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  1. The Green Beast is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/25/2006 9:55pm


     Style: American Karate

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Chambering is useful because of the two important things it accomplishes. 1: It refines technique. 2: It puts the knee in between the opponent and the kicker so that that attacker will not be able to get past even if the kick is not fully really released.

    If there are any other reasons why you believe the chamber is valuable, let's hear them. Cause that's all I've got.
  2. MaverickZ is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/25/2006 9:57pm

    supporting member
     Style: white boy jiujitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by The Green Beast
    Chambering is useful because of the two important things it accomplishes. 1: It refines technique. 2: It puts the knee in between the opponent and the kicker so that that attacker will not be able to get past even if the kick is not fully really released.

    If there are any other reasons why you believe the chamber is valuable, let's hear them. Cause that's all I've got.
    your first reason doesn't make sense. the second reason is a byproduct.

    the goal of the chamber is to help generate power. it is an integral part of hte kicking motion rather than an intermediary step on the way to the kick.

    so, a) it's is taught as a separate step to the kick in 99% of all pseudo-traditional schools i have seen and b) in TKD (i don't do any style of karate) the chamber is never obsolete.

    oh, and c) what the **** is american karate?
    Last edited by MaverickZ; 1/25/2006 10:04pm at .
  3. The Limey is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/25/2006 9:58pm


     Style: Ex-TMA/KB Noob/Judo Noob

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by The Green Beast
    My second post as n00b. Please read..for the good of karate practicioners everywhere...........

    Now, before you say: "Hmm, since I've read so many topics on Bullshido about how TKD is such an amazing art, the very fact that the Green Beast even posted a topic with the words, TKD and Karate in the same sentence is a disgrace to all martial art practicioners evrywhere"...but, hear me out.

    First, I'd like to clear a few things up about Karate that many of the avid TKD supporters or other martial artists have mislead the general republic about.

    1. In karate, once one has graduated beyond the beginner belts, chambering in kicking and punching becomes obsolete. Kicks transfer directly from the ground to their target. Their twice as fast as regular kicks, and just as powerful

    2. Regarding power, the Karate kick is by no means weaker than the TKD kick, In fact, in many aspects, the Karate kick is stronger. TKD uses the back leg as their principal means of defense as well as attack, while Karate uses the front. Front leg kicks are not only faster than the TKD back leg kick, but if used in a slide or pull, twice as strong.

    3. I don't know where anyone gets this impression that Karate martial artists are extremely stiff, rigid , and traditional. This is not true. Karate is an extremely flexible art that can bend to accomadate new kicks, new stances, and new blocks. I know from personal experience. I've invented several kicks myself (Not exactly practical I might add, but rather rewarding when you land :) )


    Now, if anyone can tell me how TKD is better than Karate, I promise I can counter every point effectively and clearly. Maybe I can earn my art the respect it deserves around here.....


    -The Beast

    In every karate and TKD club I have trained in the basic kicks and hand techniques are the same. Everywhere I have trained does both front and rear leg kicks "my old TKD teacher drilled us constantly in front leg kicks"

    From my experience there is little difference between the kicks of TKD or Karate.

    As for chambering, I disagree. It may not be as exaggerated in the higher ranks, and they may use kicks that don't get chambered but to say it's obsolete seems wrong to me - but my highest rank is 3rd gup so maybe you're taking non-beginner to be 1st dan and up? I've always considered 1st-3rd gup/kyu (red/brown) to be an advanced belt.

    When I have bad form on my kicks me kickboxing teacher doesn't hesitate to blame it on my karate training or my TKD training and reminds me that "karate does it wrong". I can't be bothered to tell him that the kicks he teaches are identical to what I've learned in the past and that the reason I'm doing them badly is because I didn't train for 3 or 3.5 years. Although I don't like his attitude much he is a pro fighter and can hit hard and fast and I'm improving at a much quicker rate than I did in any other school. Probably because we hit stuff all class instead of doing kata and kicking in the air like I used to.

