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  1. Sean is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/22/2006 6:09pm


     Style: Kyokushin

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Rubber guard problem

    Hi evryone
    those of you who have used the rubber guard can you help me.
    the problem:
    I have tried to use rubberguard during sparring and got some omoplatas and kimuras but most of the time opponents can escape from the rubber guard

    (#1) simply by holding the ankle of the leg that is resting on his waist and pulling it inside between his legs.I have partially managed to defend against this kind of pass by keeping my knees tight against his body and pushing against his face with my knee to go to omoplata.

    (#2)But another form of pass that happens is when your opponent wedges his forearm between his body and your knee (of the leg that is resting on his waist)then pressing the knee down he passes the guard.
  2. Kengou is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/22/2006 6:23pm


     Style: TKD; BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I am by no means an expert in BJJ or rubber guard. I have, however, tried the rubber guard pretty frequently and it tends to work pretty well. So here's my experience:

    1: Make sure you are controlling the guy's arms. Immedately after bringing your leg high into Mission Control, start working to get his hand to the mat. Get a solid overhook on one arm, or at least get New York or London, as fast as possible. If he still uses his free hand to grab at your leg, you ought to be in a much better position to defend since you have one arm locked in and his posture still broken. Grab his free wrist, raise your leg out to the side and high, go for a triangle or an armbar. And omoplatas seem to fall out of the sky when you're using Rubber Guard.

    2: Be active. The purpose of the rubber guard positions is for extra control over the opponent. It breaks his posture, gives you extra grips, and sets up many attacks. It's not the type of guard you can just stall in; it's meant to give you active attacking possibilities from an otherwise potentially defensive or inactive guard game. Once you achieve mission control, move to another position quickly. Have some sort of plan in mind. Always work for something, either getting his hand to the mat, overhooking, achieving New York or London, or even trying an Invisible Collar. Since it is an open guard system, it's definately more vulnerable to getting passed than a standard closed guard. if you're active, he won't have time to try and grab your leg.

    That's all I've got for now. again keep in mind I suck at BJJ so hopefully one of the more experienced guys here can help you more or correct what I've said.
  3. Cassius is online now
    Cassius's Avatar

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    Posted On:
    1/22/2006 6:32pm

    supporting memberforum leader
     Style: Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Sean: What did your instructor say?
    "No. Listen to me because I know what I'm talking about here." -- Hannibal
  4. Sean is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/22/2006 6:57pm


     Style: Kyokushin

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I have not asked my instructor yet . Also I dont think he knows about it very well since he mostly prefers top positions.
  5. Gumby is offline

    BJJ Purple Belt

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    Posted On:
    1/22/2006 8:16pm


     Style: Brazilian Jiu Jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Sean
    Hi evryone
    those of you who have used the rubber guard can you help me.
    the problem:
    I have tried to use rubberguard during sparring and got some omoplatas and kimuras but most of the time opponents can escape from the rubber guard

    (#1) simply by holding the ankle of the leg that is resting on his waist and pulling it inside between his legs.I have partially managed to defend against this kind of pass by keeping my knees tight against his body and pushing against his face with my knee to go to omoplata.


    I use rubber guard pretty frequently, so I'll try to explain how I do it anyways.

    First off, you should try to set up the rubber guard from the full guard after pulling your opponents base down- its makes the setup for rubber guard safer.

    As far as your opponent simply grabbing your leg thats resting on the waist, he shouldnt be able to do that. *IF* you are lazy with that leg and just let it hang, he can simply step over the leg, so you want to make sure that even though the other leg is drapped across his shoulders, make sure you "walk" the other leg up as high as you comfortably can. If your opponent attempts to reach for anything, that is often the time for you to attack with which ever you want- grab his wrist and push it in between your legs and jump for a triangle, or even grab the wrist and try to sit up for a kimura attempt (which would abandon the rubber guard)

    Quote Originally Posted by Sean
    (#2)But another form of pass that happens is when your opponent wedges his forearm between his body and your knee (of the leg that is resting on his waist)then pressing the knee down he passes the guard.

    In this instance, you also have the option of pushing his arm through and jumping for a triangle. If you dont want to do that, try to regain inside control via pummelling (swimming your arms inside his to get underhooks).

    This is also a prime opportunity for an omoplata as well- omoplatas are difficult to do when your opponent controls your hip opposite the arm you are attacking. In the situation you described, try pushing his head to the side and look to set up the omoplata- it seems to be working for you.
  6. Animosimony is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/22/2006 8:32pm


     Style: mma

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    And don't keep your foot on his hip. You bring your foot down off of his back to the hip in order to rotate as you are executing your submission.
  7. Sean is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/22/2006 8:57pm


     Style: Kyokushin

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    So I had a misconception that you should keep one leg pressed against opponents hip.
  8. MuKen is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/22/2006 9:51pm


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    One thing that I find helps my rubber guard immensely is to constantly be mindful of the space between you and your opponent and minimize it, especially that near his armpits. Keep him tight to your body, ride your hips high, pull your lower abdomen up close to him so that more of your weight pulls him down, keep the leg across his back as high as possible so that your thigh comes into his armpit, and press your other thigh into his other armpit too.

    Minimizing the space in the center helps keep his posture down, and minimizing the space in his armpits opens him up to attack and restrains his arm movement. For example, moving from mission to control to new york is far easier when his arm is already partially extended and blocked from retracting by your leg. The two passes you talked about are also more difficult when your opponent's arm is blocked off at the armpit by your thigh.

    If your opponent makes space, your rubber guard becomes less effective, he'll pull his arms into it, and you won't be able to get the hand to the floor, the overhook or new york that precedes most of the attacks from there, and he'll be able to start working on passing.
    Last edited by MuKen; 1/22/2006 9:57pm at .
  9. Darkpaladin is offline
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    The r34l Drunken Jiu Jitsu

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    Posted On:
    1/22/2006 10:23pm

    supporting member
     Style: _razilian _iu _itsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I think it's harder to do rubber guard with a gi than it is without...

    It's more difficult to wrap your arm around theirs if they're wedging it tight (the slippage in no gi makes it much easier. It's a similar effect to how in no-gi the arm inside guilotine is easy, but with a gi it's damn near impossible.)

    With a gi, I find the crossover grip/leg on shoulder to be just as controling as rubberguard. You can get the pendulum sweep, armbar, triangle, and omaplata. Rubberguard really works well when there are no grips.

    If you're doing no gi, then pretend I wasn't here.
    :google:

    Number of bottles of beer downed by me and my girlfriend within a half hour while playing the Channel 7 "how many times will they say 'snow' game" during the "Blizzard of '06": 3.5 each.
  10. Hedgehogey is offline
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    Posted On:
    1/22/2006 11:13pm

    supporting member
     Style: ^_^

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Sean
    (#2)But another form of pass that happens is when your opponent wedges his forearm between his body and your knee (of the leg that is resting on his waist)then pressing the knee down he passes the guard.
    Rest the leg on his back instead and only put it on his hip when you're pushing off it. If you **** up, reach to the leg over his shoulder, go under the non-passing arm and go belly down, hopefully ending up in a reverse triangle.


    "The only important elements in any society
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