Fun with "Kicks" (and that wacky round of mine)

**Omar** · Posted On: 1/03/2006 4:44pm

The way I trained it.

More specifically, the footwork. I have, for the most part, given up on pads except as a nice little aerobic work out to try and keep the waistline in. The only places you are likely to see anything different is in the 3 kicks I actually land. All the kicks are basically the same but I applied used a different part of the "step" on those 3. (technically, 2 kicks and one knee.)

Check the thread:

http://bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=30198

And rather than wading through the thread for the link that comes later of my actual kick, here it is:

http://media.putfile.com/round-kick-2

The reason those 3 "kicks" landed is directly related to the "unorthodox" training method. The other thread got a bit obscure so I started this one which should be less CMA-specific. I also am kind of avoiding the other one untill I hopefully can make a decent sparring clip to give a feel for how I actually do walk around in that context.

I've seen enough "How do Muay Thai roundhouse kick" threads to make me sick. All that text and no clips. I also think my couple of threads should highlight part of why "...uh...that's not "kung fu" that's just kickboxing...." happens. This is almost pure CMA here I'm sharing. I train that kick mostly by just working the footwork shown at the beggining of the other thread. That's about it. Then if I need to throw some high rounds I improvise. The high kick counter at the beggining of the second clip on this thread was something I picked up in my Hung Gar days. Pretty typical for my using Hung Gar sparring anyone who likes to kick a lot. The basic structure of the drill though, I must admit, is something I learned in a Muay Thai gym.

[edit: That was all in response to Mavericks post. The others came while I was writing]

**MaverickZ** · Posted On: 1/03/2006 4:47pm

for what it's worth, it looks like a viable kick. if you bring those hands in and rotate the hips faster. which i assume you weren't doing cause you were being nice to your training partner, *GOOD THING*.

though in my experience, i was never a fan of the step then kick philosophy. i prefer to use footwork to get in range and then kick in place. but that's just me.

**Omar** · Posted On: 1/03/2006 5:07pm

Monkey and Tai Denshi both mentioned the hands. lol

Just about 20 miniutes ago I edit the original post because I decided it would be better for discussion if I not aplogozed or made excuses for some of the obvious problems ahead of time. I had a whole little paragraph explaining how I was a lazy **** about the hands and that part of that was that I was telling my partner either what was coming next or what he should be throwing next as he hasn't really memorized the drill yet. Like many Jews, Italians, Greeks etc....I use my hands to talk. :)

BTW, it almost looked like you were doing an earmuff block in the second vid. Were you?

On about half of them. We were supposed to be throwing:

left mid (both take turns)
right mid (both take turns)
left high (both take turns)
right high (both take turns)

I only use that block if the kick is high enough and powerfull enough to need it. I agree with you on that part. I haven't got time right now but I have the footage to show me doing some much more "classic" blocks exactly like I think you are talking about. I'll post a short clip after work tonight.

While your stance starts out with your feet not so far apart, before you throw almost every kick you take a step forward with you standing/pivoting leg and for a momment you're spread out too much.

Yeah. I like to walk around a lot but I don't see it as a weakness. In a free sparring context I tend to cover a lot of ground. My real preference is not kicking. I like to either charge in past the kicks or to actually shoot in behind people so I tend to take a lot of big steps. Just got off debating that issue on another thread.

Glad to finnally see some discussion around here. I think it's better to throw out some clips which have some "problems" rather than try and only show your best stuff. Everyone should put up more clips. Not just sparring or kicking ass and trying to make yourself look good. Just something that can explain your ideas better than text. Most digital cameras have a video funtion and windows has a built in editing program so it's become incredibly easy to make short clips.

**Omar** · Posted On: 1/03/2006 5:14pm

Originally Posted by Satori

I'm envious of your relaxation, as I'm chronically tense and stiff. I also liked the first "stuffing" drill from the second video. I'd probably want to stuff it a little earlier, but that is purely dependent on how quickly you could see the incoming roundhouse.

