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  1. Goju - Joe is offline
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    I am a Ninja bitches!! Deal with it

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    Posted On:
    12/15/2005 8:00pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Improv comedy

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Jjj Vs Bjj

    I am curious as to what people's thoughts are on Japanese Jiu-Jitsu versus BJJ.

    I am not an expert on BJJ so I don't have a strong opinion. What I think is that while BJJ concentrates and is dominant on the ground that as a self defense system JJJ deals more with strikes and weapons and might have the edge for self defense.

    Anyhow like I said I need to do some BJJ training before I can really have experience enought fro a strong opinion. I am just curious as to what other people think.

    Flame-On!
  2. Gumby is offline

    BJJ Purple Belt

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    Posted On:
    12/15/2005 8:03pm


     Style: Brazilian Jiu Jitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Lots of people believe that because JJJ incorporates more striking and throwing techniques (and weapons) that its a better self defense art than BJJ. The problem with this assumption is that in its current form, JJJ hasnt be able to prove very much any of its techniques in the ring and has no where near the success as BJJ does.

    If its training methods were revised, it would be a different story, but many JJJ guys I see are mezmorized by pressure points and dim maks.
  3. supercrap is offline
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    Founder/GrandSensei of Joint British / Papua New Guinean Non-contact Lawn Bowls Jiu Jitsu Committee

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    Posted On:
    12/15/2005 8:05pm


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Training methods
    are more important than
    technique.
    Imports from Japan, Shipping Worldwide! Art Junkie, Scramble, BJJ Spirits, Reversal...
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  4. Goju - Joe is offline
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    I am a Ninja bitches!! Deal with it

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    Posted On:
    12/15/2005 8:15pm

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     Style: Improv comedy

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Gumby
    Lots of people believe that because JJJ incorporates more striking and throwing techniques (and weapons) that its a better self defense art than BJJ. The problem with this assumption is that in its current form, JJJ hasnt be able to prove very much any of its techniques in the ring and has no where near the success as BJJ does.

    If its training methods were revised, it would be a different story, but many JJJ guys I see are mezmorized by pressure points and dim maks.
    I agree about preasure points. Buts as far as being proven in the ring. There are a few top performers who have a JJJ back ground who have done well. Carlos Newton comes to mine. And most of Japanese fighters in pride.

    Also I don't think the ring is the best place to prove "self defense" effectiveness a you're dealing with a controled situation, with rules and no weapons.
  5. Virus is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/15/2005 8:18pm

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     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    For what it's worth my shooto coach is a 2nd dan in Japanese Jujitsu.
  6. Zendetta is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/15/2005 8:23pm

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     Style: MMA, functional JKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by GoJu - Joe
    I am curious as to what people's thoughts are on Japanese Jiu-Jitsu versus BJJ.
    otherwise known as "Tokyo versus Godzilla"
    "You know what I like about you, William? You like guns AND meditation."
  7. Knightmare is offline

    DO NOT LISTEN TO ME

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    Posted On:
    12/15/2005 8:56pm


     Style: Kickboxing/Sub. Grappling

    1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Gumby
    Lots of people believe that because JJJ incorporates more striking and throwing techniques (and weapons) that its a better self defense art than BJJ. The problem with this assumption is that in its current form, JJJ hasnt be able to prove very much any of its techniques in the ring and has no where near the success as BJJ does.

    If its training methods were revised, it would be a different story, but many JJJ guys I see are mezmorized by pressure points and dim maks.
    That argument is null and void and the reason I say that is because you cannot possibly show JJJ is more effective when they teach biting, nut shots, and eye gouges. No sport or form of competition can fully show what JJJ TRULY is. It can only show the art with some of the techniques taken out, and thats unfair.
  8. roly is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/15/2005 10:39pm


     Style: judo, karate, jap jj

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    i currently do both jjj and bjj
    unarmed jjj is probably not trained with enough resistance to be as useful as judo/bjj. All of the fully resisting sparring that happens in judo and bjj makes the world of difference

    weapons makes everything change, and since jjj has how to use and defend against weapons i would say it is better for (teh real) self defence ***IF*** you crosstrain in a style like judo or bjj (similar principles but trains with resistance)
  9. supercrap is offline
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    Founder/GrandSensei of Joint British / Papua New Guinean Non-contact Lawn Bowls Jiu Jitsu Committee

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    Posted On:
    12/15/2005 11:11pm


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    In my experience, when the Japanese say 'ju jutsu' they are using it as a collective term for grappling.

    For example, caol uno and akira shoji have 'Wa jutsu' on their pants when they fight. (occasionally). This just means 'Eastern (as in Japan) Technique.'

    I don't think they are learning ju jutsu in the traditional sense - practicing eye gouges and nut shots with pot-bellied old geezers.

    The Japanese fighter's combine wrestling / prowrestling, brazilian jujutsu and judo and whatever else - with the training methodology of wrestling and bjj, ie lots of sparring.

    Just because they are japanese, I dont think you can say they practice JJJ as we see it in the west.
    Imports from Japan, Shipping Worldwide! Art Junkie, Scramble, BJJ Spirits, Reversal...
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  10. ItOnlyHurtsOnce is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/15/2005 11:21pm


     Style: JJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Since I study JJJ and have played with many BJJ here is my take on the matter.

    First of all there are many styles of JJJ, and each has there own flavor but it really comes down to the practitioner as it does in most artforms. Ju-jutsu and Jiu-jitsu and judo, they all came from the same place and have developed differently over time.

    The body only has so many joints in it and those joints can only be manipulated so many ways, the main difference is where and how you spend the bulk of your time training.

    JJJ spends the bulk of its time standing. Believe it or not you can choke someone out while standing, a guard or mount is not a necessity. Classical throws and breakfalls are taught. Weapon defense and counters are incorporated into training, yet in a decent class there is still plenty of rolling as well. JJJ was formed from battlefield combat, rolling around on the ground in the middle of a battle field with multiple attackers that want to kill you = a bad idea.

    BJJ spends the bulk of its time on the ground. It is best suited for 1 on 1 (perfect for tournaments) very bad for battlefield or possible street usage (large possibility of multiple attackers). Even some of the Gracies admit the guard sucks if your getting your head stomped in by your opponent's friend. Like all arts with every strength comes a weakness. It is not the techniques that differ that much but the philosophies of the arts themselves and what ranges they spend most of their time in.

    Is one supperior to the other, in my opinion, no. But some practioners are superior to others. Since BJJ is very popular right now and has tons of tournaments, more people are practicing it and putting more hours into training with it. However, with every sport there come rules and rules can become weaknesses. I had a prior student talk to me the other day, they are now taking BJJ from a local school, they got into trouble for prying off a RNC using a finger lock to remove it before the RNC was locked in. This is in violation of the rules. Did it work, yes, but isn't allowed. Limitations placed by the sport not the artform.

    Either JJJ or BJJ will work well for a grappling base, it is more important to make sure you also have a good striking artform to go with it than to split hairs about which grappling is better. A good instructor from either art will give you the basic knowledge to build your foundation upon, most everything else can be learned by sweat and bruises.
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