223799 Bullies, 3731 online  
  • Register
Our Sponsors:

Results 211 to 220 of 375
Page 22 of 38 FirstFirst ... 121819202122 2324252632 ... LastLast
Sponsored Links Spacer Image
  1. JFS USA is offline

    Converter of Virgins

    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Baltimore, Maryland Area
    Posts
    3,837

    Posted On:
    1/16/2006 11:36am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: H'ung Ga & SPM

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Omar
    Although I can visualize what you mean with "tosses out a corpse" I have never really been able to make that work. . . .not yet anyways.
    Try a Finger Fan to get his head moving back or to the side ... then drive your lower bridge between his legs ... don't try to secure a handhold ... you want your lower bridge to penetrate deep ... so the final point of contact is very high up on your arm ... shoulder should make contact with the frontal surface of his body. Drive your upper bridge into his stomach - chest area and secure a grip post impact. Now, rotate your body and launch the mutherfuker ... great fun.

    The other suggestion is ironic because I posted a pic on the previous page which could be just a half second later in the same motion. Tai Otoshi. I think I was trying to hard to map it onto stuff I have been working on more recently and there's no real analog for Tai-Otoshi in the Taiji form I am familiar with although, ironically, there's something pretty close in Baji. I think when I see these freeze frames my mind is a bit prejudiced towards seeing the end position and I can maybe be a bit blind to some of the transitional states. I've got decent "bookmarks" in the middle but am still missing a lot of the pages that go between them.
    The ability to visualize "potential" uses is a combination of Nature & Nurture. In many ways it is a skill.

    I use the 6 Gates Model and start off by placing him directly in front of me. Then I rotate him 45 degrees to put him either left or right. Next step is take the visually determined potentials and run them with a partner. I always go from compliant to fully resisting ... then attempt "it" when hard contact sparring ... this is all done in the same session so I get a steep learning curve.

    I start out compliant in order to identify any sticking points ... points where really blasting it might find him in a severely compromised position bio-mechanically, e.g., something might break or be torn on him. The idea is to learn ... not maim.
  2. Fighting Cephalopod is offline
    Fighting Cephalopod's Avatar

    Submitting 1d6 Investigators per round

    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    new jersey
    Posts
    2,981

    Posted On:
    1/16/2006 12:27pm

    supporting member
     Style: ZHOO ZHITSU

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Royal Dragon
    Watch any MMA fight, and good grapelers get owned all day long. It's not the do all be all of fighting to say the least.
    Good grapplers get owned by /other fighters that are also good grapplers/.

    I defy you to find a single example of an MMA fight where a grappler gets owned by someone who is not a good grappler.

    Hint - Chuck liddel is a purple belt in BJJ who was captain of his wrestling team, CroCop has taken years of private lessons with an ADCC-level black belt. Both of these constitute "being a good grappler".
  3. Beatdown Richie is offline
    Beatdown Richie's Avatar

    game dog

    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Munich, Germany
    Posts
    1,886

    Posted On:
    1/16/2006 12:32pm

    supporting member
     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by JFS USA
    Several possibilities ... if he's inside he's pullled down & across ... I drive my rear knee into the back of his supporting leg. If he's outside he's pulled down, across & over.

    Lots of possible solid uses for that particular shape ... might even view it as an analog of Tosses Out The Corpse ... all a matter of context in concert with skill level.
    I can't actually tell from your description what move you meant, but "down, across and over" is pretty close. I was thinking along these lines:
    Attached Images  
    There are no wrong threats, only wrong answers. (Strategy game truism)
  4. dakotajudo is offline
    dakotajudo's Avatar

    Judo Instructor

    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    South Dakota
    Posts
    633

    Posted On:
    1/16/2006 12:40pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Omar
    e previous page which could be just a half second later in the same motion. Tai Otoshi. I think I was trying to hard to map it onto stuff I have been working on more recently and there's no real analog for Tai-Otoshi in the Taiji form I am familiar with although, ironically, there's something pretty close in Baji.
    I've found the movement "Brush Knee and Twist Step", as I originally learned it, to be a fairly useful model for tai-otoshi (or koshi-guruma, or makikomi, or seoi-otoshi).

    The stance I prefer is kinda 60-40, the pulling hand in tai-otoshi leads outward, kinda like the brush hand, tsuri-te is pushing forward like the pushing hand.

    If you continue the rotation from BKTS, you end up with Beatdown Richie's stance. I try to avoid that for a standing throw, since it's a little unstable, but will go through that stance for a makikomi or koshiguruma when I want to be on ground.