Thanks for the compliment. The reason I "stuffed" it when I did was because I had something specific in mind to show my partner about structural integrety. I wouldn't even call it "stuffing". If you want to really stuff the kick then use ...I think Whiteshark always posts this..but just teep the bastard. (push kick on his thigh) What I did was took the kick on the arm(s) and then gave him a shove through his leg all the way back to his base so he was pushed off balance. That's why he was falling overhimself when I charged in. I had unbalanced him with the block. A "hard" block no less.

Also, I'm not sure if I'm a moron...but it seems like you just barely bend the leg before delivery, as opposed to the more severe chambering that I'm used to.

That's exactly the kind of observations that are fun to make. That's also one of the things that most people tend to think about as a main difference between a Muay Thai round and say a TKD round or a Karate round. But for me, this is just an exaggerated bagua hooking step.

I'd like to read your description, and I'd like to see some of the "Fruitier" CMA clips that you've done.

Probably not in this forum. I'll post my "pajama dance" later for eveyone's amusement. It's not relative to this topic though.

**Torakaka** · Posted On: 1/03/2006 5:27pm

Originally Posted by Omar

You know, just as when you first came on this site some of us thought you were just another anti-CMA Muay Thai nuthugger, you are in danger of making a similar jump to conclusions in the other direction.

Not sure what you're getting at. I try to look at your stuff with some objectivity, but of course I can only look at it from the perspective of what I've been taught.

Originally Posted by Omar

I'm just trying to get some discussion going here and I have been purposely putting up clips of stuff I figure that the non-CMA people can pick apart and talk about. I'm actually going out of my way to select "kickboxing" type work that I have done and stay aways from the "fruitier" CMA stuff that I actually spend much more of my time on.

ok

**Omar** · Posted On: 1/03/2006 5:34pm

Not sure what you're getting at. I try to look at your stuff with some objectivity, but of course I can only look at it from the perspective of what I've been taught.

That's all any of us can do. I wouldn't expect anything different.

I've been trying to eliminate the phrase "from a [style name here] perspective..." from my online speech lately unless specifically asked.

**Lights Out** · Posted On: 1/03/2006 5:58pm

Omar, you shouldn´t be so defensive, seriously.

**Omar** · Posted On: 1/03/2006 6:42pm

Was I being defensive? Sorry?

Kidspatula kind of bailed on an earier discussion recently after someone, I think it was DeepBlueHalo pulled the "well maybe for kickboxing but for bagua...." card. I am also kind of tired of KFDW's endless rants about how superior his training is and how anyone who doesn't understand is just an ignorant fucktard who doesn't deserve and explanation. I also have seen JFS, as much as I like him, do a similar thing where he kind of shouts down people for their lack of experience and disqualifies them from disagreeing with him. I know he has a method to his madness but it is not my method.

I am just trying to bend over backwards to actually start some technical discussions around here which can be interesting and accesable regardless of wether your perspective is TKD, Kyokshin, Muay Thai or one of those sissy internal arts. So I encourage everyone to put up their own clips. Bag work, pad drills, sparring or just sparring type drills. Just for the record, nothing I have posted so far really qualifies as a training clip for me anyways. They are more like visual aids for my posts and starting points for threads.

What I think people should do more of is put up their own clips of how they think any of what I have shown should be done differently or how they work on the same ideas. That would be really cool.
So I am trying to actively avoid alienating either one side or the other.

**Shooter** · Posted On: 1/03/2006 6:57pm

Omar, good job trying to initiate some potentially awesome discussions.

I've often been tempted to post some clips here for the same purpose that you're posting yours, but I don't think people would be able to stop laughing long enough for anything of value to be gained by it.

Keep up the good work. I'm getting a lot of enjoyment from seeing the different perspectives folks have when they comment on what you're showing. :eusa_doh:

**Lights Out** · Posted On: 1/03/2006 7:00pm

What I meant is that among the CMA people on this board (who, I admit, are not so respected most of the times) you are one of the most respected ones, or that´s the impression I have.

Also, I haven´t seen anybody bashing you or your style in the threads at hand.

I eagerly await a clip of free sparring, I still have a little trouble figuring how the kicks and the footwork you showed us come all together.