224709 Bullies, 4265 online  
  • Register
Our Sponsors:

Results 11 to 20 of 43
Page 2 of 5 FirstFirst 12 345 LastLast
Sponsored Links Spacer Image
  1. Shawarma is online now

    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Posts
    2,468

    Posted On:
    1/15/2006 9:19pm


     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Refer to Mr. Gerard "I like munching people and stomping heads" Gordeau.
  2. Gezere is offline
    Gezere's Avatar

    My guns bigger than Scrapper's!

    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Rhineland Pfalz, Der Vaderland
    Posts
    10,587

    Posted On:
    1/15/2006 9:26pm

    supporting member
     Style: Kakutogi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by KageKaze
    IMO that a valid statement. I joke around the MTD Crew that we can do "Ninpo GroundFighting" that involves me stabbing you with a knife and rolling away. However, there is some truth to that statement. If the other person got a knife on them, the last place you want to be is on the ground looking for a lock or choke.
    Benefits of a grappling situation is that you can feel your opponents movement and grappling teaches you how to control the body. Many pple THINK they can handle a knife in a freestanding enviorment but will be in for a surprise if/when it happens. I know from my experience it was GRAPPLING that saved me from further serious injury.
    ______
    Xiao Ao Jiang Hu Zhi Dong Fang Bu Bai (Laughing Proud Warrior Invincible Asia) Dark Emperor of Baji!!!

    RIP SOLDIER

    Didn't anyone ever tell him a fat man could never be a ninja
    -Gene, GODHAND

    You can't practice Judo just to win a Judo Match! You practice so that no matter what happens, you can win using Judo!
    The key to fighting two men at once is to be much tougher than both of them.
    -Daniel Tosh
  3. Virus is offline
    Virus's Avatar

    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    6,967

    Posted On:
    1/15/2006 9:34pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    "You will find that the only way to fight in such a situation is to keep your opponents at a distance where they cannot attack you simultaneously. If you start grappling with an opponent you immediately open yourself up to the other."

    In Bujinkan we have grappling techniques that involve holding people and using them as shields against other opponents. It may be an inherently low percentage move based on the disadvantage of the situation, but it is possible to adress multiple opponents and grappling in your training.
  4. Plasma is offline
    Plasma's Avatar

    Bullshido Admin

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    7,074

    Posted On:
    1/15/2006 9:43pm

    supporting memberforum leaderstaff
     Style: 柔術

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by LORD ASIA
    Benefits of a grappling situation is that you can feel your opponents movement and grappling teaches you how to control the body. Many pple THINK they can handle a knife in a freestanding enviorment but will be in for a surprise if/when it happens. I know from my experience it was GRAPPLING that saved me from further serious injury.

    Don't get me wrong and think I am anti-grappling, quite the opposite.

    Saying that, my "against a knife expirence" comes a lot from "knife sparring" at my dojo and at throwdowns. When you get into "grappling range" before disarming the knife (by cutting it out of their hand, or whatever) is a good way to get cut. Will standing and striking not get you cut, no it won't. However, you still have the chance to move and evade.

    Yesterday, we did some outdoor winter training at my dojo. To finish off the day we did some nice full contact sparring with shaken. So the idea was to use the shaken as a hand weapon and you can throw it if you want. Through expirence and sparring with a few different people, I found that when I got in tight to grapple I would get my arms cut (trying to control the weapon arm), what was working better was standing using slight evasions and counter attacking.

    This hits a bit close to home because I know this was one of the main reasons I stopped doing BJJ.
    Last edited by Plasma; 1/15/2006 9:47pm at .
  5. Gezere is offline
    Gezere's Avatar

    My guns bigger than Scrapper's!

    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Rhineland Pfalz, Der Vaderland
    Posts
    10,587

    Posted On:
    1/15/2006 9:48pm

    supporting member
     Style: Kakutogi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Virus
    "You will find that the only way to fight in such a situation is to keep your opponents at a distance where they cannot attack you simultaneously. If you start grappling with an opponent you immediately open yourself up to the other."