    The type of movement I'm talking about, I've variations of both BKTS and tai-otoshi that are different in key points For example, I was shown a version, from a Chen guy, that is not an analog for tai-otoshi - the brush hand moves in a different plane. And the movement is not really a pure tai-otoshi, the drop part is lacking.

    But I like this movement for now. I've read a research article, that suggest to me that training specifically for this movement, ballistic training, crosses over well with round kick and reverse punches - since we're gearing up for MMA competitions, this appeals to me.
  5. dakotajudo is offline
    dakotajudo's Avatar

    Judo Instructor

    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    South Dakota
    Posts
    633

    Posted On:
    1/16/2006 1:18pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Beatdown Richie
    Your last guess on 3 is correct: I'm on my opponent's side, reach around his hips and drag him backward over my leg. Tani-otoshi, or throw by sitting.
    That's what was confusing me - I think of tani-otoshi as driving into a side fall, not sitting. Sitting gets you sat on.

    You're original concept is correct, though. Most judo training is dynamic, with a partner, so there isn't much opportunity to see judo stances. There are a few in Ishikawa and Draeger - the ashiharai drill looks pretty dorky if you don't know the intent.

    Ju-no-kata has some pretty odd spots as well.

    EDIT: Oops, though I was in the "Stances of Disaster" thread for some reason.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

Name:	ju2.jpg 
Views:	6 
Size:	193.4 KB 
ID:	5000  

    Attached Images      
    Last edited by dakotajudo; 1/16/2006 1:30pm at .
  6. JFS USA is offline

    Converter of Virgins

    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Baltimore, Maryland Area
    Posts
    3,837

    Posted On:
    1/16/2006 2:56pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: H'ung Ga & SPM

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by fatherdog
    Good grapplers get owned by /other fighters that are also good grapplers/.

    I defy you to find a single example of an MMA fight where a grappler gets owned by someone who is not a good grappler.

    Hint - Chuck liddel is a purple belt in BJJ who was captain of his wrestling team, CroCop has taken years of private lessons with an ADCC-level black belt. Both of these constitute "being a good grappler".
    Pretty much agreed ... although I really wish you "youngins" would get outside the formal comp box. It's a small box and you are only allowed to live there for a very short time.

    There was a time ... many years ago when I valued formal comps excessively. Then I got the living **** beat out me ... couple broken ribs, a back tooth shattered, knots tied into my face so I looked like a walking connect the dots puzzle.

    The guy that did the number on me weighed all of about 150 pounds ... around 38 years old at the time, balding, pot belly, tiny hands, insurance salesman and Si-hing (Older Brother w/in a Pai). He had been in formal TCMA training since the age of 4.

    Paul took me up on my assertion that since I had kicked much ass in the comp arena, beating up Men while still a young teenager, was in much better shape than him, could hit harder than him, was a Hell of a lot bigger & stronger than him, and therefore, I could handle him.

    Paul beat the crap out of me and as I stood leaning up against a wall gasping for air doing the "fish out of water" thing he said all of 3 words to me, turned and walked away. He never spoke to me again after that day. The 3 words he said were this: "Now you know."

    It's an entirely different level and a whole different Mindset when it comes to real World vs. formal comp. I still value formal comps to this day. It takes a lot of guts to get out before a group of people you don't really know and put yourself on the line with another guy who has probably trained & practiced just as hard as you.

    Much like practicing/training for the modern day battle field and having real rounds crack next to your head in a real World fire fight ... of some value ... just entirely different.

    I understand quite well the differences and when the arena is elevated to real World ... the consequences for not knowing might well prove fatal.

    Contrary to the popular belief put forth by the Rough Sport for Tough Peeps crowd ... the burden in on the comp group to step up to our World ... real World ... we are under no obligation to step down into their World where "The Gifts of Youth" hold sway. Just a passing phase and long after the fans have left ... life goes on.

    Just my understanding of it and your mileage may vary.
    Last edited by JFS USA; 1/16/2006 2:58pm at .
  7. Dusty Larson is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    South Dakota
    Posts
    111

    Posted On:
    1/16/2006 3:49pm


     Style: None

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    You mentioned Paul before on tung fu a while back JFS.

    What was that fight like? Did you hit him much?
  8. Roidie McDouchebag is offline
    Roidie McDouchebag's Avatar

    Injury Waiting To Happen

    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Kamloops, BC
    Posts
    9,419

    Posted On:
    1/16/2006 4:11pm

    supporting member
     Style: Snatch Wrestling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I've done them in live sparring against resisting opponents and took THEM off base, the guys you saw must have been noobs or something. Timing is everything.
    I refer back to my "they have **** for base" comment.

