Thread: How to Argue Properly (Vol 1)
12/25/2005 3:12pm, #11
You know one thing that I have noticed about this site is the general lack of keeping within the relevant points that the poster had made. If the poster had made 15 good points and made one mistake in his thread. He would be flamed mercilessly by 15 idiots who will say 'Nah anh!That's not what my inztruktor saz!!**** u!'
Most people here don't want to listen to you but would rather piss and moan for 15 pages until that good poster shoot himself in the head.[img=http://img205.imageshack.us/img205/2364/8026700123940loij9.th.jpg]
"God damn America" --Muammar al-Gaddafi
12/25/2005 3:15pm, #12Originally Posted by MEGA JESUS-SAN
12/25/2005 3:41pm, #13
Satori, your examples of these flaws are actually pretty bad.
12/25/2005 3:51pm, #14
It was a spur of the moment thing...and I'd had a few drinks. I was using an old college textbook from a logic class I had, and I tried to insert what my point was...but alcohol does funny things to typed conversation.
If you (or anyone else with speech/debate/logic knowledge) has some wittier and more appropriate examples, post them and I'll edit them in with credit due. I posted this as more of a joke than anything else, but if serious debators want to create solid examples of fallacies, then I'm game.
Great article on internet arguing, Hapkido Keith.
12/25/2005 4:07pm, #15
12/25/2005 7:55pm, #16Originally Posted by Satori
Therefore, as a service the Bullshido community, I will provide an overview of common "Logical Fallacies" often used and abused by posters herein. May the light of reason banish said abusers once and for all!
-Appeal to Force (Argumentum ad Baculum): Direct or indirect threat hidden within a statement that attempts to coerce the listener to the speaker's way of thinking.
---"MMA is the best martial art in existence. If you disagree, then I'm sure Ken Shamrock will correct you. So obviously, my style is better."
-Appeal to Pity (Argumentum ad Misericordiam): Direct or indirect attempt to elicit feelings of compassion and pity from the listener in order to coerce the listener to the speaker's way of thinking.
---"My instructor says that every other martial art other than his is worthless and stupid, and he would come here and back that up...except he was in a tragic Port-a-Potty accident while feeding starving children in Antarctica. He no longer has the use of his hindquarters, so let us have a moment of silence for this philanthropist. Obviously, my instructor is better."
-Appeal to the People (Argumentum ad Populum): Direct or indirect attempt to make the speaker's opinion appear popular and exclusive.
---"I train in Muay Tae Kwon Jitsu. Before my instructor will even look at you, you must first defeat a hungry lion with your bare hands, then build a house with your elimination orifices while quoting Hamlet backwards with a Swahili accent. Obviously, my style is better."
-Argument Against the Person (Argumentum ad Hominem): Direct or indirect attempt to attack the speaker's credibility on unrelated issues, thereby diverting attention from the original point.
---"The respected Sensei Joe Millionaire has fought in a dozen death matches and proven his skill beyond a doubt. However, Sensei Joe Millionaire is also a member of the Purple Party, and the Purple Party is responsible for the depletion of the O-Zone. I also heard that Sensei Joe Millionaire caused the extinction of the dinosaurs, so obviously his style is worse."
-Straw Man: The creation of a fake "personae" that is easily attacked and criticized, upon which the feelings of negativity translate to the person the speaker intends.
---"Brazilian Shoto Kung Chi is a style that incorporates aspects of many different arts, and was developed by several elderly martial artists over several decades. However, we know that old people smell and can't drive well, and that they make gross sounds when they chew. These characteristics are identical to the Nazis, who nearly exterminated an innocent religious group. Obviously, that style is worse."
-Missing the Point: A fallacy in which the original point is misinterpreted to form a completely unrelated conclusion.
---"Thousands died in Rowanda yesterday. Therefore, all Mixed Martial Artists suck. Obviously, they are worse."
-Red Herring: A deliberate attempt to negate argument against the speaker by leading the argument onto a different but relatively related path.
---"Sure, many traditional martial artists were destroyed within the ruleset of the UFC. However...have you noticed that all the judges for the UFC had black hair? People with black hair are proven to be favorable to non-traditional martial arts, and so it makes sense that they rigged the competition in favor of non-traditional MA. Obviously, my style is better."
Please forgive me.--
12/26/2005 2:27pm, #17
Wow...at first I thought you'd flame me with all sorts of capital letters and interspersed numbers...but you actually know your ****.
The textbook I was using referred to "Fallacies of Relevance", but made no distinction between rhetoric and logic. I only attended one class, but you've obviously had some experience in speech/debate/logic.
Good read. Even if the majority of bullshido posters don't give a Mexican Food **** (capitalized on purpose) about arguing properly, at least I learned a bit from your post.