223962 Bullies, 4139 online  
  • Register
Our Sponsors:

Results 1 to 10 of 40
Page 1 of 4 1 234 LastLast
Sponsored Links Spacer Image
  1. PirateJon is offline
    PirateJon's Avatar

    and good morning to you too

    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    DC
    Posts
    3,240

    Posted On:
    1/11/2006 4:31pm

    supporting member
     Style: MT/BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    TMA strikes vs boxing/MT strikes

    I've been pondering how to bring this up since the style vs style kick thing came up and now again with dreadnought's comments that I agreed with... I want to ask those that do TMA a question.

    I've only considered punching (since I can't judge kicks) but kicks are a part of this striking debate too. In my mind an opening is an opening. So if you have an opening to hit someone with a knife hand, a palm strike, or some kung-fu hand strike - then you have the opening to hit them with a "stronger" blow such as a hook or straight.

    My first thought when I see something is - what am I missing. So TMA peeps - I ask. What don't I get?
    Why should someone learn those types of strikes?
    Do you feel that strikes other than those found in boxing/MT have something that they lack?
    If you have a TMA punch that's "kind of like a hook" or something, what is the benifit to practicing it instead of a normal hook?
    You can't make people smarter. You can expose them to information, but your responsibility stops there.
  2. ojgsxr6 is offline

    Dorkus Malorkus

    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Queens, NY
    Posts
    3,008

    Posted On:
    1/11/2006 4:51pm

    supporting member
     Style: Boxing/BJJudo/Crossfit

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    As a beginner who does both boxing and karate, I can see the advantage in learning different strikes, because punching to the head barefisted can be dangerous to someones hand, even to a condtioned hand. So I think hammerfists, knifehhand, and palm strikes can become usefull then. I also see the benefit of Enshin/Kyokushin stye training where hand strikes are only allowed to the body for the most part, because in a defense situation your natural reaction might be to only strike to the body, which could save the defender a nasty hand injury.
  3. DerAuslander is offline
    DerAuslander's Avatar

    Valiant Monk of Booze & War

    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Baltimore, MD
    Posts
    18,451

    Posted On:
    1/11/2006 5:01pm

    supporting memberstaff
     Style: BJJ/C-JKD/KAAALIII!!!!!!!

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Clarify what you mean by strikes.

    Does this include things like reverse punch, etc., or were you think mainly of the more exotic things like palm strikes and knife hands.
  4. Torakaka is offline
    Torakaka's Avatar

    Do you eat breakfast?

    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Kaka village
    Posts
    10,658

    Posted On:
    1/11/2006 5:03pm

    supporting member
     Style: Kitty Pow Pow!!!

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I think he was also saying punching the way a boxer does vs the way a... say... kung fu person does (if there really is supposed to be a difference)
    Ranked #9 internationally at 118lbs by WIKBA http://www.womenkickboxing.com/wikba...rch%202009.htm
  5. MaverickZ is offline

    Heavyweight

    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Posts
    6,928

    Posted On:
    1/11/2006 5:06pm

    supporting member
     Style: white boy jiujitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    ridgehands make great clotheslines. but you'll have to ask El Guapo why he uses palm strikes.
  6. Lights Out is offline

    Senior Member

    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    3,173

    Posted On:
    1/11/2006 5:15pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: None

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    When I was in karate, many years ago (man, Im old!), we were taught that strikes as knife hands were meant to be targeted to soft parts, i.e. the neck, or the armpit (altrought I dont know how often in a fight somebody exposes his armpit).
  7. hl1978 is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    VA
    Posts
    860

    Posted On:
    1/11/2006 5:17pm


     Style: Aunkai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by PirateJon
    I've been pondering how to bring this up since the style vs style kick thing came up and now again with dreadnought's comments that I agreed with... I want to ask those that do TMA a question.

    I've only considered punching (since I can't judge kicks) but kicks are a part of this striking debate too. In my mind an opening is an opening. So if you have an opening to hit someone with a knife hand, a palm strike, or some kung-fu hand strike - then you have the opening to hit them with a "stronger" blow such as a hook or straight.

    My first thought when I see something is - what am I missing. So TMA peeps - I ask. What don't I get?
    Why should someone learn those types of strikes?
    Do you feel that strikes other than those found in boxing/MT have something that they lack?
    If you have a TMA punch that's "kind of like a hook" or something, what is the benifit to practicing it instead of a normal hook?
    in my own experience the advantage is that since your hand is open, it is easier to grab after throwing the technique.

    also you use them to strike different parts of the body than a closed fist.
  8. Jaguar Wong is offline
    Jaguar Wong's Avatar

    Safe For Work

    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Las Vegas, NV
    Posts
    1,456

    Posted On:
    1/11/2006 6:39pm

    supporting member
     Style: Shaolin Kung Fu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I'm guessing this thread is sort of an offshoot of the ridge hand thread...

    That being the case, my personal response to your question of "what don't I get? Why should someone learn these strikes?" I say...you're not missing anything, and honestly I don't feel that anyone needs to learn these strikes to be a powerful dangerous striker. It's just that I already learned them before paring down the number of strikes I use, based on things like how well I can use them, and how well they actually work.