    Like I keep saying you don't "Try" to use the stance, you see an oppertunity for a throw, and you throw them. the stance just happenes in the split second while you are doing so. You have to be good enough to just fight.
    Ok, fine, I'm telling you, you do that to me, or (God FORBID) a better grappler than me, and you GET FLATTENED, PERIOD.

    If you are going into a fight with the intention of "Trying" to use cool stances, your gonna get owned. You can't be thinking about your stance. It's got to just be there from haveing been ingrained in your muscle memory.
    Yep, but if you use it against a competent grappler, you're finished.

    Watch any MMA fight, and good grapelers get owned all day long. It's not the do all be all of fighting to say the least.
    Yep, by guys who are good enough grapplers to avoid being grappled, **** stances represent shitty grappling, too shitty to win a fight against a grappler.

    Damn Dude, can't you write if off your taxes? Sit down and discuss business with Phrost or something to make it a legit write off.
    Yes, if I paid taxes, I'm sure I could right it off.

    Ah ... Living Better By Way Of Modern Chemistry ... way cool.
    Ain't it?

    Dude, I had "good base" before you were even sperm swimming upstream in search of an egg. Who the **** do you think you are addressing here ... one of your dipshit buddies?
    I don't really consider you a "buddy" at this point, but I'll give you the "dipshit" part, hehe. Anyway, I talk the same way to anybody, if they take an obnoxious tack with me, I'll take one too. But I'm not going to grovel at your feet just because you have more experience than me. Just like I will not trust a scientist if they tell me gravity doesn't exist, their expertise cannot over-rule the laws of physics. If you deny reality, as I've come to understand it, I'm going to call you on it.

    No, there is no "BAM" and the fight is over for me. I'm comfortable where ever I am and secure enough on the ground to be able to regain my feet
    I wasn't talking to YOU when I said that, but that's good for you, if you have good base, and KEEP good base, then you won't put yourself in those positions. If you want to try and throw somebody or whatever, there are better, more balanced positions to do it from. However, if you get put down, on your back, in side mount, under a better grappler than you (sorry, but I still believe there are better grapplers than you in existence) then you will NOT get to stand back up, and you WILL get pummelled, or broken.

    I admire your youthful aggression but deplore your lack of depth in reasoning. Do try to understand this thing a bit and quit trying to lecture me ... it's not really the right way to address your Daddy ... Son.
    You haven't seen my reasoning in action. Nowhere on this thread have I been reasonable when talking to you. Here is my reasoning concerning this:

    I have specifically seen and experienced those techniques NOT WORKING.

    I have NEVER seen them work on anyone, except people who suck balls at grappling.

    I have never seen my old instructor, who knows them intimately, use them, even though, if anyone could make them work, it would be him. He uses SOME stuff that most MMA type guys don't, but that isn't part of it.

    I've never seen my current instructor use them, and he LIKES using Kung Fu techniques, just not techniques that put him off base.

    You should understand that the stills are merely a slice of movement frozen in time. I can selectively pick a still shot out of a detailed series of anyone doing their thing and they will appear caught up in useless movement and/or spastic.
    I understand that, but when all you want to do is call me a homo and say I know nothing, I'm not going to say that I understand and respond reasonably, I'm going to call you a homo and say you know nothing. Furthermore, if you want to make ridiculous unsubstantiated claims about the efficacy of postures that NECESSITATE AN UNACCEPTABLE (to me) LOSS OF BASE, I'm not going to respond logically or reasonably, I'm going to emote my revulsion at the goofy circle-jerk you guys were having. I mean, sorry, but that's how I feel, even if I understand logically the transitional nature of those positions, that being the case, I still think they are not effective enough, and I don't like'em.

    All in all ... you are a young Dude, full of vigor and Hell bent on making your mark in this World. I wish you well ... and "Yes" ... it was a bit of fun to wind you up and wind you up I did ... despite your cover story. I've read some of your other stuff on different threads and you play Devil's Advocate fairly decent.
    You did wind me up, but while that means rationality goes out the window, it doesn't mean I'm wrong.