    In Bujinkan we have grappling techniques that involve holding people and using them as shields against other opponents. It may be an inherently low percentage move based on the disadvantage of the situation, but it is possible to adress multiple opponents and grappling in your training.
    I know in class I taken on 2~3 pple and I found that I wasn't terribly hard to defend my self while mounted on one guy. Is the came to strike or tackle I was aware enough to counter. (one guy did try to tackle from the behind and didn't think I would notice and went saying over me as I ducked him. It was quite a hilarous thing.) Now I sure if the pple still on their feet had a weapon I'm screwed but could still hold my own. I remember Oleg responding to the "grappling doesn't work against multiple opponents" by picking two guys, not part of his school and trained MArtist, and sparred both of htem and he wrapped one up threw him down and when to what was essentially a knee on belly and then when the other guy tried to strike him he managed to wrap him up too. So that arguement doesn't hold much water since is CAN be done.
    ______
    Xiao Ao Jiang Hu Zhi Dong Fang Bu Bai (Laughing Proud Warrior Invincible Asia) Dark Emperor of Baji!!!

    RIP SOLDIER

    Didn't anyone ever tell him a fat man could never be a ninja
    -Gene, GODHAND

    You can't practice Judo just to win a Judo Match! You practice so that no matter what happens, you can win using Judo!
    The key to fighting two men at once is to be much tougher than both of them.
    -Daniel Tosh
  6. ex_jungyae is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    pst
    Posts
    81

    Posted On:
    1/15/2006 9:57pm


     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by KageKaze
    Don't get me wrong and think I am anti-grappling, quite the opposite.

    Saying that, my "against a knife expirence" comes a lot from "knife sparring" at my dojo and at throwdowns. When you get into "grappling range" before disarming the knife (by cutting it out of their hand, or whatever) is a good way to get cut. Will standing and striking not get you cut, no it won't. However, you still have the chance to move and evade.

    Yesterday, we did some outdoor winter training at my dojo. To finish off the day we did some nice full contact sparring with shaken. So the idea was to use the shaken as a hand weapon and you can throw it if you want. Through expirence and sparring with a few different people, I found that when I got in tight to grapple I would get my arms cut (trying to control the weapon arm), what was working better was standing using slight evasions and counter attacking.

    This hits a bit close to home because I know this was one of the main reasons I stopped doing BJJ.
    Wait let me get this straight....

    You were fighting with knives and got cut when you got into grappling range... so you quit taking BJJ?

    So what are you going to do when you get cut while stand up fighting... take up dance?

    You will get cut no matter where you are, standing / ground, deal with it.

    If I was having trouble handling someone in a grappling situation I would want to train that situation more... not remove it from my training.
  7. Gezere is offline
    Gezere's Avatar

    My guns bigger than Scrapper's!

    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Rhineland Pfalz, Der Vaderland
    Posts
    10,587

    Posted On:
    1/15/2006 10:02pm

    supporting member
     Style: Kakutogi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by KageKaze
    Don't get me wrong and think I am anti-grappling, quite the opposite.

    Saying that, my "against a knife expirence" comes a lot from "knife sparring" at my dojo and at throwdowns. When you get into "grappling range" before disarming the knife (by cutting it out of their hand, or whatever) is a good way to get cut. Will standing and striking not get you cut, no it won't. However, you still have the chance to move and evade.

    Yesterday, we did some outdoor winter training at my dojo. To finish off the day we did some nice full contact sparring with shaken. So the idea was to use the shaken as a hand weapon and you can throw it if you want. Through expirence and sparring with a few different people, I found that when I got in tight to grapple I would get my arms cut (trying to control the weapon arm), what was working better was standing using slight evasions and counter attacking.

    This hits a bit close to home because I know this was one of the main reasons I stopped doing BJJ.
    Again this illustrates several fallacies most schools do with knife training.

    1) Who is going to use a SHAKEN in a fight now adays? Why aren't you training with weapons you are likely of using. All you are doing is Culutral Preservation and not being realistic or practical.

    2) What makes you think you AREN'T going to get cut. Ultimately you train to minimize as much damage you recieve as possible but do you thing that you will always get into a fist fight and not get hit?