    Overall Green Beast, I don't agree with what you have said regarding the differences in TKD and Karate. I have never found either style to rely mostly on front or rear leg kicks.

    A front leg side kick is a front leg side kick. It doesn't matter if you learned it in a karate school or a tkd school. It is essentially the same. One school's students may generally be better at it than the other school That is likely because the "better" school practises the kick more often while the "not so good" school does other stuff.
    Last edited by The Limey; 1/25/2006 10:01pm at .
  4. The Green Beast is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/25/2006 10:07pm


     Style: American Karate

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by MaverickZ
    your first reason doesn't make sense. the second reason is a by product.

    the goal of the chamber is to help generate power. it is an integral part of hte kicking motion rather than an intermediary step on the way to the kick.
    Reason 1. How can it not refine technique? By bringing your leg into a chamber position then releasing, you are eliminating the chances of throwing sloppy techniques.

    The goal of the chamber is to generate power. I fail to see your reasoning. Not only does chambering take more effort, it takes more time. The real power from the kick doesn't come from the leg extending. It comes from the back foot pivoting.
  5. MaverickZ is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/25/2006 10:09pm

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     Style: white boy jiujitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by The Green Beast
    Reason 1. How can it not refine technique? By bringing your leg into a chamber position then releasing, you are eliminating the chances of throwing sloppy techniques.

    The goal of the chamber is to generate power. I fail to see your reasoning. Not only does chambering take more effort, it takes more time. The real power from the kick doesn't come from the leg extending. It comes from the back foot pivoting.
    the chamber is not for refining technique because it is part of hte technique. practice refines technique. that's like saying a cross refines your punching... what?


    you fail to see my reasoning because you suck. you don't know what the chamber is for or how it's used. the "real" power of a kick comes from hip movement, not rear foot pivoting.
    Last edited by MaverickZ; 1/25/2006 10:11pm at .
  6. King Sleepless is offline
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    I am a living legend!

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    Posted On:
    1/25/2006 10:10pm

    supporting member
     Style: Tatsumaki Senpuu Kyaku

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by The Green Beast
    My second post as n00b. Please read..for the good of karate practicioners everywhere...........

    Now, before you say: "Hmm, since I've read so many topics on Bullshido about how TKD is such an amazing art, the very fact that the Green Beast even posted a topic with the words, TKD and Karate in the same sentence is a disgrace to all martial art practicioners evrywhere"...but, hear me out.

    First, I'd like to clear a few things up about Karate that many of the avid TKD supporters or other martial artists have mislead the general republic about.

    1. In karate, once one has graduated beyond the beginner belts, chambering in kicking and punching becomes obsolete. Kicks transfer directly from the ground to their target. Their twice as fast as regular kicks, and just as powerful

    2. Regarding power, the Karate kick is by no means weaker than the TKD kick, In fact, in many aspects, the Karate kick is stronger. TKD uses the back leg as their principal means of defense as well as attack, while Karate uses the front. Front leg kicks are not only faster than the TKD back leg kick, but if used in a slide or pull, twice as strong.

    3. I don't know where anyone gets this impression that Karate martial artists are extremely stiff, rigid , and traditional. This is not true. Karate is an extremely flexible art that can bend to accomadate new kicks, new stances, and new blocks. I know from personal experience. I've invented several kicks myself (Not exactly practical I might add, but rather rewarding when you land :) )


    Now, if anyone can tell me how TKD is better than Karate, I promise I can counter every point effectively and clearly. Maybe I can earn my art the respect it deserves around here.....


    -The Beast
    And all black people steal cars and mexicans only mow lawns, right?

    Listen Mr. Krotty Bigot. Your analysis sucks more than Paris Hilton in a hall of dick. Turning back kicks are used more often in TKD because of the Olympic style sparring, it's a very strategic kick used. People like to chase each other and it's the best kick to use when someone's chasing you. Please, I'd like to see you use your side kick in the same effectiveness if someone was chasing you in the same manner.


