Posted On:12/14/2005 3:34pm
Generally when someone says X (usually a combat sport) isn't good for self defense, they're probably:
A) Don't know much about the art in question
B) Haven't ever been in a self defense situation
C) Selling something
Last edited by ojgsxr6; 12/14/2005 3:38pm at .
Posted On:12/14/2005 3:46pm
Did you ever hear the story about how Helio did a standing X choke to someone who was trying to hold him up with a gun. Yup, choked him out before he pulled the trigger.
I really did hear this.
Posted On:12/14/2005 3:52pm
Originally Posted by EnaeS
first i would like to say that i am a white belt with about 1 year of experience in BJJ so take as you will when considering what i say, i don't claim to be an expert but i see no real difference in controling someone with say a RNC choke (ask Omega) or cross choke(i'm gonna say that with the caveat that they have a heavy shirt/jacket on as opposed to a t shirt that easily rips) or any of the chokes that don't need you leveraging off the ground to apply them, i will admit that positional control is harder when you don't have the ground to force them against
you also have the throws that any grappling system may have
did you really mean to compare anything used in a kata to a tech. taht someone has practiced in an alive manner, plus you are comparing two trained fighters in a compitetion to someone USUALLY going against an untrained opponent on the street. From what i've read most people on this board, when talking about a street fight, assume that your opponent will be untrained
Also i think the knowledge a grappler would have of positional control would be a great asset when trying to apply these techniques on the street, especially in an art that trains to transition from one failed to another
So my original point was that there are a lot of kung fu/karate whatever people who think groundfighting is just like standing, only on the ground, so you can still do the punching and the kicking or whatever you like.
Saying that groundfighting moves work standing is pretty similar -- just because you can fight on the ground doesn't mean you can fight standing if you've never practiced it.
Now I wasn't saying that standing chokes and armlocks are not possible -- Yrkoon has some sort of really sneaky standing choke which is pretty sweet. But I would venture to guess that he has trained and practiced doing this standing.
Posted On:12/14/2005 6:10pm
my bro' who is a BB in isshinryu once sparred a bjj person who surprised the hell out of him by kicking him in the side of the head so my question: does bjj have such stand up techniques or was he using something else?
Posted On:12/14/2005 7:18pm
The first day of BJJ class is pulling guard. The second day teaches head kicks. So your brother faced a real life 2-day BJJ guy. Lucky he lived to tell about it.
Posted On:12/14/2005 7:28pm
thanks for telling me so what is bjj like? is it fun?
Posted On:12/14/2005 8:22pm
Style: Zen Bu Kan Kempo Karate
Originally Posted by EVIL ASIA
You are incorrect. TRADITIONAL Karate did NOT have the belt system. The belt system was created by Jigoro Kano, Judo Founder, and was IMPORTED in to GENDAI (MODERN) Karate. You had to EARN you belt in Judo the same way as you have to do in BJJ. If you are a BJJ BB you should be able to hold your own against other BB and OWN lower belts like Blues and Purples. The fact that live rolling and competition is a big part of the art is going to keep it on the up and up more than so called "traditional" arts.
Ever notice how things like Boxing, Wrestling, and Muay Thai don't succumb to complete BS? Thats because to call ourself a Boxer, Wrestler, etc means you are expected (or if retired was excepted) to pit your skills against another person, most times a complete stranger.
I was talking about after the belt system was introduced Im talking about how some instructors have taken shotokan. slapped a name before it and given people 1 year black belts. whats to say that this wont happen in BJJ
Posted On:12/14/2005 8:49pm
Style: BJJ, JKD Concepts, Kali
Fun? Fun? We don't need no stiknin' fun! BJJ sucks that's why so many of us do it...we're all complete masochists.
The test of a first-rate intelligence is the ability to hold two opposing ideas in mind at the same time and still retain the ability to function.
~F. Scott Fitzgerald
Whether it is a good thing or a bad thing, smashing things up is sometimes very pleasant.
Da Komrads... Again you are MadPelvisOwn3d!
Posted On:12/14/2005 9:55pm
Style: Spetsnaz Shovel-Fu
I was jumped several times by multiple opponents while living in Europe. What kept me from getting seriously injured was my grappling backround that allowed me to stay on my feet. Knowing all the kung fu/karate/jargon and nonsense in the world would not have helped me other than that. Getting jumped by more than three guys IS NOT the **** you do in the dojang. That is nothing more than controlled randori. Real people without skills bent on hurting you is a different animal entirely and = you cover, stay on your feet and get the **** outa dodge. This may be an oversimplification but that's the deal homie. Grappling can only help you more in this scenario.
BTW... this thread is like
To fight and conquer in all your battles is not supreme excellence;
Supreme excellence consists in breaking the enemy's resistance without spilling your Guinness.
Sun "Fu Man JhooJits" Tzu, the Art of War & Guinness
Posted On:12/14/2005 10:00pm
Originally Posted by Yrkoon9
It is a sneeky choke but it works. I use it all the time against guys. Unfortunately it only works once on them. Once they have had it applied to them they never fall for it again.
I recently used it in a match at my old school against a guy from the philipinnes. I choked him standing in under 3 seconds. Literally we shook hands, I took the back grip,applied the choke and he tapped.
I have an armbar that is very much the same. I can generally tap guys in under 10 seconds the first time we spar. After that, it rarely if ever works again. Sneaky shite is th3 BoMb!
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