    He's a MOD ... he has a resonsibility to "know" better and absent "knowing" he has a duty to inquire and learn.
    Yeah, that's fine, but I've done enough research to be satisfied, and I still think I'm right. I think the evidence available backs me up. When have you seen somebody use that poo in pro MMA? In addition, if you're such a fantastic example of warriorhood, why haven't YOU been? Oh yeah, you see where it says "Co-Founder" that means what it says. Goof-Fu as exemplified on this thread was one of the main inspirations for the creation of the site.

    Most rings I've been in have had pretty stiff mats. Hurt to get body slammed and certainly not a real good crash pad for head first landings.
    Agreed, but I say you're more likely to be on the recieving end of the body slam if you use silly stances.

    So you would resort like the rest of the total asswiping pussies of using drugs and performance enhancers rather than man up and see if your material works.

    Your an asshole, dude. Typical repsponse from some dweeb who has no idea about real combat nor reality.

    Just take some drugs(both of which are illegal) and that will make you the better person? Not, makes you the total turd for even mentioning crap like that.
    Damn, I was trolling for JFS and I hooked into something decidedly less clever.

    The fact is (even if I Choke You) wants to deny that) that hilarious poses are necessary elements of honest-to-goodness, working techniques.
    Yes some legit techniques look silly, but giving up your base is wrong, always, and a good technique won't require it, like those goofy KF stances do. Hilarious is one thing, off base is another.

    I mean, who would ever want to fight like THIS: ????
    NO ONE! NOR SHOULD THEY, I SAID the butt scoot disqualified BJJ guys from complaining about shitty stances.

    Only extremely seasoned and successful fighters, like me, have the luxury of just wading in and dealing with it. Been there ... done that ... no matter where you "are" I've all ready been there and gone
    Ok, so then, should I listen to you, or to all of my instructors, who, like you, are successful fighters with decades of experience in a broad array of MA? Should I listen to you, or consider the evidence presented in EVERY MMA match I have EVER seen? Who would you believe, given the evidence presented, and that all the knowledgeable people I know, all the successful fighters I know, all the guys I've watched dismantle people who use CMA, say they don't work, OR you?

    I disagree ... my claims are best settled in the street ... a place designated for resolving such matters since the time of recorded history.
    I hope you're trolling, because otherwise, I'd show up with weapons and armour, I mean, that sounds silly, but so does you saying you prefer to test yourself in a gun-friendly environment...

    As a quick side note you need to drop the "C*&^" word out of it in the future. Using the "c" word can get you banned on here ... seriously ... I was formally warned just one more time and I was gone. Some of the MODs simply don't want the word used so drop that ... twat, *****, vagina, P-hole ... all good to go ... just the "c" word is out.
    That is some cuntfucking bullshit. I was gonna say motherfucking, but...

    **** (kŭnt)
    n. Vulgar Slang.

    1.The female genital organs.
    2.Sexual intercourse with a woman.

    3.
    a. Offensive. Used as a disparaging term for a woman.
    b. Used as a disparaging term for a person one dislikes or finds
    extremely disagreeable.

    **** is an English term that refers to the human female genitals. It is considered by many to be the most offensive word in the English language. In modern English, the word vagina is considered to be more polite, though strictly speaking this Latin word refers only to a specific part of the female genitalia, as does vulva. The earliest citation of the word in the Oxford English Dictionary is a reference to the London street name "Gropecunt Lane" dated to about 1230.

    http://www.answers.com/****&r=67

    He could show up chemically enhanced to the max and it wouldn't matter. I've busted up 'roid boy muscle heads and meth fueled maniacs ... lots of that **** in the 1980s ... nothing I haven't had before.
    I don't know. I wouldn't actually do that, but considering the one fight I had on disassociatives, I would say that you would have to convince me to stop, or one of us would die, it might be me, but I wouldn't feel any pain from anything you did, you could break my arm and I'd use it as a club. If my heart didn't explode, I would have a reasonable chance I think, you would want to choke somebody on that kind of drug, nothing much else would phase'em.

    No matter ... he's all ready built his "out" ... another "I'm not showing up for _______ reason(s)." No idea why "they" even bother ... I'm going to call them out every time and unlike them ... I'm dead on serious about beating the **** out of them.
    I responded to your trolling with trolling, and you figured that was a challenge, I'm not going across the continent to settle an internet arguement. If you lived in Seattle, I might come and meet you, we could spar, but there wouldn't be any need for us to actually fight, because you would almost certainly win.