    3) You standing and slight evasions and counter is silly when you realize tha the person with the knife is free to do the same and has the advantage. In contrast in a grappling situation you can limit his movements Now if you are both armed then the situations changes but I don't think a knife vs knife fight is as likely as a knife vs hand with skin on it fight.
    ______
    Xiao Ao Jiang Hu Zhi Dong Fang Bu Bai (Laughing Proud Warrior Invincible Asia) Dark Emperor of Baji!!!

    RIP SOLDIER

    Didn't anyone ever tell him a fat man could never be a ninja
    -Gene, GODHAND

    You can't practice Judo just to win a Judo Match! You practice so that no matter what happens, you can win using Judo!
    The key to fighting two men at once is to be much tougher than both of them.
    -Daniel Tosh
  8. Gezere is offline
    Gezere's Avatar

    My guns bigger than Scrapper's!

    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Rhineland Pfalz, Der Vaderland
    Posts
    10,587

    Posted On:
    1/15/2006 10:04pm

    supporting member
     Style: Kakutogi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    As an FYI we are talkig WORSE CASE SCENARIO here.
    ______
    Xiao Ao Jiang Hu Zhi Dong Fang Bu Bai (Laughing Proud Warrior Invincible Asia) Dark Emperor of Baji!!!

    RIP SOLDIER

    Didn't anyone ever tell him a fat man could never be a ninja
    -Gene, GODHAND

    You can't practice Judo just to win a Judo Match! You practice so that no matter what happens, you can win using Judo!
    The key to fighting two men at once is to be much tougher than both of them.
    -Daniel Tosh
  9. Plasma is offline
    Plasma's Avatar

    Bullshido Admin

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    7,074

    Posted On:
    1/15/2006 10:04pm

    supporting memberforum leaderstaff
     Style: 柔術

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by ex_jungyae
    Wait let me get this straight....

    You were fighting with knives and got cut when you got into grappling range... so you quit taking BJJ?

    So what are you going to do when you get cut while stand up fighting... take up dance?

    You will get cut no matter where you are, standing / ground, deal with it.

    If I was having trouble handling someone in a grappling situation I would want to train that situation more... not remove it from my training.
    No what I was describing happened yesterday during some outdoor training. I was just showing where my thinking is coming from.

    I quit BJJ about 2 years ago (I started in Ninpo went to BJJ and came back to Ninpo) because I felt it was too focused on one aspect and lacked in others. One of the major aspects I felt it lacked in was weapons and dealing with weapons. This was a personal view and my personal decision.
  10. Gezere is offline
    Gezere's Avatar

    My guns bigger than Scrapper's!

    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Rhineland Pfalz, Der Vaderland
    Posts
    10,587

    Posted On:
    1/15/2006 10:10pm

    supporting member
     Style: Kakutogi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by KageKaze
    No what I was describing happened yesterday during some outdoor training. I was just showing where my thinking is coming from.

    I quit BJJ about 2 years ago (I started in Ninpo went to BJJ and came back to Ninpo) because I felt it was too focused on one aspect and lacked in others. One of the major aspects I felt it lacked in was weapons and dealing with weapons. This was a personal view and my personal decision.
    You turned to Ninpo Taijutsu for dealing with weapons? Sorry man but you screwed the pooch on that on. I remeber the weapons work we did and it wasn't very sound. great when you had one and they didn't but the other ways around it was well..... :gay:
    ______
    Xiao Ao Jiang Hu Zhi Dong Fang Bu Bai (Laughing Proud Warrior Invincible Asia) Dark Emperor of Baji!!!

    RIP SOLDIER

    Didn't anyone ever tell him a fat man could never be a ninja
    -Gene, GODHAND

    You can't practice Judo just to win a Judo Match! You practice so that no matter what happens, you can win using Judo!
    The key to fighting two men at once is to be much tougher than both of them.
    -Daniel Tosh
Page 2 of 5 FirstFirst 12 345 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Powered by vBulletin™© contact@vbulletin.com vBulletin Solutions, Inc. 2011 All rights reserved.