    Everyone gets the impression that it's stiff and rigid because, well... have you actually looked at your Katas? It's stiffer than Hugh Hefner. You guys move like robots. The Japanese OCD is showing in your Katas.

    By the way, JFS is going to come get you and eat your heart out.
  7. The Green Beast is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/25/2006 10:14pm


     Style: American Karate

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Sirc
    And all black people steal cars and mexicans only mow lawns, right?

    Listen Mr. Krotty Bigot. Your analysis sucks more than Paris Hilton in a hall of dick. Turning back kicks are used more often in TKD because of the Olympic style sparring, it's a very strategic kick used. People like to chase each other and it's the best kick to use when someone's chasing you. Please, I'd like to see you use your side kick in the same effectiveness if someone was chasing you in the same manner.


    Everyone gets the impression that it's stiff and rigid because, well... have you actually looked at your Katas? It's stiffer than Hugh Hefner. You guys move like robots. The Japanese OCD is showing in your Katas.

    By the way, JFS is going to come get you and eat your heart out.
    Thank you for your positve feedback. Moron. Read the rest of the post you idiot.
  8. Slydermv is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/25/2006 10:15pm


     Style: WTF TKD, BJJ/MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    ITF TKD.... huge fraction of TKD schools out there... primarily fight with front leg kicks due to sparring rule.... hence.... you have no clue

    As well... depending on the person... a variety of front or back leg kicks are used. It's just what works from them...

    You post about amercian karate vs. TKD is a futile attempt at retardness. Even if I went to every TKD and karate school in my city, I still would have little knowledge in the difference between styles.

    But the bigger point is... there are many TKD people who could kick your ass.... just like there are many karate people that could kick mine.

    Why? Cause they train harder and are tougher... please stop being a moron. What style you learn has nothing to do with it... unless you're going into a MMA match with no knowledge of groundwork, or into a judo match having only done Muay Thai.

    If you want a break down of different styles of kicks and their advantages and disadvantages.... there's been some really good topics. Do a search
  9. The Limey is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/25/2006 10:26pm


     Style: Ex-TMA/KB Noob/Judo Noob

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Hey, Slydermv where in Ontario are you?
  10. Soju_King is offline
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    Posted On:
    1/25/2006 10:29pm

    supporting member
     Style: Tae-Ninjitsu Mu Sool

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by The Green Beast
    My second post as n00b. Please read..for the good of karate practicioners everywhere...........

    Now, before you say: "Hmm, since I've read so many topics on Bullshido about how TKD is such an amazing art, the very fact that the Green Beast even posted a topic with the words, TKD and Karate in the same sentence is a disgrace to all martial art practicioners evrywhere"...but, hear me out.

    First, I'd like to clear a few things up about Karate that many of the avid TKD supporters or other martial artists have mislead the general republic about.

    1. In karate, once one has graduated beyond the beginner belts, chambering in kicking and punching becomes obsolete. Kicks transfer directly from the ground to their target. Their twice as fast as regular kicks, and just as powerful

    2. Regarding power, the Karate kick is by no means weaker than the TKD kick, In fact, in many aspects, the Karate kick is stronger. TKD uses the back leg as their principal means of defense as well as attack, while Karate uses the front. Front leg kicks are not only faster than the TKD back leg kick, but if used in a slide or pull, twice as strong.

    3. I don't know where anyone gets this impression that Karate martial artists are extremely stiff, rigid , and traditional. This is not true. Karate is an extremely flexible art that can bend to accomadate new kicks, new stances, and new blocks. I know from personal experience. I've invented several kicks myself (Not exactly practical I might add, but rather rewarding when you land :) )


    Now, if anyone can tell me how TKD is better than Karate, I promise I can counter every point effectively and clearly. Maybe I can earn my art the respect it deserves around here.....


    -The Beast
    ........oh u from Georgia too mayne? I'll bet you my Paycheck that my Caribbean WTF TKD is better than your Amerikkkan Karate.
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