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  1. Matt Bernius is offline

    Middleweight

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    Posted On:
    1/03/2006 2:31pm

    supporting member
     Style: Kung Fu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Actually it makes a lot of sense on a number of fronts. Ippon Shobu would tie into Funokosi's concept of "One hit. One kill." Considering it was Shotokan Japan that staged the first tourney's it fits nicely. Plus there were already preexisting Kendo contest rules which they probably piggybacked on.

    = Matt
    Student of Wan Yi Chuan Kung Fu,
    Kali, & what ever works
    Renaissance Martial Arts
    Rochester, NY
  2. CanucKyokushin is offline

    He'll flip ya!

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    Posted On:
    1/03/2006 2:35pm

    supporting member
     Style: Not.....working

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by king of seals
    Could fencing have some influence as well? A sort of first blood -> first strike "evolution"?
    More likely it came from the whole one punch/kill philosophie of alot of earlier martial arts systems .
  3. king of seals is offline

    HONEY BADGER!

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    Posted On:
    1/03/2006 2:43pm


     Style: Pankration

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I'm sure the one strike-one kill phylosophy came out from the Samurai duels.

    With a sword, you are likely to kill your opponent with a single slash and all Martial Arts aim to finish the fight ASAP, so... point sparring in unarmed MA as well!
  4. Zorbal is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/12/2006 8:35pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Isshinryu Karate

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I don't know if this helps you, but you might want to look into what Master Tatsuo Shimabuku was doing with his dojo in regards to sparring. From what I understand, he was the first of the Okinawan practitioners that had his students wear kendo protective gear so that they could do full contact sparring and actually put to use what they were learning.
  5. Blooming lotus is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/14/2006 4:03am


     Style: gongfu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Fairly interstedin this myself. I was speaking with an ma associate who's recently been competing in point fighting and sparring events and after chatting with him about it, I decided that it sounded alot like the reason for the padding and gloves etc was to enable an opportunity for tmaers coming from pressure point orientated systems to actually contact spar and retain base style in a ring capacity without the regular dangers of doing that .. hence the rules regarding striking to the head and knees to the torso and so on .....

    With 'that' in mind though, and being 'kalaripayattu' was the first fighting art to use pressure points , I have to believe that , while the Indians were probably all too wise and mediatated to get into non -essential drilling ( and that I haven't actually heard of non-traditional or ring combat mopdified kalripayattu) , and that despite early samurai efforts of fight training along similar lines, that that information didn't actually 'get' to Japan until some time later - to me elluding twd a chinese - vietnamise origin .......

    I'm not sure I'm buying the Karate root but when I get a chance I'm going to google a bit on it myself .... it definately sounds like a sweet approach to doing it in the ring. If anyone has any information pre-Japanese root - would definately appreciate the link.

    cheers and thx

    Blooming Lotus
  6. Vapour is offline

    Registered Member

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    Posted On:
    1/29/2006 6:59am


     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Origin of point sparing in martial arts is kendo (through judo).

    Judo introduced competitive sparing which proximate grappling combat. Ippon (one) originally represented valid take down, which is proximated to be the fight decider. This was followed by kendo. In kendo, ippon means a strike. If you score two ippon, you win. Gishin Funakoshi based shotokan karate sparing on kendo which is passed on to TKD which eventually evolved into olympic sport.

    The main issue is whether the sparing system is a good sport and/or good martial arts, something all system agonise over. Kendo, unlike olympic fencing is not a pure sport. Hitting/bashing object is different from slicing with sword so kendo Ippon must be good enough to be an approximation of sword strike, which is left at the descretion of refs. Most kendo people object to making kendo into pure sport. In original shotokan karate, sparing was non contact, that is a ref will decide whether non-contact (sundome) strike has been a proper strike. Though it sucks from sport point of view, it was valid from martial technique point of view. Alternatively you could pursue two extreme end of spectrum. One is full contact KO based system (kyokushin) which has no future as a mass sport. The other is padd protected point scoring system of TKD which suck as a martial arts.

    In my view, BJJ, despite being competitive and tough, actually suck as martial arts because the ground fighting isn't important in "real" fight and it is precisely for this reason judo restrict ground grappling. This issue been flamed repeatedly here. Still judo now have not only ippon but also wazaari, yukou and koka. It is possible to win olympic judo by exploiting this system. Many judo people consider that this is runing the art. Ippon Judo is a movement within judo to reverse this trend. In my view, judo come closest to solving the paradox of oxymoronic term, combat sport.

    Hope this help.
  7. Reboot is offline

    Registered Member

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    Posted On:
    2/07/2006 7:22pm


     Style: Five Animal Kenpo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Vapour
    [/b]In my view, BJJ, despite being competitive and tough, actually suck as martial arts because the ground fighting isn't important in "real" fight and it is precisely for this reason judo restrict ground grappling.[/b] This issue been flamed repeatedly here. Still judo now have not only ippon but also wazaari, yukou and koka. It is possible to win olympic judo by exploiting this system. Many judo people consider that this is runing the art. Ippon Judo is a movement within judo to reverse this trend. In my view, judo come closest to solving the paradox of oxymoronic term, combat sport.

    Hope this help.
    ... and the gates of Hell have been opened...
  8. Taekwon is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/07/2006 8:23pm


     Style: Taekwondo, Boxing (?)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    vapour = idiot

    tkd = full contact, continuous sparring

    point sparring = light contact, fighters separated after each point
  9. BackFistMonkey is online now
    BackFistMonkey's Avatar

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    Posted On:
    2/07/2006 8:26pm

    supporting member
     Style: Recovery-Fu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Taekwon
    vapour = idiot

    tkd = full contact, continuous sparring

    point sparring = light contact, fighters separated after each point
    Shut Up Janggoon .

    you are retarded .

    TKD =/= full contact , continuous sparring
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhi108 View Post
    Nuke a unborn gay whale for Christ.
    I don't mean to sound bitter, cold, or cruel, but I am, so that's how it comes out.
    BILL HICKS,
    1961-1994
  10. DerAuslander is offline
    DerAuslander's Avatar

    Valiant Monk of Booze & War

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    Posted On:
    2/07/2006 8:26pm

    supporting memberstaff
     Style: BJJ/C-JKD/KAAALIII!!!!!!!

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Is there any way to limit the History section to people commited to doing actual scholarly work and research, rather than just idiots who want to supply their baseless suppositions and flaunt their nutriding?

    Yes I mean both Vapour and Janggoon/Taekwon.
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