    He's typical ... fails to understand that when a body structure of main importance is destroyed all the attitude in the World, chemical or otherwise, isn't going to make it function then & there. Just another wannabe of the "I've had fights before." ilk. Sure he has, all of the "One guy was scared and the other glad of it." variety.
    You'd probably beat the crap out of me, IF you didn't use any of those goofy stances, which you probably wouldn't, no matter what you say here. However, I have had fights with people who were not afraid, and I've won some and lost some, and though I don't have as much experience as you, I've figured out enough about fighting to know, those stances don't work against skilled opponents. Sheep, sure, but almost anything works against the sheep, I hold MA to a higher standard than that.

    Pretty much agreed ... although I really wish you "youngins" would get outside the formal comp box. It's a small box and you are only allowed to live there for a very short time.
    That's true, but it's the best modern easily verified example of hand to hand combat. There's so many fights you can watch involving so many styles of fighting. You can verifiably see what works and doesn't. Sure there are other parts of fighting, but so what? You can't watch'em hours of them on tape, you can only rarely even observe or participate in them, unless you want to go picking fights on the street. So you can spar...but MMA is really the pinnacle of that IMO. It is the height of intense, alive sparring.

    On the street, weapons apply, and if you wanted to test your skills on the street, I would say a fair test would be somebody sneaking up on you with a knife and a set of brass knuckles from behind, see how you do. Then guns come out and this whole discussion becomes fairly meaningless.

    There was a time ... many years ago when I valued formal comps excessively. Then I got the living **** beat out me ... couple broken ribs, a back tooth shattered, knots tied into my face so I looked like a walking connect the dots puzzle.
    I had a similar experience recently, except that after I got busted up I STILL FUCKING WON, so, I learned a different lesson, and yes, NOW I KNOW.

    It's an entirely different level and a whole different Mindset when it comes to real World vs. formal comp.
    I agree, and it is a shocking difference, but you can let the shock paralyze you, or keep going until you're KO'ed, and that's what I do, yes I will get hurt, mabye badly, mabye permanently, my one knuckle doesn't work properly and I can't make a proper fist anymore, and my head ached the next day, and the day after that, but I STILL WON.

    However, in any sort of avoidable situation, I'm just going to leave long before I have to fight. I have never once been touched, save the one Kung Fu ******, outside of formal competition and fucking around with my friends, since I started employing the "leave first" strategy. Paranoia keeps me safe.
    Last edited by Roidie McDouchebag; 1/16/2006 4:20pm at .
  9. Torakaka is offline
    Torakaka's Avatar

    Do you eat breakfast?

    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Kaka village
    Posts
    10,658

    Posted On:
    1/16/2006 4:15pm

    supporting member
     Style: Kitty Pow Pow!!!

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by JFS USA
    Pretty much agreed ... although I really wish you "youngins" would get outside the formal comp box. It's a small box and you are only allowed to live there for a very short time.
    well, it's the only real example of martial arts that can be easily pointed to and verified. You can say "Old Leroy Brown was the baddest man in China Town and he was a good grappler" but then everyone just has to take your word for it. If you point to Pride or UFC, it's all on DVD and all over sports news. Also, although there's obviously going to be a difference in mentality and there's going to be an added chaotic nature to the fight, are the effectiveness of techniques and systems really going to change much? An overhand right that KO's someone in the ring will just as likely KO someone outside the ring.
    Ranked #9 internationally at 118lbs by WIKBA http://www.womenkickboxing.com/wikba...rch%202009.htm
  10. Cracker is offline

    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    blah blah
    Posts
    148

    Posted On:
    1/16/2006 5:35pm


     Style: slappy

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Kidspatula
    An overhand right that KO's someone in the ring will just as likely KO someone outside the ring.
    In THEORY yes. Isn't theory the thing tha people like to call Bullshido on?
    I recall fondly a thing I witnessed many years ago (late 1980's) outside a local club that hosted kickboxing matches at the time: Two fighters outside the club after the event...were fighting on the sidewalk behind the place. They were flailing and chasing eachother around like catfighting girls. They crashed into a parked car. They slammed into a concrete wall. They litteraly chased eachother up and down the sidewalk. At one point, one of them attempted to obtain a car antenna for some pimp stick action... Both fighters, though highly conditioned, were panting like dogs after a short exchange.
    It was quite obvious that there were no refined moves, no overhand rights, no leg kicks, no kimura, nothing...it was total chaos. However, earlier in the evening both fighters had shown skill and poise in the ring, with rules, and literally in "thier game".
    So theoretically, yes...but in reality? Who knows.
    Last edited by Cracker; 1/16/2006 5:37pm at .

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

Powered by vBulletin™© contact@vbulletin.com vBulletin Solutions, Inc. 2011 All rights reserved.