winning inside the joda, not out on the streets. Don't you understand that I am not saying that it is better or even equal to boxing, MT, or BJJ? I am simply saying that a martial artist who takes the time to learn the escape moves and counters will be better for it when facing a striking opponant. I'm not telling people to bust out into a ginga when there's a 200lb. grappler bearing down on them.
    As for the lack of blocking, one of the reasons that I read about was the fact that Capoeira was illegal, and if you walk around the streets of Brazil covered in dusty handprints, someone is going to take an unhealth notice.
    What is this **** about milk and fruit? Try explaining yourself without resorting to metaphores and old sayings. If I wanted some pseudo-philosophical bullshit, I would go open a fortune cookie.
    Are there any other Capoeiristas out there? If so, I would like you to post so that I don't have to keep this tapdance up all by myself.
  8. Coyote is offline
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    Posted On:
    2/02/2006 12:33pm

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     Style: Spanish Rapier/Epee/Foil

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Chance
    I wish I hadn't sold my copy of Origins of the Dance Fight Game because I could have quoted you exact songs.

    I don't understand what "El Mestro es Bautista" means is it Spanish?

    Coyote actually said "As for the musical factor of Capoeira, I must remind you that Capoeira is for fun. It is a game with a bit of martial arts thrown in" It's bad to be stepping all over someone else culture and religion and not even know it.

    But if this thread is about the evasiveness of Capoeira let's stay on that subject not how it's happy clappy bongo drum marketed.
    I was working on my last post when this came in.
    I am not stepping on someone elses culture. You are the one who keeps insisting that the songs are all just a shitty excuse to sell bongo drums. For someone who "doesn't care which kicks are considered agressive" you sure do take a lot of interest in every other obscure cultural facet of the game.
    Are you by any chance a closet Capoeirista?
  9. Chance is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/02/2006 12:41pm


     Style: None at the moment,

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Capoeira is about history and culture, history and culture tells us who we are. It is very insulting for you to ridicule saying "what is this **** about milk and fruit" i hope you feel embarrassed when I explain it.

    As told to me by my Brazilian Mestre:

    The original Brazilian Indians made 'bad' slaves becasue they died too quickly from forced labour, the African slaves took longer to die so they were displaced from Africa and brought to Brazil. Each slave was assigned rations, a ration of milk which they desperately needed for healthy bones. The slaves saw all the fruit on the trees and thought why don't we eat this as well? The slave masters probably didn't think much of having slaves that didn't need to work for ration of milk any longer. They were told that if they eat the fruit and the milk it would mix in their stomach and poison them. That is some serious messed up **** right there. So we end up with the situation where the slaves have weak bone density from a small milk ration, that's why there is no active blocking in Capoeira, bone on bone contact had to be avoided.

    If I'm wrong I'm wrong, i'm passing on what was taught to me, as it was taught to me, that's all anyone can do.

    You should really question your block capital statement "once again, CAPOEIRA IS A GAME WITH MARTIAL ARTS TECHNIQUES THROWN IN!!"

    I was working on this post when I read are you a closet Capoeirista. Are you dense when it's obvious from my previous posts I know Capoeira techniques and have actually tried them out on a heavy bag??

    And knowing about the songs is not obscure what's the point of sitting there singing something you don't understand?

    The bongo drum hating must be with regards to my Motivational Poster and yes it's true I don't like the sound of Bongo Drums which is irrelevant.
    Last edited by Chance; 2/02/2006 12:48pm at .
  10. rexkwon is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/02/2006 12:48pm


     Style: Thai boxing , JJ ,TKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Chance
    I wish I hadn't sold my copy of Origins of the Dance Fight Game because I could have quoted you exact songs.

    I don't understand what "El Mestro es Bautista" means is it Spanish?

    Coyote actually said "As for the musical factor of Capoeira, I must remind you that Capoeira is for fun. It is a game with a bit of martial arts thrown in" It's bad to be stepping all over someone else culture and religion and not even know it.

    But if this thread is about the evasiveness of Capoeira let's stay on that subject not how it's happy clappy bongo drum marketed.
    Why? So I can tell you there are not the same song I will save you . There are not the same.{ that might be because we would understand the song.}The Maestro { teacher is Baptist}
    Last edited by rexkwon; 2/02/2006 12:58pm at .
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