    Given the chance to start all over with my training, I can't really say if I'd go the same route, but the strikes I use (that are not also found in styles like Boxing) aren't so completely useless that I threw them away after learning them. I mean I'm not going to use crane beak finger tip strikes, or back of the wrist strikes, but some of the others I've been able to use (palm strikes, knife hands, and ridge hands). No need to neglect them if I already spent the time developing them (or "wasted" the time as I'm sure some of you here feel).

    I think the jab, cross, hook, uppercut, overhand and elbow strikes are pretty much all you need, but I didn't realize that until well after learning all the other stuff, and praticing to use much of it while sparring. I'm sure my hooks and jabs would probably be much better if I practiced them instead of practicing knife hand strikes, but I don't really feel as if learning the other strikes really hurt my actual striking game. It was a case of discarding the useless stuff, but having a lot of techniques to chose from. Not the best approach by any means, but not a complete waste of time, since I do have a few tricks in my bag that have worked well against many sparring partners. That's just my personal feelings on the subject, though.
    Jaguar's MMA record
    pre Kung Fu and BJJ: 0-0-0
    post Kung Fu and BJJ: 0-0-0 (BOO YAA!!)

    We're number one! All others are number two or lower.
    - The Sphinx (Mystery Men)
  9. saku39 is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Tokyo/Atlanta
    Posts
    232

    Posted On:
    1/11/2006 7:56pm


     Style: taido

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    open handed strikes are great on the ground. gives you more distance to get your hands up to speed, and allows you to hit at a better point in the motion. Also, saves your hands from being destroyed on someones skull. Also, palm strikes are good from the clinch for many of the same reasons.
  10. Omar is offline

    Baji demigod.

    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    Xi'an, P.R.C.
    Posts
    4,249

    Posted On:
    1/11/2006 8:10pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Chinese Kung Fu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by PirateJon

    I've only considered punching (since I can't judge kicks) but kicks are a part of this striking debate too. In my mind an opening is an opening. So if you have an opening to hit someone with a knife hand, a palm strike, or some kung-fu hand strike - then you have the opening to hit them with a "stronger" blow such as a hook or straight.
    This only true if you put gloves on. With bare hands things change substantially. I haven't been following the ridge hand thing but I'll try to give a few examples to make my point.

    - rising strike with the wrist under the chin.

    That's a pointless strike as you could possibly imagine but thouroughly effective with no gloves on.

    - inward forearm the the side of the head.

    Almost the same as a tight hook from clinch range but it reads differently and depending on how close or your relative positions it can often be a stronger strike. It is certainly at least a strong as a hook but with no gloves it presents no danger whatsoever of hurting your hand on his skull. Sometimes your arm has already been extended to far to get off a decent hook so you just don't have the same opening.

    - Tiger claw to the trachea.

    From a standing clinch you can sneak your hand up a guys chest and grab his trachea. You can also often snake the arm over the crook of his elbow from the oustide, pinning it across his chest briefly as you grab the trachea. This doesn't require any speed and is more of a sneaky move. It doesn't feel dangerous to the other guy untill you have his throat. This is not a strike at all but a grab. You don't grab the throat, you grab the adams apple. Dig your fingers in behind and give your partner a gentle squeeze so he knows you got him.

    Again, totally worthless with gloves on. Even with MMA gloves it is signifigantly more dificult because although you can still do the grab, the gloves make your hand enough bigger that you can't really sneak in under their chin if it's at all tucked in. With bare hands they need to tuck in like defending a RNC.

    Then there's "kung fu hands" that could be replaced with a regular punch but if you are bare handed, the special shape lets you do more damage with less effort or in spots where you otherwise might not be in a position to generate enough power for a decent punch. This would be things like:

    - Index finger middle knuckle punch at an upwards angle under the cheekbone,
    - Index finger middle knuckle punch inwards towards someone's heart through the top couple ribs that are inside your armpit.
    - Same punch again but to the solar plexus.

    These are all valid targets with a regular punch but you can do much more damage with the "phoenix eye fist" (Index finger middle knuckle). The rest of the mechanis can stay the same.

    - How about the middle of somone's chest? A pretty useless target with a regular punch in that case but a palm strike can take someone out that way.

    - The forehead? Punch or Palm? You know the answer. But again...with gloves on it really doesn't matter now does it.

    - index and middle fingers held together to stab upwards into someone's armpit. I'd like to see you hit someone there effectivel with a regular punch.

    The list goes on. Most of those "wierd" fists are not like exchangeable screwdriver head where the rest of the tool is the same and you just change the tip. They are typically built in to complete techniques including the set up and the target intended, what angle you get the target from etc.
    Fighting evil and upholding justice in blue silk pajamas baby!
    http://youtube.com/watch?v=UGaYD_wcaIg

    http://youtube.com/watch?v=6Uepo9ahg-M

    Bah!!! Puny Humans.


Page 1 of 4 1 234 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Powered by vBulletin™© contact@vbulletin.com vBulletin Solutions, Inc. 2011 All rights reserved.